Should an old guy like me update from Catalina to Sequoia?

[MBAir2010]

Wow, so much to process, just since my last post. I appreciate everyone's input here. There is so much swimming in my head at this point, so many options and things to consider, that I'm inclined to just throw out my laptop all together and call it a day.

Just remember, these things are supposed to be fun as well as productive!
at the end of the day they are just computers....


I had an unexpected several days as i started the week using
a great Asus Zen book and windows 10 all the time for several months (Sold yesterday),
now I am using a Macbook air m1 as my prime "go to computer.
my head was spinning over what to use as well,
then a racing bike i use four times a week broke a wheel,
as i realized now some our possessions are more important than others.

heck we did not use computers that much at home in the 1990s
and never at all before then as i knew one person who had a modem computer
like "war games" in 1983.

just give this situation more time and have fun, heycal!

 

[Snowlover]

Wow, so much to process, just since my last post. I appreciate everyone's input here. There is so much swimming in my head at this point, so many options and things to consider, that I'm inclined to just throw out my laptop all together and call it a day.

I got the sense that this was overwhelming to you, and that is why I previously suggested just going with an up to date browser - firefox.
You don't NEED to update past Catalina. It seems that it is working fine for you except for Safari.
I still use Mojave, and was using Mountain Lion on a 2012 macbook air before I sold it last fall.

Most of the people on here are quite tech savvy and want to be helpful, but don't realize that to some non tech savvy people they are speaking what amounts to a foreign language leading to confusion and overwhelm.

 

[MBAir2010]

I got the sense that this was overwhelming to you, and that is why I previously suggested just going with an up to date browser - firefox.
You don't NEED to update past Catalina. It seems that it is working fine for you except for Safari.
I still use Mojave, and was using Mountain Lion on a 2012 macbook air before I sold it last fall.

Most of the people on here are quite tech savvy and want to be helpful, but don't realize that to some non tech savvy people they are speaking what amounts to a foreign language leading to confusion and overwhelm.

this is sound advise, safari does stagger or gets 'anal" on some websites using Monterey,
whereas Firefox or Vivaldi works better, which i now use on everything  now.

Any complaints with Mojave in 2025? i have that on the MBP2012 13" and AdobeCS4 wont launch anymore.
i can revert the date but i use CS4 with Mt Lion without a problem.

 

[Snowlover]

Any complaints with Mojave in 2025? i have that on the MBP2012 13" and AdobeCS4 wont launch anymore.
i can revert the date but i use CS4 with Mt Lion without a problem.

No complaints.
I can still use firefox esr, orion, sealion and chromium legacy browsers. CS6 still works fine. (I will not move to subscription based software !)
Dual boot with windows 11 covers everything I need.
I really did like using Mountain Lion, but can't install it on 2014 mini.

 

[JUMA55]

Just remember, these things are supposed to be fun as well as productive!
at the end of the day they are just computers....


I had an unexpected several days as i started the week using
a great Asus Zen book and windows 10 all the time for several months (Sold yesterday),
now I am using a Macbook air m1 as my prime "go to computer.
my head was spinning over what to use as well,
then a racing bike i use four times a week broke a wheel,
as i realized now some our possessions are more important than others.

heck we did not use computers that much at home in the 1990s
and never at all before then as i knew one person who had a modem computer
like "war games" in 1983.

just give this situation more time and have fun, heycal!

FWIW, I started in 1982 with an Osborne 1:

Osborne 1 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Hence my avatar. The Osborne had a modem that fit in one of the floppy storage slot. I went all over the world at 300 baud and long distance charges.

 

[Apple_Robert]

OP,
I suggest you take your Mac to the local Apple Store and ask them to upgrade the Mac for you, and while you were there, they can give you some tutoring on the newly installed OS. That will remove the stress for you.

 

[whitby]

OP,
I suggest you take your Mac to the local Apple Store and ask them to upgrade the Mac for you, and while you were there, they can give you some tutoring on the newly installed OS. That will remove the stress for you.

I agree completely. This is by far the simplest way to upgrade. Generally Mac OS upgrades are transparent with tweaks on the side. I have at times not even noticed the difference until I notice odd additions and some options that have moved. But search is your friend (or get one of the those AI assistants like Perplexity. You can ask it simple questions like "Where is the x button" and it will tell you in plain English). Don't worry, the reason you have a Mac is because Apple, in general, make upgrading etc. very very easy to deal with.

 

[heycal]

Taking to the Apple store for upgrade help is not a bad idea, thanks.

One question I forgot to ask: when I upgrade, will all my automatic log-in and saved passwords in Safari still be there and working as before?

 

[whitby]

Taking to the Apple store for upgrade help is not a bad idea, thanks.

One question I forgot to ask: when I upgrade, will all my automatic log-in and saved passwords in Safari still be there and working as before?

Yes. Assuming you have everything backed up to iCloud.

 

[splifingate]

When people talk about issues or bugs with Sequoia, what do they mean specifically?

They are speaking of real, or perceived.

Personally, Sequoia has been almost absolutely problem-free.

To be fair, my system is a M2 Mac Studio, so appropriate performance expectations are there . . . my expectations for the results of running Sequoia on my '15 MBP would be entirely different

Make (and secure) duplicates of all your important data (photos, documents, et al.), and your stress levels will be significantly reduced.

 

[M.Brane]

Fellow old guy here currently on Sonoma. I will update to Sequoia just before the next major update is released, lather, rinse, repeat. I have no interest in being an unpaid beta tester, and bug control seems to be a lost art in Cupertino these days.

 

[HobeSoundDarryl]

That last post is the TRUTH... and just about what I do myself. In the old days (10 years ago+), one could make the jump to a new generation on about the .2 or .3 update and feel like most of it is fine. For me, that's now turned into .5 or .6. About .7 or .8 is the end of a generation's updates.

So OP, the suggestion- if you want to take great leap forward- is to jump to Sonoma, now 14.7.4. Save the additional hop to Sequoia until either a comparable update of it in about late September or October or perhaps a little sooner at .5 or .6 like me, which usually hits around WWDC in about mid-June or so. This year, I'm probably going to wait longer myself since A.I. is a rolling release, so I'm not so confident about the .5 or .6 level myself.

And I think the suggestion of taking it into an Apple Store for help upgrading is a very good idea. It reads like you could use some expert help just to be fully confident about the hop, addressing all of your questions/concerns, etc.

 

[p33t3r]

I'm running Sequoia on your exact machine, and I have had no problems updating from OS to OS all the way here. I always make a backup before any system updates, but have never had any need for it (so far).
As stated above, one difference is how the preferences are organized, and another main difference is that Passwords is its own app now, and that takes a bit of getting used to, but it pretty much works as before. Also, on an Intel machine, the annoying (to some) Apple Intelligence stuff is not applicable, so you don't have to worry about that.

 

[Gregg2]

heycal, since you're using the Mac for internet browsing, upgrading is a good idea. I support the recommendation to go all the way to the current newest version, Sequoia 15.3.1 which is probably what your Software Update will default to anyway. I also had no problems when I updated to 15.2 and since another post reports no problems on the same Mac you have, it should go smoothly. If you have a friend or family member who is more "techy" than you, ask for some help to give you some backup in case you have questions.

Especially since you will not be inclined to do this again, going to the latest version buys you more time with a more secure browser.

 

[JUMA55]

Here's another Old F@art's opinion. I had so many issues with Sequoia on my 2019 Intel iMac 5K that I bought an iMac M4, which seems to be working well. I've only used about half a day.

 

[ipaqrat]

I got 15.3.1 on a 2018 vintage MacBook Pro. It's humming along just fine, though it's at the end of the line OS-wise.

If OS and App features were all the only consideration, then yeah, whatever Catalina. But you are, in fact, sharing the world with dirtbags, know it, like it, or not. The greater concern is security, to the extent that you do anything on that machine to secure. There is some fiendishly clever malware in the wild guaranteed to cut through Catalina or Mojave if you run afoul of it. A current version of any browser alone ain't 'nuff to save ya.

A 2020 vintage Mac can upgrade to at least 15.3.1. Recommend do it asap. Yes, do the time machine backup. It wouldn't hurt to look into the imaging/backup apps mentioned above; Time machine isn't exactly bullet proof and rollback options are always prudent.

Yes, things are a bit different in Sequoia, some annoying, and there remain bugs to fix. And there are more security blocks and prompts on the daily, which are sadly the price of doing bidnez. But Catalina wasn't perfect, either.

Frankly, I miss OS 9.1 and my StarTac phone.

 

[Ruggy]

Without wanting to have a fight, please bear in mind that when someone has a problem they tend to go to a forum and shout about it. Sometimes a lot.
20 people complaining about how awful something is in a forum, can look like there's a real problem but the reality is there are literally tens of millions of people who update all the time and never have a problem.
I have 6 macs here, the oldest is 2016, two are 2020 one is 2021 and the most recent 2024. I've been using macs since 2008 and apart from the occasional hardware failure, I've never had a single update go wrong, or had a bad OS full of bugs. Where I've had problems it's always either been down to an app or user error.
However, if you don't update you are going to have more problems with apps not working but more importantly, you will not only miss out on new features but you are not benefitting from security updates so you are more exposed to exploits.
Certainly, makes sure everything is backed up but surely you do that anyway? Everything dies eventually and all hard drives have a finite life. It isn't a question of 'if' it's always a matter of 'when'.
When I back up I use icloud for things like messages and passwords but otherwise I just back up files individually. When you use time machine or similar it makes one big file with everything mashed within, and that can only be read by time machine and your correct user account. You simply can't extract a single document on another device, if your computer fails and you'll have the devil of a job sorting it out if something goes wrong- at best- and at worst you have one error and you lose the lot. SD cards are incredibly cheap so are external hard drives and just copying files across is so easy unless you are creating hundreds a day or running a business.
Up to you of course but I think you should make sure everything is backed up and then do it. Millions of people do every day with no problems at all.

 

[heycal]

Safari is working less and less... I'm gonna have to do something sooner rather than later.

 

[bzgnyc2]

Safari is working less and less... I'm gonna have to do something sooner rather than later.

There was a similar thread on this forum not too long ago:

https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/macbook-12-2015-getting-slower-with-catalina.2448226/?post=33702709#post-33702709

You can follow some of the alternatives suggested there as well as some of the tradeoffs.

As a general rule I would not use Safari except on supported versions of macOS (e.g. currently Sequoia, Sonoma, and Ventura). If you want to stick with Catalina a little while longer, you probably ought to switch to Firefox or Brave (but support for Catalina stopped at version 1.69.168 so not great from a support/security perspective).

 

[ipaqrat]

Hey, Cal -- Strongly recommend just make the leap to Sequoia. Your machine can handle it, though a few features simply won't be available. I can't remember all of them, but on my 2018 MBP, the one that really pissed me off was that LOCAL processing of text-to-speech stopped working (I have the machine read back long passages to help me proof and improve.). Totally arbitrary BS on Apple's part to promote new machine sales. (which worked, I bought an M3 because I'm weak around the holidays) - and the quality of its text reading is not one bit better!

From a full TimeMachine backup you can selectively restore just your files and settings, bookmarks, etc. Recommend NOT restoring any apps from a Catalina backup, provided they're still available, preferably updated. Reinstall apps fresh whenever you can. You might find some are no longer available, which will suck. (Hey, if computers don't piss you off, then you're just not paying attention.)

It's easy to perceive Safari is working less and doing less - the proverbial canary in the coal mine. Keep in mind that:

• Safari's capabilities are somewhat locked to the OS, as you're becoming aware.
• Modern MacOS and Safari have security ENABLED by default.
  • You need to keep on top of Safari's website settings - disabling content blocking and permitting auto-play, camera, mic, etc., as needed.
  • In literally decades, now, using desktop Safari as my main browser, I have run across precisely ONE site that wouldn't work. (Hickory Farms, because I'm weak around the holidays 🧀 🥓). Sometimes, even a site that claims its "Chrome-only" will work in Safari, anyway, if you set its "agent" to say its Chrome.

If you want to worry LESS, and tinker LESS, then keep your OS/Apps updated constantly (heh, maybe not on day 1, but day 15 for sure.) And Sequoia now has the benefit of patches, though I personally never had a work-stoppage.

Leave all MacOS security services operational - yeah, it'll be frustrating answering more seemingly redundant prompts for permission, but it's important to pay attention to them, and be mindful, as some exploits work by faking MacOS' prompt windows. Security features are more important now than ever, but remember, when it comes to personal security, we are the biggest tools... errr, maybe that didn't come out right 😆.

 

[Howard2k]

Maybe backup with Time Machine, then just run the upgrade? I'm sure it'll be fine, but you should always have a backup anyway.

Back up your Mac with Time Machine - Apple Support (CA)

If you have a USB drive or other external storage device, you can use Time Machine to automatically back up your files, including apps, music, photos, email, and documents.

support.apple.com

 

[heycal]

I'm leaning towards going straight to Sequioa. I thought it wise to do a proper back up as recommended here. But it appears that Super Duper and Carbon Copy Cloner are both paid apps for backing up. Or is CCC free for a month, and I won't need it that long?

 

[heycal]

Maybe backup with Time Machine, then just run the upgrade? I'm sure it'll be fine, but you should always have a backup anyway.

Back up your Mac with Time Machine - Apple Support (CA)

If you have a USB drive or other external storage device, you can use Time Machine to automatically back up your files, including apps, music, photos, email, and documents.

support.apple.com

Will definitely at least do that, but some here say that is not enough if I'm understanding things.

 

[heycal]

btw, I think the reason I'm so resistant to using anything other than Safari is both my familiarity with it, and it knows all my autofills and passwords. Chrome or Firefox don't know squat

 

[Howard2k]

Will definitely at least do that, but some here say that is not enough if I'm understanding things.

Of course they do

There are always people who have had poor experiences with any backup software, some of those bad experiences will be due to genuine issues and some will be due to user error. Everyone has an agenda.

I've used Time Machine for years and it hasn't let me down. But I will qualify that I always keep at least TWO backup drives. One backup is no backups. But if you already have no backups then one is a very good start.

If you want to spend the time and money on other backup solutions then it's probably a wise investment in time etc., and no backup is 100%, but I've had plenty of success with Time Machine, including restoring from a failed drive.