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Should I choose 11" or 13"?

about the screen...

slo82 said:
first time poster and sorry its not of much value to most.

I just have to vent, i have never sat on the fence for so long undecided... i cant choose between 11" or 13" air, i have a n Asus G73J for all my M$ Grunt work but that laptop is far from portable due to weight and battery life, i have never owned a Mac buy love the portability of these things...

11" slightly smaller = slightly more portable

13" more battery life and more screen realestate,

i was sold on the 13" until i found out about the screen angels and colour issue etc...

i want to mainly use it as the take everywhere device an i believe they all are capable of this... guess it comes down to personal preference on is the screen really that bad... all this machine will be used for is web surfing youtube included, emails etc as well as html and css editing via notebook, ill save photo editing for the fat ass G73J

so how bad are the screens? viewing angels etc...
Click to expand...

The screen is actually pretty good. I have a 24" IPS screen that I use for critical photo editing. It has really accurate colors and excellent viewing angle. I am familiar with what a good display is. My 13" MBA doesn't have the same viewing angle, or probably the same color accuracy, but using it for typical laptop duty which is viewing web pages, photos, and text it looks pretty good. Granted, if I were to edit photos on it I would definitely take a closer look at it to make sure it's good enough for that purpose. And even then, it depends on how critical you have to be with your editing. I used to spent hours on a single photo: then you want to have the best reasonable equipment. On the other hand, if you just want your work to be good enough (again, nothing is absolute even with the best equipment that money can buy, so "good enough" varies widely for different people and application), then perhaps the MBA is all you need.

My standard is pretty high, and I think the MBA screen is pretty decent for all around use. Certainly I would love for it to be as good as my 24" IPS screen, but the way it is now it doesn't really impact my productivity or my enjoyment of the MBA.
 
For me, I have the 13" and just ordered an 11" for my wife. Though, when it comes, I'll have to see which one I keep for myself :). The comparison as I see it is:

MC969LL/A vs MC 965LL/A
11.6" vs 13.3"
1366 x 768 vs 1440 x 900
1.6 i5 vs 1.7 i5 (per geekbench, are the scores really 19% faster for 1.7 i5 though?)
no SD slot vs SD slot
4 hrs vs 5 hrs battery (Apple says 5 vs 7, but I've read otherwise)
Same 4 GB RAM
Same 128 GB SSD
2.3 lb vs 2.9 lb

She's used to the 13" 2010 MBA so not sure yet if she'll think the 11" is too small. But for me, I'm on the fence which I'd prefer. If not out or on the couch, I'll probably have it connected to my 24" monitor on my desk anyway. Decisions...
 
dmk1974 said:
If not out or on the couch, I'll probably have it connected to my 24" monitor on my desk anyway. Decisions...
Click to expand...
Join the club!

Be sure to come back here and share your thoughts and observations once you've got both sizes to play with.
 
I had the 2010 13" MBA for about 6 months. I traded it in for the new 2011 11" i5. I wanted to upgrade but could not justify swapping 13" machines in 6 months. But going more portable to the 11" smoothed my guilt.

After almost a month with the 11 inch, I really like the size. I do not miss the 13" screen and since I carry my laptop with me every work day I find it an added bonus.

I think it is something you have to experience for a few days to find if it is a fit for you. Both machines are great. This revision I picked the right machine for me. The next revision, I will see what they have to offer.
 
Man this issue has got me now as well :rolleyes:

For as long as the 11" was out, I wanted one. Mainly because i love my ipad and I'd love a computer as small as that. But I was only in the position to get one a few months before the new ones came out, so I decided to wait. I bought an old MacBook 13" off a colleague to carry me over.

Now that they're out I've ordered the 11". But I've been doing a lot of Xcode lately and I'm getting used to that 13" screen. I hope I'll be able to adjust to the 11". Luckily Xcode 4 is very horizontally oriented now (lots of slide-out panes on both sides) so the 16:9 aspect ratio will work better than 16:10. But I think I will miss the vertical space, even on the 1280x800 I have now it sometimes feels like editing code while looking through a toilet roll. Also the ergonomics of the 13 are better, the cursor keys are ever so slightly bigger.

Of course I spent ages in various shops but it only made it harder to choose. I'm just letting the 11" arrive and going to work on it for a few days, luckily I ordered from Apple direct so I can return it if I want the 13" after all. But boy is this a tough dilemma :) Don't think I've ever been on the fence this much about a technology purchase.
 
GekkePrutser said:
Man this issue has got me now as well :rolleyes:

the 1280x800 I have now it sometimes feels like editing code while looking through a toilet roll.

But boy is this a tough dilemma :) Don't think I've ever been on the fence this much about a technology purchase.
Click to expand...

looking through a toilet roll as you put it is exactly what im worried about, i think id have trouble getting used to the 16:9 screen. also yep this is a toughy,

im going to have to go into a few shops later today to hopefully test drive each respectively and the sales person well want to be patient cos im taking my time HAHAHAHA
 
GekkePrutser said:
But I think I will miss the vertical space, even on the 1280x800 I have now it sometimes feels like editing code while looking through a toilet roll.
Click to expand...

I bought the 11" thinking it would be for my niche mobile needs, but it has now supplanted my MBP 17" as my primary Xcode machine.

While on the MBP 17" I was gloriously ignorant of the hot keys necessary to maximize screen efficiency, hitting ^-cmd F for the full screen mode and my set key bindings to eliminate the toolbar allows me to easily maximize screen real estate on the 11".

I am completely in awe of this machine and believe (as I had written in multiple other threads) that the 11" is a little too large. I think Apple could have made more compromises on screen size to improve mobility even further. A laptop that is truly compromised to optimize mobility should not have so easily replaced my 17" MBP as a primary machine for the home. It's still a good problem to have.
 
Really depends on what you really need, but 11 inch should fit your needs if you want the portability
 
VMMan said:
I bought the 11" thinking it would be for my niche mobile needs, but it has now supplanted my MBP 17" as my primary Xcode machine.

While on the MBP 17" I was gloriously ignorant of the hot keys necessary to maximize screen efficiency, hitting ^-cmd F for the full screen mode and my set key bindings to eliminate the toolbar allows me to easily maximize screen real estate on the 11".

I am completely in awe of this machine and believe (as I had written in multiple other threads) that the 11" is a little too large. I think Apple could have made more compromises on screen size to improve mobility even further. A laptop that is truly compromised to optimize mobility should not have so easily replaced my 17" MBP as a primary machine for the home. It's still a good problem to have.
Click to expand...

Hi VMMan, I may have asked you before in other threads but just to refresh my memory - do you ever find the palm rest a little small/short so that you have to curl your fingers in even just a little to type comfortably and position your hands without the bottom edge digging into your wrists/palms? And does the shorter trackpad make it a little more uncomfortable to use in comparison to something larger?

I also came from a 17" MBP to an 11" but I have to state that those issues I wrote above are totally more comfortable on a larger area like the 17", would you agree? Does the 11" make it more cramped in comparison in usage for you or do you really find it to be 1:1 ratio in terms of usage comfort between the two for palm rest and trackpad?
 
DieterRams said:
Hi VMMan, I may have asked you before in other threads but just to refresh my memory - do you ever find the palm rest a little small/short so that you have to curl your fingers in even just a little to type comfortably and position your hands without the bottom edge digging into your wrists/palms? And does the shorter trackpad make it a little more uncomfortable to use in comparison to something larger?

I also came from a 17" MBP to an 11" but I have to state that those issues I wrote above are totally more comfortable on a larger area like the 17", would you agree? Does the 11" make it more cramped in comparison in usage for you or do you really find it to be 1:1 ratio in terms of usage comfort between the two for palm rest and trackpad?
Click to expand...

I think you did ask me that on a different thread. I do curl my fingers a bit, but I don't seem to notice it as it's become instinctive now. The trackpad is smaller than is optimal when using the 3 finger gestures.

Since you have the 11" now, you can judge for yourself if this is problematic. I don't mind these compromises and would have gladly paid more for an even smaller MBA.
 
Also, is there a recommended cheap SD card reader that can read larger SDHC cards out there (in the event that I decide to stick with the 11" that doesn't have a slot)? Thanks!
 
VMMan said:
I think you did ask me that on a different thread. I do curl my fingers a bit, but I don't seem to notice it as it's become instinctive now. The trackpad is smaller than is optimal when using the 3 finger gestures.

Since you have the 11" now, you can judge for yourself if this is problematic. I don't mind these compromises and would have gladly paid more for an even smaller MBA.
Click to expand...

Hm I see, so you are basically saying that you do actually find it to be more cramped than a larger area like the 17", and does lower your comfort as compared to the 17" but you don't mind it as you have adapted to it and have gotten used to it and enjoy the small size. Do I have that right?

How often do you travel with it? Do you use it mostly on your lap (non-stable surface) or on a desk (stable)? Apologies if I've asked before. And why did you decide to purchase an 11" in the first place? Especially when you already had your 17"?

As for me, I have always wanted a super small/slim laptop and this fits the bill nicely. However, the issues with the finger curling when typing in order to keep my wrists from being dug into by the edge, and gestures being a little more awkward to perform on a shorter trackpad are weighing on me. I knew these issues coming in (so I bought one to test more thoroughly over time) but I have not yet adapted to them as you have. I thought I had a day or so ago after some extensive use but after using my office iMac all day and then coming home to this, the moment I put my hands on the keyboard to type and curl my fingers in some more with feeling the edge ever so slightly dig into the very back heel of my palms, it makes me aware/conscious that "this is small". Not really a good constant impression if this is going to always happen. Same goes for the screen - the 16:9 ratio suddenly makes me notice I need to look downward more, as opposed to just a day ago when I thought I was used to it. Maybe I'll adapt like you... as I said, I thought I had adapted mostly... but it's come up again. Perhaps I won't be able to adapt as quickly as my two week return period allows, which will definitely suck. If that happens, I may go 13" as I'll have no choice.
 
Dieter, it sounds like you might wanna return the 11, buy the 13, then decide which you REALLY prefer.

I'm no longer quite as sure about switching to Mac from Windows. But in your case, I think trying both sizes makes sense at this point, just to be sure.
 
So far had a 17", got the 13" MBA and think now the 11" would be even better!

If you don't need much real estate on the screen for graphics and such, go for the even more portable 11".
 
Sounds Good said:
Dieter, it sounds like you might wanna return the 11, buy the 13, then decide which you REALLY prefer.
Click to expand...

Be careful with that though... I bought the 11" deciding I'd try it out to see if I could get used to the small screen (and gain the portability).

However because I ordered a U.S. keyboard it now shows up as 'not eligible for return' on Apple's website. Great :/ It smugly points to their Sales and Returns Policies which mention nothing about Configure To Order products being ineligible (I checked this before ordering anyway, it never says anywhere that those can't be returned). Well I assume it's because the US keyboard anyway because there's nothing else weird about my order (i5, 128GB).

So I'll probably have to drag myself through a long tough discussion with Apple support to get it returned, not looking forward to that :( I don't think they can get away with not letting me return it in the end because it really doesn't state this anywhere. Just want to point out that the 'just try it and return it' is not always a hassle-free method of deciding on a particular model.

By the way it doesn't really bother me on a desk, the screen is fine then because I can sit very close to it, and I don't really rest my hands on the wrist rest anyway. But when I have it on my lap the screen is so far away that the small screen and high DPI makes it very clumsy to do anything useful with. I end up zooming in so far that I have very little useable screen space left.

Edit: I've done some more digging on their site and it says right here

Returns are subject to Apple's Sales and Refunds Policy. If you change your mind, you can return your Standard or Configured-to-Order hardware to us within 14 calendar days of delivery. Software returns are also accepted within this period, but only if the software package is unopened.

So I don't know what they're on about with this 'not eligible' stuff but I'll just hold this against them and I assume that should finish any argument. I hope :)
 
Last edited:
Sounds Good said:
Dieter, it sounds like you might wanna return the 11, buy the 13, then decide which you REALLY prefer.

I'm no longer quite as sure about switching to Mac from Windows. But in your case, I think trying both sizes makes sense at this point, just to be sure.
Click to expand...

Yea, I actually went by the Apple store (again) and took a look at the 13"... I have to say, I was pretty blown away by the difference in size after using the 11" primarily. Now when I look at the 13", it looks big. The vertical space that extends past the 11" screen makes it look almost too top-heavy! And the narrower screen on the 13", as compared to the 11", feels cramped (width-wise)! I couldn't actually believe I felt this way. But I suppose it makes sense after using the 11" as a primary machine. I guess I'd get used to the 13" if I started using that more but I was surprised at how I felt.

However, the palm rest and trackpad are both more comfortable on the 13" for sure. More room to rest my hands on and more breathing room for gestures on the trackpad. That can't really be disputed. Screen size seems to be adaptable either way, apparently. This decision is getting tougher and tougher, even after owning one of them.

cyberone said:
So far had a 17", got the 13" MBA and think now the 11" would be even better!

If you don't need much real estate on the screen for graphics and such, go for the even more portable 11".
Click to expand...

Yes, but I do some graphics stuff with CS5 apps like Fireworks and Photoshop. So what does this mean then?

GekkePrutser said:
Be careful with that though... I bought the 11" deciding I'd try it out to see if I could get used to the small screen (and gain the portability).

However because I ordered a U.S. keyboard it now shows up as 'not eligible for return' on Apple's website. Great :/ It smugly points to their Sales and Returns Policies which mention nothing about Configure To Order products being ineligible (I checked this before ordering anyway, it never says anywhere that those can't be returned). Well I assume it's because the US keyboard anyway because there's nothing else weird about my order (i5, 128GB).
Click to expand...

That doesn't make sense - why would a US keyboard be a weird part of your order? Seems pretty normal... and are you talking about a separate bluetooth keyboard? Or the US keyboard layout of the MBA? If it's the latter, I don't understand why you need to specify that if you're ordering from the US site; doesn't it just assume you want a US layout?

Anyway, I'm pretty sure you'll be able to return it. Anything within two weeks is returnable as long as it's not damaged or something. Another option is just taking it into a physical Apple store with a printout of your receipt.
 
"And the narrower screen on the 13", as compared to the 11", feels cramped (width-wise)"

Really? But it's 1440 and 13" vs 1366 and 11". It *should* feel much WIDER, right?
 
If the money isn't the main concern then I would go with the 13" just because the Air is made to make no compromise on portability which I think is already perfectly achieved on the 13".

As a second laptop for pure traveling a 11" could be chosen.
 
DieterRams said:
That doesn't make sense - why would a US keyboard be a weird part of your order? Seems pretty normal... and are you talking about a separate bluetooth keyboard? Or the US keyboard layout of the MBA? If it's the latter, I don't understand why you need to specify that if you're ordering from the US site; doesn't it just assume you want a US layout?

Anyway, I'm pretty sure you'll be able to return it. Anything within two weeks is returnable as long as it's not damaged or something. Another option is just taking it into a physical Apple store with a printout of your receipt.
Click to expand...

I meant the US keyboard part was the only thing that made it CTO in the first place (I'm in Ireland so that's not standard)

Unfortunately we don't have physical Apple stores in this country, surprising as Apple has their European headquarters here in Cork. But I guess they don't expect anyone to have money for Macs here anymore :D

Anyway I'll have another play with it over the weekend before I decide whether or not to call them. But I think it will be Ok to return it now too, I was just a bit shocked when I saw the 'not eligible' thing on the website :)
 
Just as an update: I did decide to return the 11". I extensively worked on it for a few days but I kept leaning forward too far to read the tiny text. I tried to make the fonts bigger but you can only change the font in certain parts of each application, not everywhere. Too bad Apple cancelled resolution independence, it would have helped here. But, bigger text means the 11" screen is full even quicker.

One thing I tried was to set the resolution to 1280x720 of course it was burry then because it's lower than native but that has almost the same DPI as the 13" screen. This was already a big improvement in readability.

I found these things didn't really show in the store when I compared them there because I tend to observe the laptop very closely in the shop so the small font wasn't an issue. But when actually working on it in a normal sitting position, I couldn't really get used to it. The glossyness didn't help either.

I'm debating now whether to go for the 13", although the DPI is still very high on that one.

Anyway I called apple and they made no fuss about the return at all. They weren't sure why the website labeled it as 'ineligible', but it was eligible and is going back now. Just wanted to update this thread in case someone is having the same problem.
 
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