Secure empty trash disabled in DP5?

Discussion in 'OS X El Capitan (10.11)' started by alex_rockt, Jul 29, 2015.

  1. alex_rockt macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2015
    #1
    Today I saw the the menu item "Secure Empty Trash" in the Finder menu was disabled. The option to turn on "Empty Trash securely" in the Finder advanced settings is also gone.

    Screen Shot 2015-07-29 at 13.01.35.png Screen Shot 2015-07-29 at 13.03.47.png

    Anyone else seeing this?
     
  2. Ritsuka macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2006
    #2
    Are you on a SSD? Secure Empty Trash is useless on a SSD, because of the way a SSD work.
     
  3. alex_rockt thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2015
    #3
    Yes, I am. I'm not using it, was just curious, because a few days ago I could click the "Secure Empty Trash" item.
     
  4. Ritsuka macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Sep 3, 2006
    #4
    Yes probably they disable it in the last beta. The only use of that feature on a ssd is making it die sooner.
     
  5. rockarollr macrumors member

    rockarollr

    Joined:
    Apr 3, 2010
    #5
    I am not using an SSD on my mid-2010 iMac, and I am also seeing that the 'Secure empty trash' option is now greyed-out. It is also gone from Finder/Preferences/Advanced just like the image here in the first post. I'm just using a typical 1TB Western Digital Caviar Black as my only internal hard drive.

    I wonder if they're going to change the way the 'Empty trash' option works, or just have us leaving 'deleted' file remnants scattered throughout our drives from now on.
     
  6. youradhere4222 macrumors 6502

    Joined:
    Dec 16, 2007
    #6
    I have no idea why, but Preview won't open my .JPG images anymore. Every time I try to double click an image it tries to open in Safari (but doesn't). Then I right click and try to do Open With, but Preview isn't an option, and I have to go in and select it. Still, double clicking the image starts Preview but the image never loads.
     
  7. mlsusa macrumors regular

    Joined:
    Sep 17, 2012
    #7
    Don't know what SSD has to do with this. Unless something intrinsic with SSD actually wipes out the data being trashed, not just freeing the blocks for use.

    I have FileVault2 enabled so even though the data is there and recoverable my drive is still encrypted. So I'm not that concerned about losing functionality. But I don't see how the feature being disabled has anything to do with saving one's SSD from unneeded writes.

    EDIT: So reading up, something about TRIM and wear-leveling yadda yadda yadda, recovery is difficult with how SSDs move data around. Or something like that.
     
  8. KALLT macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2008
    #8
    Well the point of secure erase is to make sure that the data is useless immediately and doesn’t linger until the drive finds another use for it. I am not sure whether it works differently on SSDs, but on HDDs the system is overwriting the data with useless information so that any attempt at recovering the data is difficult or impossible. On SSDs this would mean: additional write operations.

    Perhaps the fact that it is greyed out has something to do with FileVault itself? When the drive is encrypted, there is probably no need for secure erase to begin with as long as it’s on.
     
  9. TMRJIJ macrumors 68020

    TMRJIJ

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2011
    Location:
    South Carolina, United States
    #9
    This seems to affect my Seagate Solid State Hybrid Drive as well. FileVault is not enabled.
     
  10. KALLT macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2008
    #10
    Perhaps it’s just broken and Apple disabled it for the moment.
     
  11. jgeezy235 macrumors newbie

    jgeezy235

    Joined:
    Jul 31, 2015
    Location:
    Eastern United States
    #11
    You can open your trash folder in finder and select whatever you want to delete and right click on it and you should see this option [​IMG]
     
  12. KALLT macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2008
    #12
    That probably makes a lot more sense actually. Delete the stuff that you really want gone, but keep unnecessary writes to a minimum.
     
  13. benjitek macrumors 6502a

    benjitek

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2012
    #13
    I actually reinstalled the beta, starting with release 1 thinking something went wrong because of this, as I previously had the advanced setting checked to secure-delete all the time. The function is there through beta 4, but disappears in 5 -- I'll bet it returns in beta 6. There's no mention of it in the release notes, if it were a permanent change it would probably have been documented.
     
  14. KALLT macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Sep 23, 2008
    #14
    It’s gone from the file menu now as well (public beta 4). The “delete immediately...” option (above) seems to be the only way from now on.
    Screen Shot 2015-08-04 at 20.09.52.png
     
  15. wwinter86 macrumors newbie

    wwinter86

    Joined:
    Aug 13, 2009
    Location:
    London
    #15
    Option is not just grayed-out in DP6 it is completely gone now.
     
  16. 556fmjoe macrumors 65816

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    Apr 19, 2014
  17. msephton, Aug 20, 2015
    Last edited: Oct 3, 2015

    msephton macrumors regular

    msephton

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2004
    Location:
    Cornwall, UK
    #17
    Interestingly if you tap Option key when viewing the finder file menu Empty Trash gets the symbols next to it but I cannot see any alternative behaviour if I choose it with the option key held down.

    Delete Immediately is useful. It's in the Finder File menu but not in the context menu. Unless you're in Trash (which you can now sort by Volume!)
     
  18. ustaaz macrumors newbie

    ustaaz

    Joined:
    Sep 18, 2015
    #18
    Perfect! thanks!
     
  19. tombiscuit macrumors member

    tombiscuit

    Joined:
    Jul 23, 2015
    Location:
    UK
    #19
    I know it's a been a while since you posted this, but can you explain what you mean here? Sort by volume...?!
     
  20. msephton macrumors regular

    msephton

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2004
    Location:
    Cornwall, UK
    #20
    Sorry I meant unless you're in Trash (which you can now sort by volume). As in, if it contains files from multiple volumes/drives them you can sort as such.
     
  21. scottburke macrumors newbie

    scottburke

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2015
    #21
    Hi, Apple explains that such a decision was made because the Secure Empty Trash tool may not securely delete files that are placed in the Trash. The simple Empty Trash option cannot completely erase files, they keep residing on the hard drive and will be overwritten only when a Mac needs additional free space.
    Though you still have options of how to securely empty trash in El Capitan such as using third party software or enabling FileVault, check out the article here: http://mac-how-to.wonderhowto.com/how-to/securely-empty-trash-el-capitan-0165175/
     

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