Senators Demand Apple Commit to Not Buying Chinese Memory Chips

[johnsawyercjs]

Micron doesn't make memory for Apple anymore. So, that argument doesn't work.

Sure Apple still buys consumer-level DRAM from Micron. It's still used in a variety of products Apple currently manufactures.

 

[MysteriousStain]

Micron doesn't make memory for Apple anymore. So, that argument doesn't work.

 

[attila]

US government can take a hike. They gave way to both increased memory prices and ridiculous tariffs.

 

[vantelimus]

Sure Apple still buys consumer-level DRAM from Micron. It's still used in a variety of products Apple currently manufactures.

My mistake. I confused their closing of Crucial and exiting the consumer business with pulling out of their contracts with Apple. Thanks for the correction.

 

[ksec]

So how much are the scumbags at SK Hynix, Micron, Samsung paying these senators? These greedy companies have made more over the last 12 months than the whole time they’ve been making memory. Absolutely obscene.

Yes, Because for the whole time they have been making memory prior to this, half of the time they make a loss and half of the time they make decent profits.

Most people didn't care when they were losing money and all they wanted was free DRAM.

 

[DEMinSoCAL]

People should get more comfortable with the idea of checking whether their ideas and suspicions are backed up by findable facts. The devices they use to post these things can double as fact-finding tools prior to posting.

OR...you could just link to your references so hundreds of people don't have to waste time finding what you found.

I searched, and everything I found was from 2024.

 

[magbarn]

Yes, Because for the whole time they have been making memory prior to this, half of the time they make a loss and half of the time they make decent profits.

Most people didn't care when they were losing money and all they wanted was free DRAM.

Cry me a river, that’s how most industries operate. RAM was never free. This Memory Mafia is basically going to ensure RAM prices never come down again by allocating the vast majority of production to HBM which is useless for consumer usage. We need the Chinese to keep these thugs honest.

 

[MiamiFL]

Why? What is the concern if we use Chinese ram? I favor increased disentanglements from China and developing diversified options all over the world but if they can make Ram to spec....seems like we should use every source we can get.

Keep in mind the article said Chinese RAM would only be used in devices sold in China so why should we care? More non-Chinese RAM for Americans.

 

[MiamiFL]

I can see a number of sides to this.

• Restrict China’s revenue from memory.
• Make us less reliant on China for essential parts.
• Incentivize US companies to produce more, which also adds to the jobs.
• Prevent hardware backdoors which would be essential to national security.
• Schumer’s constituents want this.
• He probably owns stock — unfortunately every politician doubles in insider trading.

In any event it sucks.

You're ignoring the fact that Apple said Chinese RAM would only be used in products sold in China.

 

[CMoore515]

Chuck Schumer and the like advocating for tech policy is why I advocate for term limits under this circumstance.

Double edged sword though.

 

[jole]

Because Apple, the OEM, is a US-based company, and the companies (mainly in China) that make and assemble the parts into finished products are "just" contract manufacturers for Apple. As it says on the box, "Designed by Apple in California. Assembled in China."

Under US law, US corporations, their executives, and US citizens are subject to US laws wherever they operate. Even if the assembly line is in Shenzhen and the customer is in Shanghai, the decision to approve, sign contracts for, or integrate a component like CXMT DRAM into an Apple product line rests with executives and engineers working for the American parent company.

These laws are intended to reduce how much American citizens contribute to the maintenance and growth of foreign entities, particularly their governments and militaries, and especially when those entities aren't considered allies.

I don't know how much benefit the CCP and PLA would really get from Apple buying RAM from China's CXMT and NAND storage chips from YMTC, but the US government feels it would be substantial, and they're probably right. If these Chinese companies were to develop RAM to Apple's standards, with Apple's help, that would open the floodgates to other companies buying these chips too, providing billions of dollars to these Chinese companies and their state backers. It would also benefit China's military semiconductor manufacturers. Being China, they'd stomp on rival manufacturers, and the whole world would be back to sourcing these parts from only a very limited number of manufacturers, maybe fewer than we have now.

This seems to be another case of something that might not be great, but the next-possible alternative might actually be worse, maybe not immediately, but not long after.

Case here seems to be that Micron (a US company) whose stock price grew 10x in the past 12 months due to global memory shortage would come back to earth if the global shortage might ease even a little bit.

With hardware vendor GAAP gross margin climbing to 85% (see Micron May quarter results), this is pure price gouging — nothing to do with national security or overall US interests (this hurts all other US businesses and consumers).

If this is not the case of Micron lobbying lawmakers, then nothing is.

 

[Edgecrusherr]

The US government is a far greater problem than Apple buying Chinese memory. If they didn't allow the rich to get wealthier without paying the same taxes they used to, allow big teach to control so much, made sure pay wages and cost of living didn't become so disproportional over the last few decades, didn't support divisive and unqualified politicians, and made sure the memory and storage companies didn't build a monopoly, then some of this would not be an issue.

 

[NewOldStock]

I dont defend Apple on this one as they did it to themselves many years ago or any company operating like this.
Gets to pricey I will not purchase simple as that! Vote with your wallets People!!!!!
The Dragon will burn you every time!

 

[ksec]

Cry me a river, that’s how most industries operate. RAM was never free. This Memory Mafia is basically going to ensure RAM prices never come down again by allocating the vast majority of production to HBM which is useless for consumer usage. We need the Chinese to keep these thugs honest.

Then don't bitch about Ram being expensive. "that’s how most industries operate. "

>We need the Chinese to keep these thugs honest.

Let me rephrase that for you. You want the Chinese to dump memory price down with government subsidies. To the point of no return like solar panels.

 

[magbarn]

Then don't bitch about Ram being expensive. "that’s how most industries operate. "

>We need the Chinese to keep these thugs honest.

Let me rephrase that for you. You want the Chinese to dump memory price down with government subsidies. To the point of no return like solar panels.

Oh man, you must be working for one of these memory companies or have significant shares. Solar companies haven't been found guilty of industry wide price collusion/racketeering like the memory cartel resulting in hundreds of millions in fines. There's a reason we call them the Memory Mafia.

 

[ksec]

Oh man, you must be working for one of these memory companies or have significant shares. Solar companies haven't been found guilty of industry wide price collusion/racketeering like the memory cartel resulting in hundreds of millions in fines. There's a reason we call them the Memory Mafia.

I just happen to know more about business and manufacturing. And the so called cartel is exactly why people understand nothing about commodity business. Inclusive but not limited to DRAM and NAND. from Steel to Food.

>Solar companies haven't been found guilty of industry wide price collusion/racketeering l

You obviously knows very little about Chinese manufacturing.

 

[magbarn]

I just happen to know more about business and manufacturing. And the so called cartel is exactly why people understand nothing about commodity business. Inclusive but not limited to DRAM and NAND. from Steel to Food.

>Solar companies haven't been found guilty of industry wide price collusion/racketeering l

You obviously knows very little about Chinese manufacturing.

I wasn't going to reply, but I'll bite on your analogies. As the big 3 memory manufacturers are basically converting majority of their production to HBM which is unusable by consumers. So basically it's fine if all the corn and rice farmers of the world decided to only grow rice and corn that only inedible animals used for sport/hunting can eat. Meanwhile the majority of steel manufacturers decided to only make steel that can only be used in military applications. All in the name of maximum profit. Therefore causing huge shortages and subsequent massive price hikes on food and steel for consumers. This is basically what RAM manufacturers are doing.

 

[johnsawyercjs]

My mistake. I confused their closing of Crucial and exiting the consumer business with pulling out of their contracts with Apple. Thanks for the correction.

Yes, I figured it was something like that. When I searched online for info on this, I found articles about Micron shutting down Crucial, and thought that might be what you were seeing, but for some reason I failed to mention this.

 

[ksec]

I wasn't going to reply, but I'll bite on your analogies. As the big 3 memory manufacturers are basically converting majority of their production to HBM which is unusable by consumers. So basically it's fine if all the corn and rice farmers of the world decided to only grow rice and corn that only inedible animals used for sport/hunting can eat. Meanwhile the majority of steel manufacturers decided to only make steel that can only be used in military applications. All in the name of maximum profit. Therefore causing huge shortages and subsequent massive price hikes on food and steel for consumers. This is basically what RAM manufacturers are doing.

And the market could have paid, and as recently announced, make longterm purchase agreement to secure current and expanded capacity. People are blaming DRAM manufacture for earning money. In reality every single time in the past 30 years of DRAM up and down cycles so called analyst will ask TSMC or UMC why they are not making DRAM. The answer is simple. It is a commodity like business and isn't really profitable most of the time. At least not when there were 5+ players. If you want more rice, and want it for a long term in susaincble fashion? Make an agreement and pay. If you don't want to make any commitment and want the maximum benefits of the market to keep price low, then don't complain when capacity is not allocated to your favours. And in reality, big players like Apple still have a lot of leverage and are not NOT paying what most people believe the current market rate are as if they are the victims.

To use your example, it is far easier to spin up steel manufacturing and crops when demand is needed. If everything were to equally split between all, we might as well not have a market and have government planned economy.

 

[jinnyman]

Looks like chinese memory sellers are charging more than big 3.

If Apple really care about its customer during the difficult time, why not decrease crazy margin in memory it’s charging to the customers?