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Samsung 10.1 the last hope for android

The Samsung Galaxy Tab 8.9 and 10.1 versions are going to....hard to say this in a Mac forum...kill the iPad 2 in terms of customization and flexability
(like being able to play an HD video acquired outside from iTunes,
edit: manage the photos stored in the Photo app,
easy access to your Tablet without a program such as iTunes).

Of all the Apple advertisements aimed at the business world, i still can't visualize the iPad being easily used in that work environment. The fact that every file must be transferred via iTunes, means all work computers must have iTunes installed on their systems, which is really a hassle in my opinion. (Oh i forgot...you must have an Apple ID account too)

I'm really disappointed Apple has gone with the "trapping us into iTunes" method.

This is coming from a Mac user stating his opinions. Not an Android fanboy.
I own an iPhone 4 and Macbook pro 2011.
just in case =p
 
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Piggie said:
But people need to understand, what's in the best interest of the company, Apple. is not in the best interests of the consumer, you and me.
If anything they are at opposites. Having things open, and allowing consumers to flip and change what they want, gives the consumer the most options and flexibility, and totally against what the giant corporation wants, which is to make money.
Click to expand...

Trey are only making money because people decide that is what they want.

Customization and flexibility is nice, but sometimes it is better to have something that just works without having to fiddle with it. I used to do a lot of fiddling with my DOS machine back in the day, but having to go in and customize config.sys and autoexec.bat everytime I got a new program was not fun. Windows is better but at times you still have to tweak things just to make things fun because of the array of different hardware and software it can run on.

For my phone (and iPad) I don't want to have to fiddle with it to make things work or work well. I just want it to do what I want it to do and Apple's more closes system works very well for that. Having something that works and works well without having to fiddle with it is very useful for the consumer as well.
 
Krandor said:
Trey are only making money because people decide that is what they want.

Customization and flexibility is nice, but sometimes it is better to have something that just works without having to fiddle with it. I used to do a lot of fiddling with my DOS machine back in the day, but having to go in and customize config.sys and autoexec.bat everytime I got a new program was not fun. Windows is better but at times you still have to tweak things just to make things fun because of the array of different hardware and software it can run on.

For my phone (and iPad) I don't want to have to fiddle with it to make things work or work well. I just want it to do what I want it to do and Apple's more closes system works very well for that. Having something that works and works well without having to fiddle with it is very useful for the consumer as well.
Click to expand...

Yes, I agree, it's good to have this as an OPTION in the marketplace for those who want it. Like with Mac's now, it is good these products exist for those who wish to go down this route and not have to worry as one manufacturer is making all the hard choices for them and presenting them with a nice easy to use package.

I have no problem with that. As long as that's how it stays, just as an smaller market, side option for those who wish to go down this "controlled" route, and they can in time jump off the wagon, and come away from it in the future if they wish.

I just worry that younger generations, who know no better, and have a bigger picture of how we got to where we are today take more and more of the population down this road, which, whilst a great road to have as an option, should not be the main road computing takes.

We don't know for another 10 or 20 years how this turns out, but I just hope enough people don't go down this road, so that in 10 or 20 years time we look back to today and think how nice it was to have all the choices we enjoy and take for granted now.
 
Piggie said:
I have no problem with that. As long as that's how it stays, just as an smaller market, side option for those who wish to go down this "controlled" route, and they can in time jump off the wagon, and come away from it in the future if they wish.

I just worry that younger generations, who know no better, and have a bigger picture of how we got to where we are today take more and more of the population down this road, which, whilst a great road to have as an option, should not be the main road computing takes.
Click to expand...

It is up to the market and consumers to decide which they most want. You may think the controlled option should be the smaller market but doesn't mean it will be that way. In fact, I suspect it wont especially on the phone market. For phones people just want something that works and the number of people who want to customize it is small. I expect iPads to be similar. The desktop/laptop market will likely still be focused on much more customizable products since that is what people seem to most want in those markets.

Different markets want different products. Phones in particular are all about stability much more the customization.
 
Sigh, it just doesn't register with some people.

You say apple being locked down is bad. Most people disagree.

Apple have never changed stance on their walled garden. Sales are not decreasing because of it.

You say it's not what consumers want. You are wrong.

People don't care about customization on the level you think they do. Not on a tablet. A tablet is for fun and ease of use. I don't want to sit there and customize stuff on a tablet, I just want it to be there and work fast, every time.

YOU want customization, you and 100,000 other people. But 40 million people don't care, and are happy with a walled garden. Newsflash : apple don't care about you 100,000 other people, and neither do the 40,000,000 iPad owners.

A tablet is not a PC, people don't need them to be like a PC, but i shouldn't have to say this, it's obvious from sales.

(except widgets, I want widgets)
 
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Mac.World said:
I said last hope, because if these Android based tablets continue to fade into mediocrity, less and less people will want to buy them. People just can't see forking over $500 for less than stellar tablets, when they know they can get an iPad that works and works well.

In reality, Samsung and HP are the only two big name tablets running Honeycomb set to hit the market this year. If both are flops (like the Xoom), it's highly doubtful people will continue to maintain interest.

I want to like an Android tablet, I really do, and I want there to be some competition against the iPad. But I'll be damned if I am going to give any money to anyone other than Apple, until someone comes out with a quality tablet running Android. And the longer time goes on without one, the less inclined I am to want one. Keeping my fingers crossed for Samsung.
Click to expand...
IMO, I don't think people really know about them quite yet, especially since 3rd party development hasn't ramped up. It's not a sprint.
 
Dorkington said:
IMO, I don't think people really know about them quite yet, especially since 3rd party development hasn't ramped up. It's not a sprint.
Click to expand...

I disagree, I think people know about them, just like they knew other mp3 players existed when ipod ruled the land. I think people are aware of the differences in iphone vs android and it is pretty much understood that the tablet versions are ports of the phone versions....most people want the "Apple" experience and some wont and cant go the way of the iphone but can certainly get the iphone experience in the ipad....

developers are not going to waste their time with fly by night tablets, cost them too much time to port an app to android when they could be working on another app to release in ios. Its only when the apple app store get so saturated that some will look to the android store to pull in a few extra $$ faster....
 
Part of the problem with the iPad is misinformation and not understanding security. iTunes? Yep, activate and back up. There are dozens of apps that allow access to network resources. I have never purchased a movie, TV show, or any music from iTunes (I rip it all from physical disks that I have purchased) yet I have no problems accessing hundreds of hours of video without syncing with iTunes.

Walled garden ? I see Android headed in that direction. Not as 'bad' as Apple, but a lot closer. Android has been improving on the security front, but they still have a ways to go. Where is their hardware encryption ? (One of the reasons why you can only sync an iOS device with one computer.)

It was mentioned HP and Samsung were the only players releasing Honeycomb devices. Two questions, isn't HP's device WebOS, and what about the Asus convertible tablet ?
 
Steviolol said:
Sigh, it just doesn't register with some people.

You say apple being locked down is bad. Most people disagree.
...

YOU want customization, you and 100,000 other people. But 40 million people don't care, and are happy with a walled garden. Newsflash : apple don't care about you 100,000 other people, and neither do the 40,000,000 iPad owners.
Click to expand...

Couldn't agree more. XBox, Playstation, etc are all completely locked down devices limited to draconian rules yet most never call an XBox "walled garden." Same goes to Kindle, Nook, etc. Amazon exercises a complete control over its ereader but how many times people tout there should be an "open" Android alternative to Kindle?

People like "locked down" experience when it's well done and it's proven time and time again. Did those who call Apple draconian throw away their XBoxs and PlayStations in protest to Sony's strict control and licensing structure? I doubt they will tell you "Who cares about games or ebooks. All I want with my game console and ereader is to play free Adobe Flash games and tweak the heck out of the OS. " yet that's essentially what they are doing with the "apps are useless" argument regarding tablets.

I see it as a combination of anti-Apple crusade and the blind geek-ism. Now to be fair, I like geeky endeavors and believe there should be devices catering to tweaking and completely open experience. However IMHO that still doesn't make Android the best choice for mainstream users nor a morally superior choice as online commenters often assert.

If Google was completely open about Android development and it was done through a more impartial non-profit entity, I'd think differently but for now Android is really just a "Google OS with source available at Google's discretion."

edit: I forgot to mention that I don't think the "it's best to have choice" argument works when you simply cannot replicate the "walled garden" no matter how much you tweak and configure. For instance, Android users will claims the MIUI ROM will give you an iPhone experience. I have an Android phone (Samsung Galaxy S) and tried it. And on a still screen capture it might look superficially similar but once you scroll around and do things, it's nowhere as smooth as the iPhone nor does it have all the well thought out UI elements of the iPhone. It still feels very "Android" and yet some will claims "It's like iPhone but better"! Sure except you lose all the polish and smoothness of the iPhone.
 
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aneftp said:
Well yes and no on pricing.

While I agree with you that as we advance in technology prices will decline. But you get to a certain price point (read profit margin) where manufactures cannot afford to cheapen their product so much where they risk actually losing money on their products.

That's why full function laptops (that I actually consider usable). Those low end price points start around $500-600.

Netbooks price points are around $300 because they can't afford to cannibalize their low end full function laptops.

What manufacturers will start to do is just adding more "features' while keeping the price point with their comfortable profit margin.

Look at the original iPod. It sold for $399 for 5GB 10 years ago. Now the top of the line ipod touch 64GB still costs $399 but it offers so much in features (web browsing, touch screen, facetime etc).

So do I think tablets will get cheaper? Yes. Maybe we will start seeing Android tablets (not those clunky 2.2) but Android 3.0 and up tablets selling for $399 next year. But by that time, Apple may decide to keep a generation older model to sell for that same $399 price.

But I just don't see full functioning tablets dropping below $399 (without subsidies) in the foreseeable future.

It costs Apple around an estimated $230-270 just to manufacture the entry level $499 16BB ipad. And it costs around $300 to manufacturer an iPad 2. That's just for supplies and doesn't take into effect labor and advertising.

That's why Apple's gross profits for iPads are much less than their iPhones. It costs them $200 to make an iPhone which they in turn sell to cell phone carriers for an estimated $600.
Click to expand...

Next year for a $400 Android Honeycomb tablet? Try next month with the Asus Transformer. Looks reasonably nice. Glad to see the prices getting closer to where they should be.
 
andythursby said:
I can watch HD videos from outside iTunes in 3rd party apps or convert to mp4 and put on via iTunes.

I can edit photos in photoshop express, etc....
Click to expand...

Which 3rd party app are you using to play 720P MKVs? I've tried most of them and have had no success.
 
rk1985 said:
Next year for a $400 Android Honeycomb tablet? Try next month with the Asus Transformer. Looks reasonably nice. Glad to see the prices getting closer to where they should be.
Click to expand...

The question comes how many units will they need to sell at $400 to make their anticipated profit and can they do that? They is the issue especially for early tablets. If they cannot make enough of a profit a lot of companies may bail on the tablet market. Not all, but some.

The tablet market will likely in the end have only a few companies really competing.
 
Krandor said:
The tablet market will likely in the end have only a few companies really competing.
Click to expand...

I mildly disagree. It's not like the phone market, with ties to carriers and radios and all that. Tablets can be made by anybody with some backing, so I think there'll be a lot of makers ... although they may come and go :)

As far as iOS and Android tablets, I predict that the first one to implement a good easy multi-user UI, will win next Christmas's primary family sales spot. Of course, neither one might be smart enough to do it by then.
 
kdarling said:
I mildly disagree. It's not like the phone market, with ties to carriers and radios and all that. Tablets can be made by anybody with some backing, so I think there'll be a lot of makers ... although they may come and go :)

As far as iOS and Android tablets, I predict that the first one to implement a good easy multi-user UI, will win next Christmas's primary family sales spot. Of course, neither one might be smart enough to do it by then.
Click to expand...

Agreed.

Once the tech to make tablets, touch screens, batteries and the chipsets have reached a plateau, then we will see prices drop, as, like with a mini hifi system, anyone can put one together, and everyone from the poorest family to the richest will be able to afford tablets for all their family to own.

At the moment, the iPad is a luxury product, out of the reach of many families, and certainly not something they could buy for their children as gifts.

It will take a few years, but we shall get there.

Apple could always licence iOS so it becomes the OS for tablets of all prices and levels across the world for years to come, but they won't.

So that will fall to some other OS as they years go by. At the moment, we'll assume that will be some flavour of Android.
 
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