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Palad1 said:
DISCLAIMER I'm an atheist, although I worship Descartes ;)

What happens during teleportation? Some atoms are moved from point A to point B in a defined timespan. An object X which, at a time T was at the point A, is translated to point B, at T+Delta

Let's assume all the atoms are located at the right place, all the quarks are where they should be, every spin is intact and the energy levels are unchanged between X@(T) and X@(T+Duration).

So, the question is, what happens during the Delta timespan? Are your atoms transmitted serially, 8 at a time, in other words, what is the bandwitdth of this thing?

If the bandwidth is not infinite, Delta will be > 0 then that means that between T and T+Delta, X will not be coherent, instead we will have parts of X at point A, and parts of X at point B.

The religious types will ask: Between T and T+Duration, where is your soul? What happens to it after T+Duration?

The pragmatic types will ask: If your atoms are moving at the speed of light, what will happen while your brain gets transported? Do you stop thinking? What happens to the thoughts you have during transportation? Are you still the same person?

Of course, the gamers will say that all the answers are already known, but they are a loony bunch.

My response to QuarterSwede was because he/she seemed so certain that life cannot withstand teleportation, regardless of whether or not a body has a soul. He/she also offered no solid explanation of why he/she believes that. You, on the other hand, did a great job of integrating mathematics into everyday English ;)

I see exactly what you're saying, and I agree with your conclusion that we just don't know enough about it to say what will or will not happen.

Any sort of time-lag between different parts of the brain or body being transported would obviously create some sort of hiccup in the system. If the time-lag is within certain tolerances, I'm pretty sure living things could handle it without too many ill-effects.
 
Abstract said:
I don't want to have all the atoms that make up all the cells in my body teleported somewhere without an ability to put all my fracking atoms back together to form cells, and those cells to form me.

Otherwise, you're essentially turning me into a bag of sand ---- loose atoms that make up nothing coherent.


But think about how easy it would be to travel to Easter Island or something --- wherever you wish!


or if your late to class! i would then wake up 5 min before class began
 
Teleportation Breakthru

Important Breaking News
the bridge...
the bridge boss...

Link = http://www.physorg.com/news79265847.html

from 8 hours ago...



Oct 5, 2006
Nature Magazine
Earth
Thursday
Noon

Basically what the experiment did is "bridge" a
fundemental "gap" or "problem" between matter and light...
In essense thus a fundemental method or means of communication
between matter and light has been found or established.
This would seem to be a water shed mark in quantum physics
that has the potential to change the face of history at some or many levels. While it does not exactly mean teleportation or transporters it does lay some "ground" work for them and hearlds the development of a "unprecidented repeatable method or means of such".


Hmm
the syncronicity is some what suspect
as this has occurred precisely around or on
the 40th anniversary of Star Trek the
series lauched in 1966 AD where the concept
of teleportation and transporters were first introduced to the
general TV viewing audience.
Well ho hum perhaps
life is but a dream

carry on...

sir ed
 
swanny said:
Important Breaking News
the bridge...
the bridge boss...

Link = http://www.physorg.com/news79265847.html

from 8 hours ago...



Oct 5, 2006
Nature Magazine
Earth
Thursday
Noon

Basically what the experiment did is "bridge" a
fundemental "gap" or "problem" between matter and light...
In essense thus a fundemental method or means of communication
between matter and light has been found or established.
This would seem to be a water shed mark in quantum physics
that has the potential to change the face of history at some or many levels. While it does not exactly mean teleportation or transporters it does lay some "ground" work for them and hearlds the development of a "unprecidented repeatable method or means of such".


Hmm
the syncronicity is some what suspect
as this has occurred precisely around or on
the 40th anniversary of Star Trek the
series lauched in 1966 AD where the concept
of teleportation and transporters were first introduced to the
general TV viewing audience.
Well ho hum perhaps
life is but a dream

carry on...

sir ed

Interesting!

swanny said:
precisely around

I also love it when people use word combinations like that ;) :eek: Sorry, couldn't resist, hahaha...
 
Twins

"precisely around"
A trick from "law" school.

anyway

back to the topic...

The means by which it is done
is apparently through "entanglement"
between two different objects or ? therebye
creating two similiar "twins" which can
thus be teleported via quantum and classical
methods and both speed/spin "and" location be retained
and known.

Ingenious
 
A Crude Example

Okay a rough example
say you have a quart of jello which can
be transported via a medium
and a guart of sand which can't normally be
transported by that medium.
What you do is "entangle" the jello with
the sand and you have 2 quarts of jello/sand
mix or "twins" which can now be transported through
the medium. One is your "locale" source per sae
and the other your speed or spin source
but they're both identical.
Or something to that effect.
then I suppose you unentangle them
and walla the sand has moved 18 inches
thru a wire.

Disclaimer
Do not try this at home or with your pets or with yourself
swanny or macrumors will not be held responsible
for the creation of puddles of protoplasm
that may be created by this method.
Seek professional advice from your local
nobel prize physisist before engaging in such activity.
 
These problems are all taken care of by the mid 22nd Century using Heisenberg Compensators,
 
Well...

Spock said:
These problems are all taken care of by the mid 22nd Century using Heisenberg Compensators,

Well the method of "entangling" or "twinizing" two different objects
seems to solve the two state problem.
Don't know about the Heisenberg compensator and if it would be
possible to entangle "living matter", though there may be a slight probability
but I think I'd rather take a cab.

OUOTE =Wikipedia:In the fictional Star Trek universe, the Heisenberg compensators are part of the transporter system.

A Star Trek matter transporter is presumed to operate by reading the precise quantum state of every particle making up the person to be transported, transmitting this information to a receiver, and then reassembling the person from this information. However, in quantum physics, the Heisenberg uncertainty principle states (in general terms) that one cannot know the quantum state of a subatomic particle to arbitrary precision. Therefore, matter transportation in this way should be impossible.

Luckily, by Star Trek's 24th century, this is no longer a problem, thanks to the use of Heisenberg compensators. It is unclear how exactly the Heisenberg compensators work. It is, of course, possible that they do not actually tell you the precise statistics of each particle; they could just compensate for not being able to know them.

When asked "How do the Heisenberg compensators work?" by Time magazine on 28th November 1994, Michael Okuda, technical advisor on Star Trek, famously responded, "They work just fine, thank you."

It might be argued that one can have either the working device or the explanation for how the device works, but not both. UNQUOTE
 
elfin buddy said:
My response to QuarterSwede was because he/she seemed so certain that life cannot withstand teleportation, regardless of whether or not a body has a soul. He/she also offered no solid explanation of why he/she believes that. You, on the other hand, did a great job of integrating mathematics into everyday English ;)

I see exactly what you're saying, and I agree with your conclusion that we just don't know enough about it to say what will or will not happen.

Any sort of time-lag between different parts of the brain or body being transported would obviously create some sort of hiccup in the system. If the time-lag is within certain tolerances, I'm pretty sure living things could handle it without too many ill-effects.

Thank you.
By the way, this is the last time I'll ever post while intoxicated ;)
 
Friday

Oct. 6, 2006
Earth
Friday
Dawn

Teleportation Breakthru

Okay now today they're saying that the "original" object
would be or is "destroyed" in the process. I would contend that
"moving" or teleporting an object is not destroying it
but that it would simple move or "vanish" from the point of origin. This just goes to highlight the significance of this
experiment. It is not simply a copy paste exercise but an actual teleportation of matter or a "physical" object.
Again whether you could entangle or "twinize" "living matter"
is a whole other "mission critical" matter or question.
 
elfin buddy said:
My response to QuarterSwede was because he/she seemed so certain that life cannot withstand teleportation, regardless of whether or not a body has a soul. He/she also offered no solid explanation of why he/she believes that. You, on the other hand, did a great job of integrating mathematics into everyday English ;)

I see exactly what you're saying, and I agree with your conclusion that we just don't know enough about it to say what will or will not happen.

He did, indeed, offer a great explanation. Unfortunately, it lacks the same proof that I didn't offer. The only difference is he sounded smart while I chose the simple route and actually decided to pick a side.

Any sort of time-lag between different parts of the brain or body being transported would obviously create some sort of hiccup in the system. If the time-lag is within certain tolerances, I'm pretty sure living things could handle it without too many ill-effects.
This is the reason I prefer the "it will never work" side of things. I'm not against trying to get it to, I just believe it won't because life systems are very sensitive. For instance, if the electrical impulses being sent from the brain to the heart cease (a flat line), your dead. No amount of shocking the heart will make it start beating again because the impulses just aren't being sent (and we don't know how to get them to start again). Sure matter can be transported* but what about things in motion? Will that motion be preserved?

*So far its not even transportation but a facsimile with the original object being destroyed.
 
Can someone who understands M-theory explain something to me please?

As I understand it there are seven tightly rolled up spatial dimensions in addition to the three rolled out ones. How does the rolled up space relate to the rolled out? Does every point* in the rolled out spatial universe share the same common location in the seven rolled up ones or are there an infinite number of small seven-dimensional locations, each independent of the others?

If it's the former, would it mean we could instantly teleport anywhere in the universe by manipulating which of the 10 dimensions our sub-atomic particles are vibrating in?

*yeah, I know it's not actually a point, but I'll use the word here
 
QuarterSwede said:
He did, indeed, offer a great explanation. Unfortunately, it lacks the same proof that I didn't offer. The only difference is he sounded smart while I chose the simple route and actually decided to pick a side.


This is the reason I prefer the "it will never work" side of things. I'm not against trying to get it to, I just believe it won't because life systems are very sensitive. For instance, if the electrical impulses being sent from the brain to the heart cease (a flat line), your dead. No amount of shocking the heart will make it start beating again because the impulses just aren't being sent (and we don't know how to get them to start again). Sure matter can be transported* but what about things in motion? Will that motion be preserved?

*So far its not even transportation but a facsimile with the original object being destroyed.

ah lets get the language and meanings "right" here then
A facsimile is a paper copy, legal mind you,
A clone is a duplicate of a living entity
and a replicate is a fundemental basic copy of static or dead matter.
So would it be safe to say that what they might actually have done here
is create a star trek type "replicator" and not a "transporter".
The dif being that a replication is a quatumn "copy" or such and teleportation is more critical quantum "movement".

or so...

well this is getting confusing so what is it...
what did they actually do...
some reports say that they somehow "moved" something 18 inches without actually touching it per sae and that the original was destroyed in the process.

I would venture that if the original "vanishes" then it is "true" teleportation...

If the original is destroyed or a replicate remains or is made some where else then it
is "replication" or "botched" teleportation.

As the replicator is supposed to create "replicates" from quantum info and not destroy originals?

or was it "electrical levitation" of some sort?

the stew thickens...

sir
 
Spock said:
Dont forget the "MacBook Pro G7's Next tuesday!!!"

I dont see this to go very far, the second we start beaming solid objects around is when, UPS, USPS, FedEx etc.. go under, they will not allow that.

Uh, they will do what oil companies are doing with alternative power.
They will invest in this transportation, and maybe even be the owners.

When you go down to visit granny using the teleportation station it might just be run by UPS :eek:
 
swanny said:
ah lets get the language and meanings "right" here then
A facsimile is a paper copy, legal mind you,
A clone is a duplicate of a living entity
and a replicate is a fundemental basic copy of static or dead matter.
So would it be safe to say that what they might actually have done here
is create a star trek type "replicator" and not a "transporter".
The dif being that a replication is a quatumn "copy" or such and teleportation is more critical quantum "movement".
OT: Thanks for clarifying. Although, despite what the dictionary seems to say a facsimile wasn't always used to refer to just a paper copy. Watch some old movies to see how they used the term ... it could simply refer to a copy of something. It was probably slang but hey, you knew what I meant too didn't you.
 
If i put my PowerBook in, can someone sneak a Mac Pro in for a cross breed?

Ha.

Rich.
 
fatsoforgotso said:
If i put my PowerBook in, can someone sneak a Mac Pro in for a cross breed?

Ha.

Rich.


Hahaha yeah. I want a 12" MacBook Pro :)

So would anyone trust themselves being teleported with the system running from Windows Vista SP 6?
 
you know what I do not get? Quantum physics has proved that everything exists everywhere simultaniously hell we have even seen the exact same photon in 2 completly different places at the exact same time... if the theory were true wouldn't teleportation kinda be impossible?
 
^^Crap, such a long thread and you beat me to it by one post.


elfin buddy said:
What makes you think that? Just a gut feeling?

If this works the way it's supposed to, it would be an exact copy (even down to the electrical impulses) of whatever the original object was.

Impossible. An electron has no position. You can't transport something to an exact position when the entire system works on probabilities. What are you doing, transferring probabilities?
 
Palad1 said:
Thank you.
By the way, this is the last time I'll ever post while intoxicated ;)

Palad1, re: your sig.. you mean to say your friend is imagniary? :D

Reminds me of a t-shirt my faculty sells.. crossed out letter "i" with the phrase "keeping it real" underneath.
 
shyataroo said:
you know what I do not get? Quantum physics has proved that everything exists everywhere simultaniously hell we have even seen the exact same photon in 2 completly different places at the exact same time... if the theory were true wouldn't teleportation kinda be impossible?

I don't know what your physics training is, but in general you have to be very careful when using explanations written in books or from documentaries for the non-specialist (e.g. general public or enthusiasts, even non-specialist physics undergraduate and graduate students). It's not that the explanations are incorrect, it's just that they are usually a simplification of the mathematics and more complex ideas. Explanations like these often involve analogies that only apply to a particular set of situations.

When you try to generalize these explanations to other situations, contradictions arise that are not really there. I think the statement "everything exists everywhere simultaneously" is oversimplified and may not apply the way you think it does. Resolving the apparent contradiction may require a deeper look at the details.

This happens quite a bit, especially when philosophers and spiritualists use scientific principles to justify their beliefs (e.g. the requirement of increasing entropy means the theory of evolution is flawed).

crackpip
 
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