Shareholders Advisory Group Doesn't Want Tim Cook to Get $99 Million Pay Package

[sudo-sandwich]

I don’t see how anyone can think that Apple is going to run out of steam anytime soon. They have over a billion active iPhone users, and many of them only have an iPhone as their sole Apple device. There is still a huge untapped user base that haven’t purchased accessories like the Apple Watch or AirPods, or subscribed to services, or complementary products like the iPad and Mac.

The biggest risk is whether Apple can make enough products to sell, not whether there will be a shortage of people queueing up to buy their wares or not.

Trust me when I say that even at this point, Apple is still only just getting started.

The biggest risk is someone serious about innovating comes along and does to Apple what Apple did to Blackberry.
Either that or people just become satisfied with what they have and stop buying new gadgets that aren't much better.

 

[Abazigal]

The biggest risk is someone serious about innovating comes along and does to Apple what Apple did to Blackberry.
Either that or people just become satisfied with what they have and stop buying new gadgets that aren't much better.

There’s always that risk, however infinitesimally small.

I wouldn’t lose sleep over it.

 

[quarkysg]

The biggest risk is someone serious about innovating comes along and does to Apple what Apple did to Blackberry.

If Apple did what Blackberry did, i.e. thinking that they cannot be surpassed, Apple deserves to receive the same fate as Blackberry. At this point, I don't see that happening ... yet.

Either that or people just become satisfied with what they have and stop buying new gadgets that aren't much better.

It is Apple's job to create demand for their product. If they don't, then they deserve what they will get. Nobody thought that Nokia could be displaced, but it happened.

 

[trusso]

As a user, boring means the big players are settling and semi-monopolizing rather than competing vigorously. Instead, they adopt copycat tactics then introduce artificial lock-in measures instead of working with each other, like how everyone has a streaming service and a smart speaker now. It's worse for us than if they'd each focus on doing something great and different while being compatible with each other. In 2008-2014 it was more like that. There will always be tried and true stuff to fall back on too.

Btw, was old compatible Intel CPU the boring path you wanted the Mac to stick with? M1 sounded crazy before it happened.

As a shareholder, I've got no reason to invest in a single company that doesn't excite me. Yeah AAPL is doing great now, but if there's no more water in the boiler, I don't know when it's going to run out of steam. Imagine holding IBM stock back when they were dominant. When I want boring, I park my money in SPY. Manages itself, and if it drops too quickly, the US president and JPow go fix it for me.

I think you're completely misconstruing what I mean by boring (for one, I'm not talking about finances at all), but you obviously think you know what you're talking about.

Boring does not imply settling. Boring means tried and true. I don't need (or even want) cars and computers that are "re-invented" every five years. I want something rock solid stable that, from both a hardware and software perspective, can run hassle-free for 15-20 years. This is imminently doable, but there's no $$$ in it. Instead it's all about the shiny new distractions that clamor for more and more of your money. It's unsustainable.

The time and money that's been spent trying to "re-invent" personal gadgets and faddish websites would be so much better spent on solving real problems, like widespread desalination efforts, renewable energy production at scale, and infrastructure for developing nations.

So again, let me reiterate: by nearly any metric that is not lining some CEO or investor's pocketbook, boring is good. When you argue that it's bad, you're presupposing the rules of a societal game that I intentionally disregard because it hurts the very people it purports to help.

 

[Flight Plan]

I think you're completely misconstruing what I mean by boring (for one, I'm not talking about finances at all), but you obviously think you know what you're talking about.

Boring does not imply settling. Boring means tried and true. I don't need (or even want) cars and computers that are "re-invented" every five years. I want something rock solid stable that, from both a hardware and software perspective, can run hassle-free for 15-20 years. This is imminently doable, but there's no $$$ in it. Instead it's all about the shiny new distractions that clamor for more and more of your money. It's unsustainable.

I don't know if it's unsustainable or not, but if this is your best example of "boring is good", it's not a very good one. You can produce the better product but if nobody buys it, you'll be gone soon enough. Beta Max was better than VHS, but guess who won.

The Phillips cassette was not as good as reel-to-reel, but guess who won.

The consumer isn't looking forward 15-30 years of hassle-free usage. Of ANYTHING, not even replacement knees, hips, or teeth!

The time and money that's been spent trying to "re-invent" personal gadgets and faddish websites would be so much better spent on solving real problems, like widespread desalination efforts, renewable energy production at scale, and infrastructure for developing nations.

But that's NOT what Apple does, so why are you wasting your time complaining about it? That's like me NOT buying a Nissan or Toyota because they don't buy clean socks for the poor in Cameroon. They don't do that!

You should champion desalination efforts and talk to your elected officials (assuming you live in a place where you can vote) about cutting red tape so that companies would be willing to take on big projects such as these.

Red tape and onerous regulations stop big projects like this from happening. Governments could see more success if they'd just get out of the way and let the people do what the people are good at: Building things!

So again, let me reiterate: by nearly any metric that is not lining some CEO or investor's pocketbook, boring is good. When you argue that it's bad, you're presupposing the rules of a societal game that I intentionally disregard because it hurts the very people it purports to help.

What an old trope, "lining some CEO or investor's pocketbook". Thanks for making the situation look 2-dimensional, like a poorly drawn cartoon. Dude, I'm "some investor". If you have a retirement plan through work, then YOU'RE "some investor" too. Why do you want to prevent the average person from benefiting from making good investment decisions? Is it just jealousy; envy?

People don't take on and investors won't bankroll risky projects without some possibility of being able to make some profit along the way. So you cry that there's not enough desalination going on, but you don't want the people who would fund such work to benefit from it?

Please reconsider your stance on this. Your way would make the world hungrier, colder, less healthy, and we would all live shorter lives. Please reconsider.

 

[trusso]

@Flight Plan

Like the other guy, you seem to be using my words as a springboard for your own ideas. You're presupposing thoughts that I don't have, which isn't very flattering. Your politics also leave something to be desired, but that's its own issue.

Here's an idea: instead of folks looking for holes to punch in arguments you disagree with, try and understand the kernel of truth - the broader point I'm trying to make. I have no time to refute words attempting to paint me as a luddite, because that was never my argument.

/facepalm (This is why I don't get involved in internet debates.)

Good day, folks. Go on and have your fun. I have better things to do.

 

[sudo-sandwich]

Boring does not imply settling. Boring means tried and true. I don't need (or even want) cars and computers that are "re-invented" every five years. I want something rock solid stable that, from both a hardware and software perspective, can run hassle-free for 15-20 years. This is imminently doable, but there's no $$$ in it. Instead it's all about the shiny new distractions that clamor for more and more of your money. It's unsustainable.

I'm not asking for gimmicks, I'm asking for something that's genuinely useful and never been done. I only get a new Mac when my work requires it or a new iPhone when the old one totally stops working, and the iPad is just a gimmick to me.

But 15-20 years for a PC, that'd be insanely burdensome backwards-compatibility. Stuff evolves and gets better. At least when I hold onto a Mac for 10 years, I understand it not being well supported after 6.

 

[sudo-sandwich]

If Apple did what Blackberry did, i.e. thinking that they cannot be surpassed, Apple deserves to receive the same fate as Blackberry. At this point, I don't see that happening ... yet.

For the iPhone, they exert too much control over their users and devs, knowing users won't switch to Android cause they're not poor. For the Mac, yeah they're actually fighting hard and doing great things.

 

[Abazigal]

For the iPhone, they exert too much control over their users and devs, knowing users won't switch to Android cause they're not poor. For the Mac, yeah they're actually fighting hard and doing great things.

Or maybe the control that Apple exerts over iOS is precisely what users (like myself, for one) like about it. And since iPhone users aren’t migrating, developers have to go where the (paying) customers are, which means putting up with whatever demands Apple makes of them. Like implementing ATT. Which is, again, to my benefit as the end user.

Everything is working as it should.

 

[crsh1976]

So don't pay employees more... (the people actually doing the real work of value in this equation)
...but just give more to investors?

??‍?

And we wonder why this country is so fractured..

Oh but that's the game with publicly-traded companies, they want you to invest in them, which I'm all for as long as it's worth it - so I get dividend out of it. Let's call a cat a cat, it's called capitalism, and it's not a one-way street.

 

[sudo-sandwich]

Or maybe the control that Apple exerts over iOS is precisely what users (like myself, for one) like about it. And since iPhone users aren’t migrating, developers have to go where the (paying) customers are, which means putting up with whatever demands Apple makes of them. Like implementing ATT. Which is, again, to my benefit as the end user.

Everything is working as it should.

There's no reason for users and devs to enjoy Apple taking a large cut of payments, intentionally limiting MobileSafari's support for web standards (e.g. PWA push notifications, WebGL), refusing to do cross-platform iMessage, charging a huge royalty on Lightning cables to the point where they're 10X the price while refusing to adopt USB-C for iPhones, or coercing people to buy AirPods/Beats via proprietary wireless protocols. These aren't the usual decisions where they've simplified the product at the expense of nerdy use cases that Android covers. These are usability downsides meant to serve Apple's lock-in and profits in careful ways.

I get that it's their platform and their choices (except where dumb laws apply), but their choices reflect a lack of innovation and a focus on squeezing what they can out of what the old Apple created. I'm out, money's in SPY now.

 

[I7guy]

There's no reason for users and devs to enjoy Apple taking a large cut of payments,

I don't enjoy Apple taking a large cut, the same way I don't enjoy that my dealership pulls all sorts of tactics to take their large cut. However, with Apple it is what it is and one can vote with their $$$. My car dealer, there is no regulation on how much to stick it to the customers.

intentionally limiting MobileSafari's support for web standards (e.g. PWA push notifications, WebGL),

Are they intentionally limiting Safari?

charging a huge royalty on Lightning cables to the point where they're 10X the price while refusing to adopt USB-C for iPhones,

There are MFI lightning cables galore, I buy mine on amazon and they work find. There is no need for USB-C on iphones, imo.

or coercing people to buy AirPods.

Corecing? I couldn't wait to purchase my first pair after I saw a co-worker bought them. Anybody who thinks Apple is sticking it to them, buy the competition.

I'm not asking for the clunkiness of Android phones where they think a removable battery is a great feature. These are usability downsides meant to serve Apple's lock-in and profits.

I get that it's their platform and their choices (except where dumb laws apply), but their choices reflect a lack of innovation and a focus on squeezing what they can out of what the old Apple created.

What old Apple and what lack of innovation. Seems since 2011 Apple has been innovating away.

 

[sudo-sandwich]

I don't enjoy Apple taking a large cut, the same way I don't enjoy that my dealership pulls all sorts of tactics to take their large cut. However, with Apple it is what it is and one can vote with their $$$. My car dealer, there is no regulation on how much to stick it to the customers.

Yeah, I do vote with my wallet, and with my time. I used to be an iOS app developer.

Are they intentionally limiting Safari?

They easily have the resources to implement PWA push notifications on mobile, especially since they did on desktop. WebGL is harder, but still. Both would make mobile web apps a more feasible replacement for App Store ones. It's not a coincidence.

There are MFI lightning cables galore, I buy mine on amazon and they work find. There is no need for USB-C on iphones, imo.

$15 per MFi cable instead of the like $1.50 you'd see otherwise (how much a bootleg Lightning or legit USB cable costs).

Corecing? I couldn't wait to purchase my first pair after I saw a co-worker bought them. Anybody who thinks Apple is sticking it to them, buy the competition.

There's no room for competition. Why, because only AirPods and Beats get to use Apple's proprietary protocols for high-def mic+audio and better pairing over BT. Everything else is pure BT, mostly the same clunkiness that existed since the original iPhone and very few people used. Only other option is the jack, which they removed coinciding with the AirPods release.

What old Apple and what lack of innovation. Seems since 2011 Apple has been innovating away.

If they were doing something amazing, I'd say that and ignore any negatives. Name a launch that compares to:
- original iMac
- iPod
- iPhone
- iPad (again I hate this thing but it did sell)
Maaaybe the Apple Watch, but it's below all of those. It's fine, Apple still makes great products. But TSLA is the new AAPL with regards to releasing game-changing products, not that I'm willing to buy into it at the current valuation.

 

[remserwis]

Where did they find comparable company… ??? . what world we living in? this people want to destroy progress by taking down whole ladder with “more work=better reward” principle. Everybody should be lazy, get the same (only tik tok morrons or kardashians can make millions for showing ass).

 

[sudo-sandwich]

Where did they find comparable company… ??? . what world we living in? this people want to destroy progress by taking down whole ladder with “more work=better reward” principle. Everybody should be lazy, get the same (only tik tok morrons or kardashians can make millions for showing ass).

MSFT maybe