So I talked to an Apple genius...

[Krazy Bill]

...asked him if changing out an SSD in the rMBP voids the warranty. He said "Yes". I asked how he would know if I swapped back the original SSD before bringing it in? The little bastard smirked and said, "We will know".

Ok, so the kid was enjoying his little power trip and I let it go. But evidently there's something written somewhere about this or he wouldn't have been so quick to answer.

Can anyone show me this? I can't find the warranty clause that specifically states this.

 

[sick z33]

The SSD is soldered onto the board, is it not?

 

[Interstella5555]

...asked him if changing out an SSD in the rMBP voids the warranty. He said "Yes". I asked how he would know if I swapped back the original SSD before bringing it in? The little bastard smirked and said, "We will know".

Ok, so the kid was enjoying his little power trip and I let it go. But evidently there's something written somewhere about this or he wouldn't have been so quick to answer.

Can anyone show me this? I can't find the warranty clause that specifically states this.

(shrugs) So? If you want to knowingly void the warranty, do it. I'm also not sure how they were being a bastard by answering your question.

 

[Gav2k]

The SSD is soldered onto the board, is it not?

No it's a blade ssd like the air but a different shape.

As for warranty when you open the machine it is void simple. Will they be able to tell? Well if you foul a screw head then yes. Otherwise be careful and they won't know the difference!!

 

[Zedsdead185]

Well, even if the inside has been messed about a bit it doesn't matter too much. I once sent my older macbook pro in for repairs for the second time since purchasing it. The next day I got a call from apple asking if I had ever opened it myself or got an unauthorised repair on it, which I had done neither. I had only sent it in to the genius bar once before. Apparently, it turned out that the 'genius' that previously repaired the machine had forget to put a bunch of screws back in and the magnetic coating protection sheet back in! They didn't question me any more than that on the phone though. Once I told them that I had only taken it for a repair their once, they were fine with that and replaced all of the missing parts for me.

 

[Krazy Bill]

(shrugs) So? If you want to knowingly void the warranty, do it.

Personally, I don't think upgrading the SSD myself is grounds for voiding work on everything else inside the machine. Morally, I feel the same way so I'd like to find a way around it.

I'm also not sure how they were being a bastard by answering your question.

You had to be there.

Will they be able to tell? Well if you foul a screw head then yes. Otherwise be careful and they won't know the difference!!

Not sure if there are lock-tight seals around the screws though.

 

[Zedsdead185]

Personally, I don't think upgrading the SSD myself is grounds for voiding work on everything else inside the machine. Morally, I feel the same way so I'd like to find a way around it.

So what if you were inexperienced at this sort of thing and shorted out or caused some sort of damage to a component within the machine? Then you would expect apple to fix it, and why should they when it was you that broke it?

This is obviously a scenario covering the majority of computer users out there. Don't think I'm insulting your intelligence by suggesting you'll mess up your mac because it sounds as though you are knowledgable about computer hardware, repair and upgrades. However a good majority of computer consumers are not and apple can't test people and say 'you can upgrade your hard drive, but you cannot'. Instead, they just give a zero tolerance and say that no-one can mess around inside their mac otherwise it will void out the warranty.

Don't go thinking this is just an apple thing either. Most electronic consumables have labels dotted around their casing saying things like 'warranty void if opened/ seal broken'.

 

[zipur]

This is a reason Everyone should only buy the cMBP in protest. Then apple would have to change their ways.
Sadly this will never happen as I type this on my new rMBP.

 

[duggram]

(shrugs) I'm also not sure how they were being a bastard by answering your question.

<off topic> I think I understand how Krazy Bill feels. For some reason when you get older i.e. >60 young people can come off as pretty smug. You can also tell who has an axe to grind on their father. I work with a lot of people that are less than half my age and it can get pretty frustrating with some of the attitudes, but I still try to understand. Maybe you can try to understand Bill's comment. </off topic>

Do people really swap out soldered in SSDs? I'm not skilled enough to even think of doing that.

 

[sweetbrat]

On page 4 of the MacBook Pro Important Product Information Guide that came with your retina MBP, it states:
"Your MacBook Pro does not have any user-serviceable parts. If you need service, contact Apple or take your MacBook Pro to an Apple Authorized Service Provider."

Then in the warranty, it states:
WHAT IS COVERED BY THIS WARRANTY? Apple warrants the Apple-branded hardware product and accessories contained in the original packaging (“Apple Product”) against defects in materials and workmanship when used normally in accordance with Apple’s published guidelines for a period of ONE (1) YEAR from the date of original retail purchase by the end-user purchaser (“Warranty Period”). Apple’s published guidelines include but are not limited to information contained in technical specifications, user manuals and service communications.

That's all they need to say. No user-serviceable parts means that if you do anything to the computer, you void your warranty. Sure, you can give it a try...go for it. But if they see any evidence that you've done anything to the guts of it, they can refuse any future repairs on it. Whether you agree with it or not, if you don't abide by the terms of the warranty, the warranty is void. Sorry if you felt like he was being too smug, but he was being honest.

 

[Krazy Bill]

<off topic>For some reason when you get older i.e. >60 young people can come off as pretty smug.

Bingo. (While I haven't attained full geezer status I'm still offered senior coffees at McDonald's ).

Do people really swap out soldered in SSDs?

Only the RAM is soldered. That's why it makes sense to max out to 16GB since that's the only way you'll get it.

The SSD has a proprietary connecter but can be swapped out quite easily. (No soldering). Only 1 third party makes alternative drives right now but I suspect that will change as the complete MBP line gets sealed. Of course, there's that warranty "thing" again.

I can certainly live with the high Apple price for BTO options (I think). My only concern is if/when a 1TB SSD becomes available in 18 months for a really good price, I'm stuck with what I have until Applecare runs out or... I just do it myself. But I'd rather keep my warranty because something as minor as a bad RAM module requires a new logic board.

----------

That's all they need to say. No user-serviceable parts means that if you do anything to the computer, you void your warranty.

Yep. That's how I read it.

Sorry if you felt like he was being too smug, but he was being honest.

No. Again, I guess one needed to be there. The sneer his face, the rolling eyes and the ever popular, "shaking of the head" kind of did it for me.

The little twerp actually enjoyed telling me I was screwed.

 

[duggram]

My only concern is if/when a 1TB SSD becomes available in 18 months for a really good price, I'm stuck with what I have until Applecare runs out or... I just do it myself. But I'd rather keep my warranty because something as minor as a bad RAM module requires a new logic board.

Why not put an SSD in an external enlosure?

That's what I did with my old SSD. I upgraded the original spinner with a 160 SSD and 2 years later the prices dropped so much I went ahead got a 240 for a lot less than I paid for the 160. My MBP doesn't have USB 3.0, but I did get a Firewire 800 enclosure. It's pretty fast too.

 

[Dark Void]

I think a better question to ask here is why would you mess with it and then go into an Apple Store and try to act like you didn't?

 

[sweetbrat]

The little twerp actually enjoyed telling me I was screwed.

Well, at least it sounds like it didn't come as a surprise to you. I'm assuming you knew when you bought it that you wouldn't be able to upgrade it, right?

 

[Krazy Bill]

I think a better question to ask here is why would you mess with it and then go into an Apple Store and try to act like you didn't?

Well, if you're implying that because the macbook is sealed it won't happen, I guarantee it will. Somebody *somewhere* has already upgraded their SSD and should they have problems will indeed swap that 3rd party SSD for the original one then try to get these problems fixed under warranty. And you know what? Some will succeed depending on the mood of the genius (like always it seems).

Well, at least it sounds like it didn't come as a surprise to you. I'm assuming you knew when you bought it that you wouldn't be able to upgrade it, right?

Yes. But there have been posts here indicating the solution would be the slightly dishonest scenario I described above. (Restore the original SSD). This won't work.

 

[Seiko4169]

So I talked to an Apple genius...

"So I talked to an Apple genius..."

Was waiting for the punch line!

 

[Dark Void]

Well, if you're implying that because the macbook is sealed it won't happen, I guarantee it will. Somebody *somewhere* has already upgraded their SSD and should they have problems will indeed swap that 3rd party SSD for the original one then try to get these problems fixed under warranty. And you know what? Some will succeed depending on the mood of the genius (like always it seems).

Oh I know, it's just kind of deceiving to me. Perhaps I am old fashioned.

 

[Cassadian]

The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act protects us from things like this. In fact you can service it. There is however the possibility that Apple can claim that your 3rd party replacement is the reason for any future defects, which can be potentially bad for you if there is a problem after you replace the SSD.

 

[afinch1992]

This is a reason Everyone should only buy the cMBP in protest. Then apple would have to change their ways.
Sadly this will never happen as I type this on my new rMBP.

well put. as much as i hate that i couldnt upgrade it, id buy one right this second if i had the cash. im going to buy a cMBP so i can upgrade it on the cheap tho

 

[Ccrew]

The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act protects us from things like this. In fact you can service it. There is however the possibility that Apple can claim that your 3rd party replacement is the reason for any future defects, which can be potentially bad for you if there is a problem after you replace the SSD.

I love all the folks that think Magnuson-Moss allows them to do whatever they want.

That act came about from auto manufacturers claiming you had to use their filters. The end result was that when the act was passed you were allowed to use ANYONE's filters and was encompassed to mean service parts. The loophole is that if the Mfg can attribute the failure to the aftermarket part you're still on the hook. And if they merely claim it is you're on the hook to prove them wrong. And you still have something that doesn't work until you A: pay to fix it or b: win your lawsuit in 5.7 years.

Now that said, if the mfg claims no user serviceable parts and you service it MM is out the window anyway. You voided the warranty. It's not MM that you serviced the device with a third party part, it's that you serviced a machine that the manufacturer said that was not user serviceable.

Feel free to show a verifiable case where claiming the MM warranty act ever got anyone anything by using that as an argument.

 

[takeshi74]

No. Again, I guess one needed to be there. The sneer his face, the rolling eyes and the ever popular, "shaking of the head" kind of did it for me.

The little twerp actually enjoyed telling me I was screwed.

Even in person people can interpret things differently. Additionally, we're only hearing your side of the story. We're not hearing his and how you came across to him. The truth typically lies somewhere in between the two perspectives.

The Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act protects us from things like this.

Citation? Where does it specifically allow consumers to service non-serviceable products (disclosed as such in the warranty) and still obtain warranty coverage?

I think I understand how Krazy Bill feels. For some reason when you get older i.e. >60 young people can come off as pretty smug. You can also tell who has an axe to grind on their father. I work with a lot of people that are less than half my age and it can get pretty frustrating with some of the attitudes, but I still try to understand. Maybe you can try to understand Bill's comment.

Maybe you can try to understand younger people as well. The blade cuts both ways. It's just as frustrating to work with smug older people. Neither side is completely "right" (not that it really applies or matters) in all situations.

 

[whoknows87]

Personally, I don't think upgrading the SSD myself is grounds for voiding work on everything else inside the machine. Morally, I feel the same way so I'd like to find a way around it.

You had to be there.

Not sure if there are lock-tight seals around the screws though.

I had this debate with a senior manager at an Apple retail store , keep in mind my model was a 2009 Model, any user installable part ( memory and HD) does not void your machine warranty ( he told me otherwise and I argued that and later presented him with a Manual that was packaged with the MBP and it was put to rest, now that said , Apple does not ship Manual anymore ( at least What I've been told with newer models) and that on the retina Model there are no user up gradable parts so yes swapping out the SSD will void your warranty, I will not open it up if i were you unless you know you wont screw anything up, because even if it didn't void your warranty ( which it does) any other damages caused by just opening up the MBP will not be covered.... Good Luck

 

[Cassadian]

I love all the folks that think Magnuson-Moss allows them to do whatever they want.

That act came about from auto manufacturers claiming you had to use their filters. The end result was that when the act was passed you were allowed to use ANYONE's filters and was encompassed to mean service parts. The loophole is that if the Mfg can attribute the failure to the aftermarket part you're still on the hook. And if they merely claim it is you're on the hook to prove them wrong. And you still have something that doesn't work until you A: pay to fix it or b: win your lawsuit in 5.7 years.

Now that said, if the mfg claims no user serviceable parts and you service it MM is out the window anyway. You voided the warranty. It's not MM that you serviced the device with a third party part, it's that you serviced a machine that the manufacturer said that was not user serviceable.

Feel free to show a verifiable case where claiming the MM warranty act ever got anyone anything by using that as an argument.

I was obviously wrong, but I love the cocky attitude you took critiquing my post. As if you have a chip on your shoulder and something to prove. Calm down.

 

[Krazy Bill]

Even in person people can interpret things differently. Additionally, we're only hearing your side of the story. We're not hearing his and how you came across to him. The truth typically lies somewhere in between the two perspectives.

No rudeness. The kid couldn't have been older than 19 or 20 (I probably have salad dressing in the fridge older than him). And I don't mean to imply he was obnoxious or rude to the point it pissed me off. Just a typical "kid" response which I'm used to.

Citation? Where does it specifically allow consumers to service non-serviceable products (disclosed as such in the warranty) and still obtain warranty coverage?

Conversely speaking, where does it say Apple does all the "nice" things Apple does? They violate their own policies all the time. All I was trying to do was get a "feel" for how they were equipped to handle a consumer actually opening up their new rMBP then bringing it in for warranty service. Not arguing the policy but I'm willing to bet it depends on which Genius you get at the time.

Maybe you can try to understand younger people as well

I have some of my own and practice daily

It's just as frustrating to work with smug older people.

We are not smug. Just always right.

Neither side is completely "right" (not that it really applies or matters) in all situations.

Ok. Ignore comment above.

 

[derbothaus]

This was known about the rMBP. I bought a regular Pro because of it, in part protest, in part for functionality reasons. People want the "shiny new" but the consequences are there for future product. If you buy them in droves they assume you like the limited aspect of future proofing. Besides most users say they never want to upgrade their laptops. They just buy new ones. If it makes you feel any better the SSD options for the retina are no better than the SSD Apple sells you. May actually be slower.