Yep.
And I should point out I got that machine at the student price...which was SIGNIFICANT at the time, like, 40% off list or something...not this crappy $100 off or whatever they offer now.
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Serious Problem: Apple desktop computers are becoming more and more expensive... Advice?
- Thread starter BeautifulWoman_1984
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Yep.
And I should point out I got that machine at the student price...which was SIGNIFICANT at the time, like, 40% off list or something...not this crappy $100 off or whatever they offer now.
Gudi
Suspended
But the price of Macs has not (yet) increased as much as the price of butter. Which is why I think, now is a good time to buy. When the larger iMac (Pro) comes out, we will not only learn about the new display size and what a 5.5K display costs, we will also learn about the inflationary effect of the Ukraine war on hardware manufacturers.
Basic75
macrumors 68030
Actually the M2 is the only Mac processor with higher single core performance than the M1 because all processors with M1 in their name have the same single core performance.
Basic75
macrumors 68030
Unfortunately there is no real choice of 220ppi displays on the market, but if you want to save money there are options. You can get a pair of decent 110ppi 27" 1440p IPS displays that each give you the exact same screen real estate as a Studio Display for under 500 EUR or USD. Will they have the same quality? No, but they are good enough for many things and the price speaks for itself.
Basic75
macrumors 68030
Largely because Apple only does 100% and 200% display scaling cleanly and fakes everything else with their indirect rendering. Some people don't care, but others don't want non-integer scaling.
Basic75
macrumors 68030
Yes and no, back in the day you could add RAM and storage yourself which made a big difference to the price of a well equipped machine.
I have a 2019 MBP (that a former employer paid for) and a Mac Mini M1 with Windows and Linux in VMware, because I have to support all 3 OS’s, along with a ton of Android devices, but don’t want the haste of multiple machines. If it wasn’t for work, I’d be 100% Apple.
As for cost, I have the Mac Mini connected to a Sammy 32” display with Apple keyboard and touchpad.
As for cost, I have the Mac Mini connected to a Sammy 32” display with Apple keyboard and touchpad.
RAM sure, but back in the day, and now for that matter, its a desktop so just attach a drive to it. You can even get several which are slim docks that have additional ports, but with the same footprint so they blend in.
maflynn
macrumors Broadwell
Nope, my Mac is but one piece of the suite of technology I use at home. I have a windows desktop and laptop, that sits along with my 14" MBP. I use my desktop the most, then my MBP and then occasionally my windows laptop.
That's not a windows thing, but a technology thing, More and more companies, developers and what not are pushing cloud based solutions, be it SaaS, storage or various services.
There's often one word that follows Linux desktop and that word is frustrating. If you want to constantly tinker and work on various issues, then linux is your best bet. If you just want a platform to use software and not worry about compatibility, things not working, stuff suddenly stopped working then Linux is NOT your best option.
I've used many different flavors of Linux over the years and so far they've all required varying levels of tweaking/configuring. Even so, apps and games that I need don't work or work so poorly it made little sense to stick with Linux.
As for Macs becoming more expensive, I think that's true to a degree, but at this point, everything is, and Apple has always been known to have a so called apple tax, i.e., its apple so expect to pay more. You can get more computer for less with the same build quality in windows, but it lacks a lot of the benefits that macs bring to the table.
For me, it boils down to what platform does the best job at fulfilling my needs. Its not a black and white situation - more so now that Macs can't run x86 windows/apps. Having a PC along side my mac fits my needs the best, YMMV
...but bear in mind that the Mac II was mainly being bought by people who would otherwise have been looking at the likes of Sun or Silicon Graphics workstations that cost as much as a small house. It was never really a "consumer" product. They were used for doing cutting-edge things for the time and were only used/needed by a handful of the population. Those cutting edge applications (offline video editing using 192x128 compressed-to-heck proxy files, editing 1 megapixel images - woo hoo!) are now way below what teenagers expect to do on their entry-level laptops to make tiktok videos. Technology and the market has changed too much to enable simple comparisons - if you're at the "cutting edge" today you'll probably be shopping for a $20,000 Mac Pro system.
There's a danger in picking one little factoid from the past and taking it out of context. Almost every modern consumer item was once a specialist product costing a fortune. (...as I was reflecting recently when buying a 'small' half litre bottle of olive oil from the supermarket - in 1970s UK that was something you bought a few ounces of from the pharmacist as a remedy for earache). Even the "standard baskets" used for calculating general inflation evolve radically over time... things like 'box of 3.5" floppy disks' will have come and gone from those lists since 1990.
Thank you for your reply!
Even Apple's subscription services are becoming more expensive. It's getting harder to justify buying Apple hardware for me.
Ha! I was just thinking of going old school and removing iCloud storage to save the 6.99 a month i pay!
I'm curious if the long term Apple users could post how they budget buying Apple hardware?
For example, Andy Ihatko said he buys a new Apple device every 18 months or so, but he's a journalist that covers Apple so his budget is obviously not reflective of the average Apple user...
For example, Andy Ihatko said he buys a new Apple device every 18 months or so, but he's a journalist that covers Apple so his budget is obviously not reflective of the average Apple user...
I bought a top-spec 2018 Mini just about exactly 3 years ago. Paid $2500 as a refurb, it would have cost $3000 new. I had been using a top-spec 2012 quad Mini for 4 years. Also spent $400 on a new 32" screen. Before that I had been using an Apple 23" Cinema Display that was something like 15 years old.
At this point, I see no reason why my current system won't last another two years. Yeah, it's not a shiny new Apple Silicon Mac, but so what? It does everything I need - including things that the current Macs can't do - I use a 32gb Windows 10 VM very heavily in Parallels with demanding GIS software. When I finallly move to Apple Silicon in a couple years, it will be a much better machine than Apple offers today.
For phones, I went from an iPhone 6s Plus to a 12 ProMax at launch. No interest in upgrading, I don't use phones much. Unless it breaks, I will probably wait another 3 years. Still have a 2018 iPad 6th generation. No plans to ever upgrade that, the iPad just doesn't have much appeal for me.
But my needs are very specific and nothing like yours, I'm sure.
At this point, I see no reason why my current system won't last another two years. Yeah, it's not a shiny new Apple Silicon Mac, but so what? It does everything I need - including things that the current Macs can't do - I use a 32gb Windows 10 VM very heavily in Parallels with demanding GIS software. When I finallly move to Apple Silicon in a couple years, it will be a much better machine than Apple offers today.
For phones, I went from an iPhone 6s Plus to a 12 ProMax at launch. No interest in upgrading, I don't use phones much. Unless it breaks, I will probably wait another 3 years. Still have a 2018 iPad 6th generation. No plans to ever upgrade that, the iPad just doesn't have much appeal for me.
But my needs are very specific and nothing like yours, I'm sure.
Our household has found that the desktops last a very long time. My wife is still using a late-2015 iMac. She refuses to upgrade but I will force it once the security updates end. I bought an M1M Studio last year and expect we will use it until the updates end.
jaw04005
macrumors 601
I touched on this in another thread, but I tend to use a device until the operating system updates end. With that said, the Apple Silicon Mac minis and iMac are an amazing value, especially on the used market.
I've seen M1 iMacs as low as $600 on Facebook Marketplace. M1 Mac minis are regularly $300 and less. They all look brand new. There seems to be a big market of students that purchase them for a semester or two, graduate and try to get rid of them.
I've seen M1 iMacs as low as $600 on Facebook Marketplace. M1 Mac minis are regularly $300 and less. They all look brand new. There seems to be a big market of students that purchase them for a semester or two, graduate and try to get rid of them.
Algus
macrumors 6502
My computer/technology budget is probably higher than a lot of people because I consider myself something of an enthusiast and I buy things I want vs. things I need. A perfect example is the 15'' M2 Air. Did I need it? Of course not, I had a perfectly functional M1 Air. Did I need the M1 Air? Of course not, I had a perfectly functional 2014 MBA that at the time was still going to receive two years of support via Big Sur. And to extrapolate on that further, my 2014 MBA would today offer enough computer power to do what I need my computer to do for work.
At home I still run a 2012 Mac mini and it is sufficient to do all of the things I need it to do for work.
With a little knowledge of maintenance: physical - cleaning the computer, keeping it in a good environment; software - clean installs of the OS, monitoring active processes, purging unneeded data - you can keep your technology running for a long time. A lot of people make the mistake of convincing themselves they need more technology to complete their tasks than they actually do. This isn't helped by the fact that technology reviews and writers are rarely discussing the use of hardware in real world terms - i.e. exactly what someone doing office work needs (not much) or what specs work well for film editing (no you don't NEED an M2 Max to edit footage)
Prices I have spent on computers in the last 11 years
2012 - $600 for a Mac mini (annual cost $54.54/year)
2014 - $1500 for a Macbook Pro (annual cost $214.28/year)
2021 - $850 for an M1 Macbook Air (annual cost $425/year)
2023 - $1699 for an M2 Macbook Air (annual cost $1699/year)
My point here is the longer you use the computer, the less that computer is costing you annually. $1699 is a heck of a lot of money in one go but if I end up using the computer for seven years like I did my 2014 Pro, it works out to $242.71 a year - barely more than the computer I bought in 2014.
Grand total I've spent on computer hardware in the last 11 years: $4,649. So we can assume my annual computer budget over this period has been $422.63/year. And that is with nonessentials (eg buying new laptops when I didn't need to)
Now I am neglecting a bunch of stuff here (I do have a custom built gaming PC, along with a bunch of server hardware, so I've probably spent another $3,000 on top of what I have listed here) but I could easily budget all that stuff as toy/hobby/luxury expenses compared to my Macs that I am buying for productivity.
At home I still run a 2012 Mac mini and it is sufficient to do all of the things I need it to do for work.
With a little knowledge of maintenance: physical - cleaning the computer, keeping it in a good environment; software - clean installs of the OS, monitoring active processes, purging unneeded data - you can keep your technology running for a long time. A lot of people make the mistake of convincing themselves they need more technology to complete their tasks than they actually do. This isn't helped by the fact that technology reviews and writers are rarely discussing the use of hardware in real world terms - i.e. exactly what someone doing office work needs (not much) or what specs work well for film editing (no you don't NEED an M2 Max to edit footage)
Prices I have spent on computers in the last 11 years
2012 - $600 for a Mac mini (annual cost $54.54/year)
2014 - $1500 for a Macbook Pro (annual cost $214.28/year)
2021 - $850 for an M1 Macbook Air (annual cost $425/year)
2023 - $1699 for an M2 Macbook Air (annual cost $1699/year)
My point here is the longer you use the computer, the less that computer is costing you annually. $1699 is a heck of a lot of money in one go but if I end up using the computer for seven years like I did my 2014 Pro, it works out to $242.71 a year - barely more than the computer I bought in 2014.
Grand total I've spent on computer hardware in the last 11 years: $4,649. So we can assume my annual computer budget over this period has been $422.63/year. And that is with nonessentials (eg buying new laptops when I didn't need to)
Now I am neglecting a bunch of stuff here (I do have a custom built gaming PC, along with a bunch of server hardware, so I've probably spent another $3,000 on top of what I have listed here) but I could easily budget all that stuff as toy/hobby/luxury expenses compared to my Macs that I am buying for productivity.
kschendel
macrumors 65816
I can't say I budget at all. Our Mac hardware lasts a long time. We replaced a 2009 iMac in 2019, and I'm still working on a late 2013 modem retina MacBook Pro that I bought in early 2014.
I have to put in my two cents on this one.
We are a 100% Apple family. Desktops, iphones, ipads, everything.
With the new line of Mx hardware, I've come to really hate the Mac. iPhones and ipads are still fine, but the desktop is beyond asinine now. The hardware isn't upgradeable, and Apple is very good at making your hardware obsolete soon after purchasing it. The beauty of the Mac's simplicity only a few short years ago is gone with the insane amount of peripherals and expanding extras you need to run your (non-upgradeable) system now. Need to plug in hard drive or a camera? If you don't have a free port (which are in short supply on most of the new Macs), you can't add it unless you clutter up your desk with additional docks and peripherals that slow down data transfer unless you want to spend hundreds for a dock that is even functional. Before I wasted money on the new M-chip monstrosities, I used three monitors and was able to use old iMacs as monitors if needed. Now you're limited in the number of screens you can add (each taking up one of your scarce ports). When you have software that needs the newest OS, you're screwed if your 3-year-old imac is too antiquated to download an OS that takes up so much of your (non-upgradeable) hard drive that the Mac is basically useless.
Are Macs more expensive? ABSOLUTELY! Did the added expense used to be worth it? YES! Now that you have to upgrade to new hardware 2-3x more often, it's even more expensive than that. Years ago, the extra expense was worth it because your system would work flawlessly for many, many years. Now, you're lucky if your system lasts more than 2-3 years before you need to GET A NEW SYSTEM because nothing from Cupertino is upgradeable anymore.
They've built an expiration date into everything they produce now, and for middle-class families, this is a hefty price tag.
Basic75
macrumors 68030
I'm as annoyed at the lack of upgradeability, and as outraged over Apple's insane upgrade pricing, as anybody here, but I don't see any reason to not use my M1 generation Macs for another 2 years, possibly even more.
anshuvorty
macrumors 68040
Exactly. While Apple are asses with ram and storage pricing, a trip to an inflation calculator might explain part of the price increases.
Looking at inflation-adjusted prices is good fun - but pretty irrelevant in the case of price-comparing computers.
Personal computers and other consumer electronics haven't been affected by inflation for the last 40 years, and that goes for the whole industry, not just Apple. A basic personal computer has cost roughly the same number of dollars/pounds since the 1980s - although what you get for your money in terms of performance and capacity has increased by several orders of magnitude and the value of that currency w.r.t. the "cost of living" has plummeted. Maybe ~£500-£1500 for a lower-end PC-type system (will get you a Dell today) or ~£100 for a Sinclair Spectrum (will get you - ha! - The Spectrum today!) - more recently, the base price of the iMac has been the same $1299 since 1998 and the Mac Mini hovering around the same since 2006.
NB: I'd put those sorts of price comparisons into the "just for fun" category too - the point is that the well-established expectation for the PC industry is for prices to stay about the same (numerically) while performance/capacity specs rise exponentially, without much regard to the average rate of inflation.
That's been largely true of Apple in terms of prices - there's always been a premium for Apple stuff and I'd dispute the claim about them being "more and more expensive".
There was a (probably justified) price-vs-specs blip around 2012-2016 with the switch from mechanical hard drives to SSD - which brought significant performance advantages, with the disadvantage that a 128-256GB SSD genuinely cost more than the 500GB-1TB hard drives they were using previously, and a like-for-like 500GB-1TB would have been prohibitively expensive.
What we have seen in recent years, though, is Apple failing to pass on some industry-wide cost reductions to customers at the same time as removing the possibility of mid-life/third-party expansions - particularly RAM and SSD, which seem to have stuck at early-2010s prices in Apple's universe. The recent bump to 16GB RAM was really too little, too late - yes, it will be fine for many people but for anybody speccing out a non-Mac for anything beyond "personal productivity" then specifying at least 32GB RAM "just in case" would be a $50 no-brainer... and we still have a problem with SSD capacities - we're way past the point where a mere 512GB SSD (only bringing us back to where we were 10 years ago with mechanical drives) should be a $200 extra.
This has been exaggerated in the case of the Mac Mini with Apple's traditional "good/better/best" pricing structure for, say, the M4 Mini, now relating only to SSD and RAM sizes. From Apple's POV it has nothing to do with the bill-of-materials and everything to do with their strategic pricing structure - but that can't hide the fact that from the consumers POV they're being asked to pay $200 for $50 (retail) worth of flash memory and another $200 for a similar value in RAM - prices that are easy to compare with the rest of the industry.
The base M4 Mini would blow most of the PC competition out of the water on price/performance if it weren't for the elephant in the room that much of that competition comes with 32GB RAM/1TB SSD as standard (or as a $100-$200 upgrade) and matching that would add a massive $800 to the cost of the Mini.