Situation with my former employer and bank today (need opinions)

[The.316]

For the last four years, I have been working part time at an electronics store here where I live, mostly to have something to do from time to time. Yesterday I was told that he couldnt afford to pay me anymore, so I would be let go. He did give me something like a severance pay, which is a percentage of my pay calculated by what I make a month and by how many years I have been working there. That was 2075€. Here in Greece, we get bonuses three times a year; half our monthly pay during Easter, half our monthly pay when we take a vacation, and 100% of our pay during Christmas. I was making 700€ a month there, so he added 350€ for the Easter bonus to the 2075€, and 350€ for the vacation bonus to the 2075€. Then, I had 25 days of vacation time this year, which he has to pay, so that is another 700€ he paid. So in total, counting the change, it came out to 3507€. He deposited that, along with the 700€ for my time last month, which equals around 4200€.

Now, here is where it gets interesting. His wife went to the bank yesterday around 1pm to deposit that money, and as soon as she came back to the store, I went to the bank to see what was deposited, and the total was that 4200€ number. I went to the bank this morning, and took out 500€ from my account, and the statement said that I had 3500€, so I was short 200€, 187€ to be exact. After looking over the pay stubs that I signed for the severance package, the total was suppose to be 4013€, which is 187€ less than the 4200€. What happened was, he deposited the whole bonus for Easter, when it should have been prorated because I only worked two months this year, and Easter here in Greece is in May. So he deposited more money than he should have, then removed it.

Now, I understand that he made a mistake, but he deposited 4200€ into my account, which is now my money. He noticed the mistake two hours after his wife deposited the money, went to the bank, spoke to one of the managers there, and they removed the money from my account without notifying me, or without me present to sign anything. Wouldnt that be considered illegal? How can a bank go into my account, without my authorization, and remove money? I dont have any loans with this bank, as I only used it to have my pay deposited, so I didnt have any balances to pay. I know that its only 187€, but what is really bothering me the most is what I just said, that I was not present when this transaction occurred with MY account. This is like me going to the bank and asking for Bill Gates' money without his consent, or even awareness. Im going to go to the bank on Monday and see what exactly went on, but Im actually thinking about going to my lawyer first, and see what he has to say. Thoughts?

 

[anonymouslurker]

...This is like me going to the bank and asking for Bill Gates' money without his consent, or even awareness...

Sure, if you deposited that money into his account in the first place.

 

[smithrh]

EU (and Greek) Banking law is certainly different than here in the US, but over here, if you sign up for direct deposit, you're typically also signing up your employer to be able to take funds out in order to correct pay mistakes.

Most people don't notice this provision, but it's there, basically for situations like this.

 

[Aspasia]

I know nothing about Greek banking law, however from a purely ethical point of view, as a result of a scrivener's error you were overpaid.

Since you did nothing to earn the money, your former employer has every right to get his money back.

As to hiring a lawyer, how were you damaged? You received what you were entitled to.

 

[The.316]

EU (and Greek) Banking law is certainly different than here in the US, but over here, if you sign up for direct deposit, you're typically also signing up your employer to be able to take funds out in order to correct pay mistakes.

Most people don't notice this provision, but it's there, basically for situations like this.

Well it really isnt direct deposit, my boss' wife deposited the money. Sometimes she would go, or I even went sometimes to give the money to the guy at the bank.

I know nothing about Greek banking law, however from a purely ethical point of view, as a result of a scrivener's error you were overpaid.

Since you did nothing to earn the money, your former employer has every right to get his money back.

As to hiring a lawyer, how were you damaged? You received what you were entitled to.

Its not about the money. If he paid me more than he should have, then he should have called me to let me know, and we would have either met at the bank together, or I would have taken the money out myself. What Im confused about is how they can access my account, and remove money that was deposited hours before, without my consent. If I would have went to your bank Aspasia, and deposited $200 into your account, I cant go back later that day and say, "Hey, I made a mistake, could I have $100 back?" That is what Im trying to figure out.

 

[dukebound85]

Why are you up in arms about him/the bank correcting the mistake? Most likely/almost certainly, it is legal when it comes to corrections and whatnot concerning pay advices by an employer.

Of all things...Would you rather have "benefited" from this or what exactly is the issue?

Somewhat astonished you are even contemplating going to a lawyer over this honestly. The cost of this would eat into the difference rather quickly, not to mention give bad blood.

So let's play this out...... what if the law says you are in the right. What are you then going to do? Claim the money is yours when you didn't earn it? Once again, what are you hoping to accomplish?


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I know nothing about Greek banking law, however from a purely ethical point of view, as a result of a scrivener's error you were overpaid.

Since you did nothing to earn the money, your former employer has every right to get his money back.

As to hiring a lawyer, how were you damaged? You received what you were entitled to.

Exactly my thoughts.

 

[Jessica Lares]

My dad has had this happen to him before. I think it was that they accidentally deposited everyone's paychecks into his account or something similar.

This is legal. If you don't understand why the money was revoked, you should talk to your employer. But yes, it is legal and it happens all the time.

 

[mobilehaathi]

Its not about the money. If he paid me more than he should have, then he should have called me to let me know, and we would have either met at the bank together, or I would have taken the money out myself. What Im confused about is how they can access my account, and remove money that was deposited hours before, without my consent. If I would have went to your bank Aspasia, and deposited $200 into your account, I cant go back later that day and say, "Hey, I made a mistake, could I have $100 back?" That is what Im trying to figure out.

Dude, either drop it or talk to a lawyer familiar with Greek law. No one here can tell you the legality of what you describe (even someone purporting to be a Greek Layer). A few people have proposed plausible explanations. I rather fail to see the point in continuing to ask the Internet to explain a problem it can't answer.

 

[wordoflife]

It sounds strange to me, but I doubt that it is illegal. I don't think the bank would risk getting in trouble for that.

 

[The.316]

Dude, either drop it or talk to a lawyer familiar with Greek law. No one here can tell you the legality of what you describe (even someone purporting to be a Greek Layer). A few people have proposed plausible explanations. I rather fail to see the point in continuing to ask the Internet to explain a problem it can't answer.

"Dude," it was a question that was posted in a whopping two posts. Are there pages of pages of it here? If you dont care for the matter, what is the point of posting your irrelevant comments? Out of everything that is posted in the Community Forum, you come and bitch about a thread that is six replies long
I was asking for other posters -->OPINIONS<--- which one usually does in a forum.

 

[725032]

You're lucky you got paid what you did imo.

You live in an unemployment hot spot and a lot of employers would try to not pay you anything at all.

 

[Zombie Acorn]

In the US they would have gave you two weeks to pack your **** up and go.

 

[malman89]

In the US they would have gave you two weeks to pack your **** up and go.

Not even two weeks in some cases.

A girl at work tried to give her two weeks just before Christmas and they just said nah and told her to leave immediately.

 

[designs216]

Here in the US in the corporate world, employees are often escorted from the building immediately after they are given the news of termination with a quick stop by the work area to gather personal effects under close supervision. Occasionally there is severance but often not. In my view, you should be grateful you got anything beyond the boot. Yes, your former boss retrieved his money without your consent but it was his money. Don't make a stink, you may need his recommendation.

 

[Scepticalscribe]

"Dude," it was a question that was posted in a whopping two posts. Are there pages of pages of it here? If you dont care for the matter, what is the point of posting your irrelevant comments? Out of everything that is posted in the Community Forum, you come and bitch about a thread that is six replies long
I was asking for other posters -->OPINIONS<--- which one usually does in a forum.

OP: You asked for opinions and it appears to me that - by your response quoted above - you do not seem to care much for the tone (and content) of the replies. When asking for advice, it is usually a reasonably good idea to pay heed to what people have taken the trouble to write by way of reply, and to respond to them courteously.

Nevertheless, and more to the point, I think it is worth noting that not one single reply thinks you have any sort of serious case. Moreover, I am totally at a loss as to what you think you can possibly achieve by going to law over this. You have no case worth speaking of on the facts that you have outlined here. And, you need to ask yourself what you hope to achieve from taking any sort of action? An apology? Restitution? Restitution for what?

Rather, instead, it strikes me that you are angry, possibly over the termination of your contract, or the general gloomy outlook in Greece, and are possibly expressing that anger instead over the withdrawal of money from your account.

For what it is worth, it seems to me that you were treated quite correctly by your boss, and your rights and entitlements have been acknowledged and met. As a number of posters have already pointed out (citing US examples, governed by US labour law), individuals dismissed, or whose contracts were terminated in the US would enjoy considerably fewer rights than those in Europe, even in economies that have been in conditions of crisis for the past few years.

In any case, if this action upsets you still, the only reasonable course of action I can suggest is that you contact your former boss, and explain that you are unhappy that he was able to remove money (his own admittedly) from your account without consulting with you and that you might or would appreciate, in the unlikely event of these circumstances ever being repeated, being consulted on such a matter in the future.

 

[Happybunny]

For the last four years, I have been working part time at an electronics store here where I live, mostly to have something to do from time to time. Yesterday I was told that he couldnt afford to pay me anymore, so I would be let go. He did give me something like a severance pay, which is a percentage of my pay calculated by what I make a month and by how many years I have been working there. That was 2075€. Here in Greece, we get bonuses three times a year; half our monthly pay during Easter, half our monthly pay when we take a vacation, and 100% of our pay during Christmas. I was making 700€ a month there, so he added 350€ for the Easter bonus to the 2075€, and 350€ for the vacation bonus to the 2075€. Then, I had 25 days of vacation time this year, which he has to pay, so that is another 700€ he paid. So in total, counting the change, it came out to 3507€. He deposited that, along with the 700€ for my time last month, which equals around 4200€.

Now, here is where it gets interesting. His wife went to the bank yesterday around 1pm to deposit that money, and as soon as she came back to the store, I went to the bank to see what was deposited, and the total was that 4200€ number. I went to the bank this morning, and took out 500€ from my account, and the statement said that I had 3500€, so I was short 200€, 187€ to be exact. After looking over the pay stubs that I signed for the severance package, the total was suppose to be 4013€, which is 187€ less than the 4200€. What happened was, he deposited the whole bonus for Easter, when it should have been prorated because I only worked two months this year, and Easter here in Greece is in May. So he deposited more money than he should have, then removed it.

Now, I understand that he made a mistake, but he deposited 4200€ into my account, which is now my money. He noticed the mistake two hours after his wife deposited the money, went to the bank, spoke to one of the managers there, and they removed the money from my account without notifying me, or without me present to sign anything. Wouldnt that be considered illegal? How can a bank go into my account, without my authorization, and remove money? I dont have any loans with this bank, as I only used it to have my pay deposited, so I didnt have any balances to pay. I know that its only 187€, but what is really bothering me the most is what I just said, that I was not present when this transaction occurred with MY account. This is like me going to the bank and asking for Bill Gates' money without his consent, or even awareness. Im going to go to the bank on Monday and see what exactly went on, but Im actually thinking about going to my lawyer first, and see what he has to say. Thoughts?

I read this and then re-read it you have no problem with your ex-employer. It's your bank that you should direct your anger against.

 

[mobilehaathi]

"Dude," it was a question that was posted in a whopping two posts. Are there pages of pages of it here? If you dont care for the matter, what is the point of posting your irrelevant comments? Out of everything that is posted in the Community Forum, you come and bitch about a thread that is six replies long
I was asking for other posters -->OPINIONS<--- which one usually does in a forum.

Let's re-tell the story slightly and decide if you should still be cranky about a fictitious wrong.

You signed your dismissal papers and agreed to receive severance of 4013€. Your employer's agent goes to the bank and deposits 4200€. On realizing the mistake, your employer's agent goes back to the bank with a copy of the signed dismissal papers and any paperwork from the deposit, explains the error, and the bank corrects it.

Was there something technically illegal about that? Maybe. Was everyone acting in good faith? Yep. Were you harmed by any of it? Nope.

If you want to be litigious for the sake of being litigious, I suggest you move to the US. Your employer may treat you like utter crap in comparison, but you can sue just about anyone at the drop of a hat.

 

[Macky-Mac]

....Was there something technically illegal about that? Maybe. ...

or maybe not....if this had happened in the USA the employers wife would have taken a check to the bank, not cash.......and upon realizing their error she returned and told the bank they were going to put a stop payment order on the first check that was incorrect and given them a new check for the correct amount......but of course we don't know the details.

And if it had happened in the USA, many banks would show the check as a deposit but until it actually cleared, it wouldn't a completed transaction.....but again we don't know the details so we're just guessing

 

[kolax]

I can understand where the OP is coming from - I would be concerned if funds were corrected without my knowledge.

Mistakes happen, and of course, if I got paid more than I was entitled to, I'd happily oblige to correct the mistake. However, to not be notified of the mistake and correction is concerning and I wonder whether fraudsters could take advantage.

OP - this is an issue with your bank, rather than your former employer. Don't screw up your relationship with him. As others have said, you'll need him as a reference for future jobs.

 

[mobilehaathi]

or maybe not....if this had happened in the USA the employers wife would have taken a check to the bank, not cash.......and upon realizing their error she returned and told the bank they were going to put a stop payment order on the first check that was incorrect and given them a new check for the correct amount......but of course we don't know the details.

And if it had happened in the USA, many banks would show the check as a deposit but until it actually cleared, it wouldn't a completed transaction.....but again we don't know the details so we're just guessing

Agreed. No harm has been done, and it isn't even clear that what happened was illegal. Best to let it go.

 

[The.316]

I read this and then re-read it you have no problem with your ex-employer. It's your bank that you should direct your anger against.

Oh I know, and that is where my issue lies, with the bank. But my ex-boss was slimy like that, he did a lot of things behind our backs that was just wrong. A lot of things go on here that would not go on in the States.

Let's re-tell the story slightly and decide if you should still be cranky about a fictitious wrong.

You signed your dismissal papers and agreed to receive severance of 4013€. Your employer's agent goes to the bank and deposits 4200€. On realizing the mistake, your employer's agent goes back to the bank with a copy of the signed dismissal papers and any paperwork from the deposit, explains the error, and the bank corrects it.

Was there something technically illegal about that? Maybe. Was everyone acting in good faith? Yep. Were you harmed by any of it? Nope.

If you want to be litigious for the sake of being litigious, I suggest you move to the US. Your employer may treat you like utter crap in comparison, but you can sue just about anyone at the drop of a hat.

I am a Greek-American. I was born in the States, and lived in South Florida until I was 30. Ive only been here five years. I was a store manager for Verizon Wireless, so I know exactly how business in the US works, and believe me, work here is like the stone age in the States. Some of the laws here are ridiculous, but what is worse, is that they dont even enforce half of them.

Listen, I dont care about the amount of money that was removed, just how it was removed. There is no direct deposit here, everything is done with cash or check in hand. My cousins husband is a manager for Eurobank here where I live, and he told me that what they did was illegal, and someone could lose their job for it, and even face jail time. Now I really dont want it to come to that, but how am I suppose to have any type of trust in a establishment like that bank, when they can go into my account whenever they want, and remove money, which is what they did. Im heading over to the bank first think Monday morning to see what exactly went on. Im sure everyone here is anxiously awaiting what actually happened lol

 

[malman89]

Listen, I dont care about the amount of money that was removed, just how it was removed. There is no direct deposit here, everything is done with cash or check in hand. My cousins husband is a manager for Eurobank here where I live, and he told me that what they did was illegal, and someone could lose their job for it, and even face jail time. Now I really dont want it to come to that, but how am I suppose to have any type of trust in a establishment like that bank, when they can go into my account whenever they want, and remove money, which is what they did. Im heading over to the bank first think Monday morning to see what exactly went on. Im sure everyone here is anxiously awaiting what actually happened lol

At least in the U.S., there's a difference between 'your money' and 'payroll funds' and what employers and banks can/can't do. Those funds weren't 'your money,' but payroll funds from your company in your account.

Maybe your former boss had to have initiated something like an ACH pull/withdrawal, but even then, they don't need to notify you. We had our payroll company do that before when we accidentally paid a terminated associate who wasn't terminated in our payroll system. Block their funds and then pull them back. Payroll rules are funny on when you need to give notice or issue payroll deduction forms to be signed. For instance, we overpay someone for 2 hours one week? We can just pay them hours-2 next week and don't need to tell them (though we do since it's just a common courtesy).