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faust

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Sep 11, 2007
382
173
Los Angeles, CA
Hey all, I'm thinking about buying a new 15" MBP for coding/general usage. I'm fairly interested in it, but I have concerns about the keyboard. I know that if I come into any issues with it, that Apple will cover the repair, but I don't want to deal with such a thing for the life of my potential usage of this computer(4-5+ years). I was either thinking of getting this MBP, a 2017 Macbook Air, or a Thinkpad 590 or X1 Extreme. What do you recommend? Anything I need to do can be done between Windows/Linux or MacOS.
 

raqball

Contributor
Sep 11, 2016
2,257
9,467
Apple has the KB replacement policy for ALL of the MacBooks with the butterfly KB.. 4 years from purchase date, no Apple Care required..

If the KB is the only thing holding you back then I say get what you want and don't sweat it... The 2019 versions come with rev 4 of the KB I believe.. I have a 2019 13" and it's been fine so far but I've only had it for a few months...

Thinkpads are excellent machines and I've had several XI Carbons over the years. The Microsoft Surface line is also great. They do make a 15" Surface Laptop with an AMD chip but many are reporting issues with the 15" dues to gen 1 processor in those machines..

I prefer macOS but am tired of their trash updates and KB issues. I always have a MacBook because I do love macOS and I miss continuity and handoff that I lose when going to Windows.

Windows is very solid OS these days even if the Mac fans shout otherwise.

Good luck whatever you decide.
 

dpny

macrumors regular
Jan 5, 2013
224
68
Hey all, I'm thinking about buying a new 15" MBP for coding/general usage. I'm fairly interested in it, but I have concerns about the keyboard. I know that if I come into any issues with it, that Apple will cover the repair, but I don't want to deal with such a thing for the life of my potential usage of this computer(4-5+ years). I was either thinking of getting this MBP, a 2017 Macbook Air, or a Thinkpad 590 or X1 Extreme. What do you recommend? Anything I need to do can be done between Windows/Linux or MacOS.

In general I recommend everyone get AppleCare with a laptop. Something that travels with you is subject to the possibility of too much random damage. AC will cover any repairs, keyboard included.

Also, despite what it looks like here, the keyboard problem was never widespread. I've had two MBPs, a 2016 and my current 2018, and neither one has had an issue with the keyboard.
 
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faust

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Sep 11, 2007
382
173
Los Angeles, CA
In general I recommend everyone get AppleCare with a laptop. Something that travels with you is subject to the possibility of too much random damage. AC will cover any repairs, keyboard included.

Also, despite what it looks like here, the keyboard problem was never widespread. I've had two MBPs, a 2016 and my current 2018, and neither one has had an issue with the keyboard.

My concern is because I live in the high desert, and dust is an unavoidable fact of life.

Apple has the KB replacement policy for ALL of the MacBooks with the butterfly KB.. 4 years from purchase date, no Apple Care required..

If the KB is the only thing holding you back then I say get what you want and don't sweat it... The 2019 versions come with rev 4 of the KB I believe.. I have a 2019 13" and it's been fine so far but I've only had it for a few months...

Thinkpads are excellent machines and I've had several XI Carbons over the years. The Microsoft Surface line is also great. They do make a 15" Surface Laptop with an AMD chip but many are reporting issues with the 15" dues to gen 1 processor in those machines..

I prefer macOS but am tired of their trash updates and KB issues. I always have a MacBook because I do love macOS and I miss continuity and handoff that I lose when going to Windows.

Windows is very solid OS these days even if the Mac fans shout otherwise.

Good luck whatever you decide.

yeah, i'm torn because I genuinely enjoy Linux on my very aged System76 laptop, but I also want to play games/have decent battery life. I'm buying my computer at https://www.pcrichard.com/ through financing, so if you can point out a good computer it would be appreciated. I'm so torn, fuuuuck.
 

Howard2k

macrumors 68040
Mar 10, 2016
3,213
2,450
I wouldn’t buy the current generation because of the keyboard. 4 year warranty as mentioned, but then what? $750 bill to replace? And who would buy a used one thats three years gone? I imagine resale could be negatively impacted too.
 
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nbuubu

macrumors regular
Jun 15, 2010
188
58
Just to chime in, I wouldn't buy the current MBP primarily due to the keyboard. Not for its failure rates, but for its short key travel. It's just a painful keyboard for me to use and feels almost like typing on a hard iPad after a long time at the keys. You may like it as some people do, but definitely check it out in person and see if it's for you.

If the Thinkpad is a legit option for you I'd look long and hard at it. I find typing on those deep keys to be a responsive joy.
 

faust

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Sep 11, 2007
382
173
Los Angeles, CA
Just to chime in, I wouldn't buy the current MBP primarily due to the keyboard. Not for its failure rates, but for its short key travel. It's just a painful keyboard for me to use and feels almost like typing on a hard iPad after a long time at the keys. You may like it as some people do, but definitely check it out in person and see if it's for you.

If the Thinkpad is a legit option for you I'd look long and hard at it. I find typing on those deep keys to be a responsive joy.

Yeah, I've been trying them out for a couple years now, and the abysmal keyboard keeps keeping me away from splurging on one.

What do y'all think about the 2017 era Macbook Air? I don't need a ton of processing power, but at the price point I can grab it at $899, there are some alternatives. It's so ****ed that I'm considering a Surface laptop.
 

maflynn

Moderator
Staff member
May 3, 2009
68,602
36,327
Boston
Apple has the KB replacement policy for ALL of the MacBooks with the butterfly KB.. 4 years from purchase date, no Apple Care required..

Provided that you are planning on upgrading in 4 years the repair program will be useful. If the OP plans on holding onto the laptop for more then 4 years he could possibly be facing expensive repairs
 
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nbuubu

macrumors regular
Jun 15, 2010
188
58
I tried out the new Surface Laptop 3 at Costco yesterday, next to a Thinkpad X1 and Dell XPS, all three across from a row of Macbooks.

The difference in keyboard quality (to my tastes) is like night and day. I despise typing on the Butterfly-keyboard macs and it's a real shame, because I'd prefer the taller aspect ratio of a Mac and most PC laptops tend to be 16:9.

Surface Pro 3 had a great, tall screen. Really well made and light and sure, it's plastic, but it felt solid. Just wish it had a stronger GPU option.
 

nStyle

macrumors 65816
Dec 6, 2009
1,269
484
It's not that I like or dislike the keyboard...I just don't really think about it after I'm used to it. I can get used to pretty much any keyboard. If anything, the prior generation's keyboards now seem mushy and sloppy compared to the quickness and tightness of the butterfly keyboard. But if I went back to the old generation, I would get used to it and, again, not care.

As far as reliability concerns on the latest models? I'm not even a little bit worried. A 4-year warranty means they are extremely confident in it.
 
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Fishrrman

macrumors Core
Feb 20, 2009
22,640
8,518
maflynn wrote:
"Provided that you are planning on upgrading in 4 years the repair program will be useful. If the OP plans on holding onto the laptop for more then 4 years he could possibly be facing expensive repairs"

Eventually, this is going to become a problem with ALL MBP's made between 2016-2020.

As each and every MPB passes "the 4-year mark", it becomes vulnerable to an $800 repair at any time, with such repairs becoming more likely the longer it's used.

Who (at least who among those who know of this problem) would BUY a used 2016-2020 MBP that is "out of the repair program"????
 
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triangletechie

macrumors 65816
Apr 21, 2017
1,016
1,745
NC
I've been using a 2018 13" MBP daily for 9 months and have not once encountered a keyboard issue. I recently just bought the 2019 15" MBP and love it. I think there's plenty of people out there who don't have keyboard issues. You'll only hear about the ones that do.
 

maflynn

Moderator
Staff member
May 3, 2009
68,602
36,327
Boston
I think there's plenty of people out there who don't have keyboard issues. You'll only hear about the ones that do.
No question, but that doesn't minimize the issue. The keyboard has shown itself as not being reliable, so much so that Apple has a repair program that covers 2016 to 2019 laptops for 4 years. So while there will be people who never incur a problem, it is prudent for consumers to weigh all of the information at hand and make an informed decision on whether it's worth the risk, and there is risk associated with spending nearly 3,000 for this laptop.
 

kp98077

macrumors 68020
Oct 26, 2010
2,135
970
there are no issues w 2019 basically so buy it, a fine computer!!!!!!!!!
 

Nacho98

Suspended
Jul 11, 2019
729
673
Put it this way, I spent $1750 + tax for a brand new mid-2015 last November to replace my mid-2010. I'll ride that until Apple gets it together in the keyboard department.
 

Glockworkorange

Suspended
Feb 10, 2015
2,511
4,181
Chicago, Illinois
In general I recommend everyone get AppleCare with a laptop. Something that travels with you is subject to the possibility of too much random damage. AC will cover any repairs, keyboard included.

Also, despite what it looks like here, the keyboard problem was never widespread. I've had two MBPs, a 2016 and my current 2018, and neither one has had an issue with the keyboard.
I agree. I’ve bitten the bullet & picked up AppleCare on every laptop for the past several purchases. I’ve used it once, and it saved me the cost of a new machine.
 
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