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Actually you can use it for bar codes. Continental and Delta have pilot plans for you to use the boarding pass barcode on your phone to scan and go onto the plane. I was tempted to try and use it last time I flew them, BUT at the time it was only a week old and I assumed I might have a problem getting through security screening with only my phone! Phone has to go thru xray, but you need to keep the boarding pass with you as you walk through metal detector???:confused:

American Airlines does it too, the thing is that is a different type of 'barcode' and needs a different type of scanner (basically a camera) , so if the place the OP has a CCD scanner then it would scan fine, if not sure OP then is a risk...
 
I'm not sure if it's been answered correctly yet but the definitive answer is...


- Laser scanners are hit and miss. Unlikely to work.

- Optical scanners work every time.

Before I use my iPhone to show my AirMiles, I look at the scanner theyre using. It's pretty easy to see if it's a laser or optical scanner.

iPhone 4 might offer better results with a laser scanner because the screen is much closer to the glass.
 
Great thread... there's a lot of valuable information and clarification of the technology here and it's appreciated.

I am also a "barcode expert*" but most of my experience dates back to the 1d (vertical bars) times beginning with wands and it's pretty much a given that the screens will not do an acceptable job of reflecting back the b/w reflections of of any pda. The "camera" approach makes sense but is also going to be impacted by the reflections from the scanner or other light off of the glass.

A device such as a box that takes a picture of a backlit screen makes sense, but, remember that apple is going to throw in it's own difficulties such as screen orientation as you put the pda on the device and auto dimming.

It's unfortunate that the tech arena's are so driven by the past... barcodes have been printed on paper, so, now the industry prints them on the screen because it's familiar.

Makes a lot more tech sense to use blutooth, wifi or even screen pulsing to send simple info which the machines would have no problem receiving.

Beverly Howard

* definition of "expert" by word structure...
...ex = "has been"
...spurt = "drip under pressure"
 
Have you tried the app Cardstar? It allows you to put membership cards on your iPhone with bar codes.

Yes, I use that app. I have a 50/50 hit ration with the clerks being able or being unable to scan the barcode. Depends, IMHO, on the scanning hardware (handheld or otherwise) the particular retail establishment is using.
 
Just thinking out loud... wondering if a red instead of white background might make a difference for on screen barcodes since red is normally the illumination color.

>> Cardstar <<

I am going to give that a shot as well. Will report back.

>> Code type Decode <<

Does anyone know of an (easy) way to determine the code type of a bar?

The reason for that question is that knowing that would make it easier to reproduce, by regeneration, sharp barcodes for onscreen use.

A related factoid... it would then be possible to screensnap (hold power, tap action multiple times until camera noise is heard) to get a copy of a generated bar.

Thanks,
Beverly Howard
 
>> (easy) way to determine the code type of a bar? <<

Answered my own question...

Cardstar's format selection does it.

Make a custom "(other)" entry

enter the barcode number.

Select encoding

As you scroll the format options, each one shows that number encoded in that format... matching is then easy.

Hope that this information is of value.
Beverly Howard
 
Update

Learned a lot in the past few days... actually surprised that scanning barcodes off of a pda screen is possible at all.

I downloaded and installed CardStar and entered a number of codes. These range from grocery, to library, memberships and I even entered the code on the back of my driver's license.

With apple iOS devices, earlier is better. There is a problem reading scans off of the "retina displays" of the iPhone4 and iTouch 4gen. I ran some tests using a second gen iTouch and a fourth gen iTouch and scanning worked consistently on the older iTouch and never succeeded on the 4gen with retina display.

The numbers printed below the barcodes are not necessarily valid. For example, the driver's license bar contained seven additional digits (not check digits) so, having the ability to scan the bar you are working with is valuable.

CardStar's symbology encoding tool in the edit section is a great resource. I will note that getting into each card's "edit" screen had problems... often the edit button would simply be non responsive, but I finally found that exiting the app and restarting it would then allow edits.

Entering card info can be tedious. Select "Other" once you determine that the card issuer is not in the CardStar listings. After entering the info, the symbology encoding tool is essential... note that the tool displays the bar format of the number entered so you can make an exact match when selecting codes.

Watch for format errors... one of my entries (Golds Gym) was in the listings, but the bar format did not match the bar format on the card. (the card used code128) It could be that the code was changed and the readers will accept both formats.

Note that most readers are setup by default to read multiple formats. In my work, we found it necessary to program the scanners to only read and respond to the code we used for printing labels... for example, we tracked one problem down to people scanning upc barcodes on coke cans when they got bored.

Hope that this information is of value.
Beverly Howard
 
were you able to use a store scanner to scan codes from your iphone?? store scanners are usually laser and not CCD. I'll be surprised if the laser scanners at the store actually works. Please let me know if that's the case, that's a nice surprise!
 
>> I'll be surprised if the laser scanners at the store actually works <<

Works with the older (non retina) display devices... i.e. everything except the iphone4 and 4th gen itouch.

>> Agreed, don't risk it if it's really critical. <<

Not sure what this references.

Beverly Howard
 
Reflective vs. Transmissive

This is an old thread, but in case anybody is strolling through this and still wondering....

You have to understand how an LCD, like a phone, works. LCD screens use a bright white light behind the screen. This light is then passed through a linear polarizer that ensures all the light is polarized horizontally.

The front layer of the screen (just behind the glass) is another linear polarizer, except vertical.

If you just pass light through a horizontal, then vertical polarizer, none of it will make it through. The liquid crystal element turns the polarization a quarter of the way around when a pixel is turned on.

Now hypothetically, if you had the scanner at just the right angle, those pixels that were turned on could transmit light all the way to the backplane, which would be slightly reflective and transmit the laser light all the way back. But it's not a mirror back there: the reflection of the glass at the front is probably going to be brighter.

This is why people are universally saying that laser barcode readers don't seem to work on LCD screens. A camera is different, because it sees transmitted light just like our eye. A barcode relies on reflected light to bounce back off the white part of the paper.

It's basically identical to the reason why you can't just turn your laptop display all the way down to zero and use sunlight. If you struggle hard you might slightly make out the image, but not enough to make it useful.


All the new electronic ink displays, like the Kindle, are a different story. They have no backlighting or polarization scheme, and rely on small, electrically charged capsules of ink sitting inside an oily medium. There are black capsules that absorb light and white capsules that reflect light, and they switch using an electric field. These reflect light just like paper does.

This is why you'd have no difficulty scanning barcodes off a Kindle using a laser. (And yes, you could use a camera too: if your eyes can see it, so can a camera scanner.)
 
Excellent details... appreciated.

>> This is why people are universally saying that laser barcode readers don't seem to work on LCD screens. <<

Since you seem to be well versed in this subject, perhaps you can address an interesting difference between old and new iOS devices, specifically those with and those without the "Retina" displays.

Laser scanners worked fairly well scanning barcodes displayed the older iOS, non retina, _LCD_ screens.

In general they normally take a little longer to recognize a traditional (vertical bar) barcode displayed onscreen, but it is reliable enough to use instead of carrying barcodes printed on paper or plastic.

By contrast, I have never seen any barcode on any of the newer devices with the LCD "retina" displays successfully scan using a laser scanner... any ideas on why the difference and how it might be addressed?

Beverly Howard
 
My BA check-in app scanned fine on recent Heathrow-Denver flight. Only two problems

1. They said we had to turn phones off before boarding the big metal bird and then wanted to see the boarding pass at the door.
2. Check-in lady accessed my Facebook app during check-in process and fraped me.

Seriously, issue 2 was the app screen rotated a couple of times while she was trying to get it under the scanner.
 
>> My BA check-in app scanned fine on recent Heathrow-Denver flight. <<

fwiw, almost all of the barcode readers in use where images on screen are expected are "photographic" rather than the laser scanners which are "reflective" and they work well with barcodes displayed on screen.

The newer "square" QR barcodes made up of blocks rather than bars work really well in both directions on iOS devices since their readers and devices simply use camera images to read and map the codes.

Hope that this information is of value.
Beverly Howard
 
This is an old thread, but in case anybody is strolling through this and still wondering....<snip>

A camera is different, because it sees transmitted light just like our eye. A barcode relies on reflected light to bounce back off the white part of the paper.

So, would you say that all of these scanners that are working everyday reading barcodes from iPhones are actually using cameras instead of laser scanning?
 
>> So, would you say that all of these scanners that are working everyday reading barcodes from iPhones are actually using cameras instead of laser scanning? <<

There are several different scanner technologies and the laser scanners are at the bottom of the list for reading off of an iPhone screen, especially the newest iPhone/iTouch models. I'm not sure I can do a decent job of explaining the differences, but, will try.

The laser scanners create one or more red "lines" from a beam that scans back an forth. Within the scanner is a sensor that is receptive specifically to the light frequency of the laser so it can sense the dark/light reflections from only the current location of the scan beam's "spot" as the beam moves across the code at a steady known rate resulting in the read problems noted above.

Similar in appearance are "CCD" readers that illuminate a band using the glow of multiple (usually red) led's. These use a broad area optical sensor rather than the point sensor used in the laser scanners, so, since they are more "camera like" they do a better job reading a barcode displayed on an LCD screen. One problem with these readers is that they have a "fixed field" for reading, so, if the bar is larger than the illuminated field (likely on a long bar on a landscape screen) it will fail.

"Camera" readers are becoming more common... look for a more general illumination method. It's ironic that the iPhone or iTouch carried by a high percentage of customers can scan bars as reliably as most store scanners as well as do a better job of scanning onscreen bars that the store scanners can.

If you are interested in this, there are now an increasing number of bar code apps... i.e. CardStar for displaying bars, and RedLaser or Bakodo for reading striped bars.

Beverly Howard
 
. A camera is different, because it sees transmitted light just like our eye. A barcode relies on reflected light to bounce back off the white part of the paper.

really? So when a camera takes a photo of me (and not many do) it is seeing light transmitted through or from me rather than light reflected off me?
 
>> ...rather than light reflected off me? <<

Touche... with cavaets.

The laser scanners are pretty old designs with no computing power in the receivers that essentially collect sequential pulses of light and dark along the narrow line created by the beam. If you have ever stood in a checkout line, you know they frequently have problems sorting out reflections coming back from black and white paper.

Since the iPhone screen is not "reflective" the sensor gets almost no information back from the laser beam who's light frequency the sensor is relying on to detect pulses.

I have scanners that have a more restricted receptor. They contain a moving mirror that both transmits the beam out and a sensor that uses the mirrors current position to look only where the beam is aimed to detect reflected light levels cutting out almost all reflected light from other sources.

Beverly Howard
 
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