Samsung Takes 3% Stake in Sharp, Key Supplier of iPhone and iPad Screens

[spacepower7]

What makes you think that Apple doesn't already have a huge contractual investment in Sharp? One that controls Sharp more than a mere 3% investment?

It's been speculated that Apple actually buys and owns some of the machines in Sharp LCD factories. The last estimate I read was about $2 Billion worth of machinery. Samsung wont be getting any LCDs made on those machines.

With that in mind, it makes sense for Samsung to invest in buying machines on another production line in a Sharp factory to secure shipments.

Apple did the same, invested $100 Million in Samsung in 1999 to secure quanties of LCDs.

This is a non news story. It's business as usual.

 

[thadoggfather]

I hope Sharp becomes Apple's main display supplier.

LG is really not up to par and across the whole product line pretty much.

 

[HockeyMike]

Does this sound like a long term agreement to anyone else?

In the tech industry it's similar to dog years [1=7].

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I'm not sure why the FTC would be concerned if a TV brand vendor actually made their own TVs. It's been done before.

But they could use front companies like say FoxConn or one of their own subsidiaries.

I think Samsung is getting worried about Apple producing a true TV and encroaching upon there share of that market. Apple is way ahead of Samsung on content and deals with the entertainment industry and I think that is scaring Samsung who ranks #1 in TV sales with LG at #2.

 

[Jaro65]

I think I'd feel slightly better about Apple if they were even making bad decisions; right now they seem to be making no decisions.

Wouldn't you want to be a fly on the wall at Tim's office? We don't know what he's thinking and planning. Though I do agree with you: so much cash, and apparent lack of ability or desire to use it for their strategic advantage.

 

[tdtran1025]

LOL, they both are now courting the same girl whose family was nearly bankrupt a short time ago. Who brings more gift?

 

[G4DP]

Apple inc 550 billion usd
Samsung group is not a traded company. Well bring together all Samsung companies and they are still at 350 billion
Apple inc is the world's second most valuable company. Get your facts straight.

You haven't got a clue have you.

Apple are one trick ponies, they are in a single area, technology. There perceived value is worth sod all, they don't have assets or the revenue to be worth the current stock price, let alone the stupid heights it reached.

They are worth about $450 a share. The only reason they are worth so much is because they keep making shares out of thin air when it's exec bonus time.

Samsung are invloved in almost every major industry that exists.

If Samsung put it's mind to it it could crush Apple.

 

[Tigger92]

Samsung electronics, not Samsung group. The group is over 2 trillion.

And unless Apple is releasing a 4K set they are late to the game.

I think the problem is that you have been talking South Korean Won, not dollars. Need to divide by 1091.98 Won to get current dollars.

If you do this, then Samsung does not look nearly as strong or as high valued.

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You haven't got a clue have you.

Apple are one trick ponies, they are in a single area, technology. There perceived value is worth sod all, they don't have assets or the revenue to be worth the current stock price, let alone the stupid heights it reached.

They are worth about $450 a share. The only reason they are worth so much is because they keep making shares out of thin air when it's exec bonus time.

Samsung are invloved in almost every major industry that exists.

If Samsung put it's mind to it it could crush Apple.

You clearly don't understand what the phrase "one-trick Pony" means. If this were actually true, then I guess we would never have gotten an iPod, iPhone, iPad....not to mention the the entire Mac platform. According to you, Apple would have failed and never come back after the Apple II.

 

[lazard]

I think the problem is that you have been talking South Korean Won, not dollars. Need to divide by 1091.98 Won to get current dollars.

If you do this, then Samsung does not look nearly as strong or as high valued.

MacNut missed a couple of zeros. The market cap for Samsung Electronics is approximately 229.7 trillion won, which works out to roughly $212B.

 

[brdeveloper]

I don't understand why Apple doesn't take, say, a 30% stake in Sharp... done.

Well, if buying 1% of Sharp shares in one day/week/month would cost, let's say, US$ 200 millions, buying 30% wouldn't be equal to 30x 200 millions. Actually, it would cost a lot more, because of an instant value increase on its per-share value.

 

[Mr Bigs]

Interesting move by Samsung. Maybe little moves like this might wake the sleeping bear at Apple again???? I hope so.

Apple was never the sleeping bear,the tech industry was and Apple kept poking it. Now what happens when you keep poking a sleeping bear ????

 

[thewordiz]

Look here

Revenue is what they earned, assets is what they are worth.

I got ya both. Two real diehard "APPLE' fan boys. Listen and so you get this straight, and don't go outside this forum and embarras yourself.

Revenue, is TOTAL SALES or GROSS Receipts.
Profit is what they EARN from those sales
Assets are what the company OWNS, including cash, Accounts receivable, fixtures, Real Property, inventory, parts and so on.

so you 2 can brush up and argue on a level laying field. Accounting 101

http://www.sec.gov/investor/pubs/begfinstmtguide.htm

Now to the problem of discussion;

You are both fighting over numbers which are incomparable if you DO NOT convert the currency. 201 Trillion Korean WON is $185,169,740 US Dollars (that's $185 Billion USD,) which is how Apple reports their financials. So 4thQ 2012 Apple reported REVENUE of $156.5 Billion USD with earnings of $41.7 Billion

read it right here. But do the conversions otherwise you will continue to confound yourself and others with your battle of wits

https://www.macrumors.com/2012/10/2...n-revenue-tops-150b-in-sales-for-fiscal-2012/

Lastly, I understand what you are saying about Samsung and different corporations. Just like iTunes could be a separate entity unto itself. But they include it in the total revenue numbers for the Company.

Suffice it to say as we got away from the initial discussion. I believe it would have been prudent for Apple to make an arrangement with Sharp, and through in a couple hundred mill even a Bill (since they have about 130 of em) and block Samsung out.

 

[Glideslope]

It's been speculated that Apple actually buys and owns some of the machines in Sharp LCD factories. The last estimate I read was about $2 Billion worth of machinery. Samsung wont be getting any LCDs made on those machines.

With that in mind, it makes sense for Samsung to invest in buying machines on another production line in a Sharp factory to secure shipments.

Apple did the same, invested $100 Million in Samsung in 1999 to secure quanties of LCDs.

This is a non news story. It's business as usual.

Actually, a little bit North of $2 Billion.

 

[iphoneclassic]

It's been speculated that Apple actually buys and owns some of the machines in Sharp LCD factories. The last estimate I read was about $2 Billion worth of machinery.

$2 Billion was just customer cash advance for LCDs Sharp going to supply. It was not a capital investment. If Samsung purchased 3% for $110 Million, for $2 Billion Apple should own more than 50% of Sharp.

 

[Applefanboy8153]

You haven't got a clue have you.

Apple are one trick ponies, they are in a single area, technology. There perceived value is worth sod all, they don't have assets or the revenue to be worth the current stock price, let alone the stupid heights it reached.

They are worth about $450 a share. The only reason they are worth so much is because they keep making shares out of thin air when it's exec bonus time.
Samsung are invloved in almost every major industry that exists.

If Samsung put it's mind to it it could crush Apple.

Name Value Rank on Forbes list (Rank Based on Assets)
Samsung Electronics- 162 Billion 26
Samsung life Insuarance- 17.1B 236
Samsung Fire and Marine- 8.8B 640
Samsung C&T- 10.6B 757
Samsung Heavy Industries 8.2B 774
Samsung Engineering 8.7B 1214
Samsung Electro-
Mechanics- 6.5B 1766
Samsung Card- 4.6B 1816

I have listed their current Market Value. The Ranks are based on their Assets though.
Apple- 546B ranked no 22 (Assets Based) Ranked -2 (Value based)

Now do your additions and the Samsung Group is Valued at 226B (Approx) That is just over half of Apple's value. Asset based apple may be behind samsung though, I agree. But Samsung just cant do Anything against Apple as they are valued at just over half of Apple!

Assets- Samsung group- 184B
Apple- 176B

 

[didgeridoo]

Did you forget Microsoft invested in Apple for $150 million in 1997?

http://news.cnet.com/2100-1001-202143.html

Not the same. It would be more like MS buying part of Motorola (for the cpus) and nothing of Apple.

 

[junior]

Why? 3% won't give them much say in it.

It makes them the third biggest shareholder of Sharp.

 

[spacepower7]

$2 Billion was just customer cash advance for LCDs Sharp going to supply. It was not a capital investment. If Samsung purchased 3% for $110 Million, for $2 Billion Apple should own more than 50% of Sharp.

Hmm, 2 billion is much more than a cash advance. Nobody pays a $2 billion advance without owning the assets. Be reasonable.


Apple gives Sharp (near bankruptcy) $2 Billion to purchase new machines dedicated to making Apple products, rather than promising $2 billion to Sharp in 6 months. In that situation, Sharp would have to borrow high interest loans from banks that don't have much faith in Sharp.

Apple is cutting out the high interest loan payment by fronting Sharp the money. Saving Sharp and securing products.

The reason you are misunderstanding this is bc is it is rarely done in business.

 

[Mac Kiwi]

Well Apple has twice as much in profits! So if apple want to take over Samsung they can as Apple would need less than 10% stake in Samsung to gain control destroy and then just destroy Samsung!

Apple may not even have enough money for 10% of Samsung.....Samsung build just about anything you can think of.


South Korean government would never let Apple get a foothold in Samsung either.

 

[iphoneclassic]

Hmm, 2 billion is much more than a cash advance. Nobody pays a $2 billion advance without owning the assets. Be reasonable.


Apple gives Sharp (near bankruptcy) $2 Billion to purchase new machines dedicated to making Apple products, rather than promising $2 billion to Sharp in 6 months. In that situation, Sharp would have to borrow high interest loans from banks that don't have much faith in Sharp.

Apple is cutting out the high interest loan payment by fronting Sharp the money. Saving Sharp and securing products.

The reason you are misunderstanding this is bc is it is rarely done in business.

This was discussed in detail few months back on the forum. You are bringing up new theory again.

Apple cannot invest(buy equipment) 2 billion in a (near bankruptcy) Sharp without notifying SEC. What you are claiming is illegal. Because Sharp is a supplier they can give cash advance. Both options are risky. Lets assume Apple bought machinery is at Sharp manufacturing plant. Do you think Sharp's creditors will allow Apple to just move the machinery out in case of bankruptcy. Because Apple is in an epic fight with Samsung, it has no option other than beefing up cash flow of Sharp.

 

[mapledress]

First Samsung copies Apple's products and now they copy the strategy of securing parts. What next?

Nice. But we should admit that Samsung made a big success by this way. And they are trying to put more effort on innovation.

 

[Solomani]

the article you quoted is in KRW. South Korean Won. You are still kinda correct
total companies together are worth more than Apple, but broken apart they are not. I think, but hey. The only bank account I look at is mine, and it is relatively small compared to either of them.

But it's silly to even compare Apple's revenues and market performance with the entire Samsung conglomerate group which includes (among other things) a Korean insurance company, and also includes ownership of zoos in South Korea. Really, Apple is not trying to compete in the insurance industry or zoo theme park industry.

Let's just stick to comparing Apple with its head-to-head peer rival, the Samsung Electronics group.


Wikipedia: Everland

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Everland

Everland Resort is a theme park in Yongin, a city in Gyeonggi-do province, South Korea. Everland is South Korea's largest theme park. With 6.6 million visitors, Everland ranked thirteenth in the world for amusement park attendance in 2011. Along with its main attractions, Everland also includes a zoo and a water park known as Caribbean Bay. Everland is operated by Samsung Everland, which is a subsidiary of the Samsung Group.

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Apple may not even have enough money for 10% of Samsung.....Samsung build just about anything you can think of.

South Korean government would never let Apple get a foothold in Samsung either.

And this is one of the reasons Samsung will always "win" over any American corporation. Samsung is supported almost subsidized by the entire might of the South Korean government (Samsung is represented by numerous officials in government). Meanwhile, the US Government does its very best to screw and tax-to-death large US corporations (Apple included), forcing all of them to relocate many of their operations overseas.

 

[AppleScruff1]

Sounds like Samsung is trying to buy competition (Apple supplier). Playing their cards deviously but rewarding.

How is that devious? Isn't it just good business?

 

[Stosh68]

How is that devious? Isn't it just good business?

C'mon, that's not how these forums work.

If a company did something before Apple, it never happened. When Apple does it, they invented it. When another company does it, they copied Apple.

That's how this forum works.

 

[hchung]

Sounds like Samsung is trying to buy competition (Apple supplier). Playing their cards deviously but rewarding.

That's just conspiracy theory.

The real reason is simpler.

Sharp's the current technical leader in LCD technology.
Samsung's the current technical leader in OLED technology.

Samsung needs Sharp for better TVs. Sharp has financial problems. So throwing money at the problem is a win-win. It ends there. It has nothing to do with Apple because it's not even concerning the same technologies under the LCD category.

Just because Samsung makes a part with a certain technology, doesn't mean they actually use it in their products. I know it sounds dumb, but it's true. And it's normal.

 

[spacepower7]

This was discussed in detail few months back on the forum. You are bringing up new theory again.

Apple cannot invest(buy equipment) 2 billion in a (near bankruptcy) Sharp without notifying SEC. What you are claiming is illegal. Because Sharp is a supplier they can give cash advance. Both options are risky. Lets assume Apple bought machinery is at Sharp manufacturing plant. Do you think Sharp's creditors will allow Apple to just move the machinery out in case of bankruptcy. Because Apple is in an epic fight with Samsung, it has no option other than beefing up cash flow of Sharp.

What I am speculating is that Apple owns some of the machines in a Sharp factory. They are owned by Apple NOT Sharp.

Sharp's creditors can't touch those machines, they are legally owned by Apple. Apple has every right to move those machines out of Sharp's factories at anytime, even if Sharp goes bankrupt. It's not like repoing cars on TV shows.

I don't understand what is illegal.