So Tim does not take his holidays

Discussion in 'Apple, Inc and Tech Industry' started by aicul, Jan 27, 2015.

  1. aicul macrumors 6502a

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    #1
    Everyone knows that holidays are designed to get people to rest, take a moment for oneself (and family) and come back with a fresh insight.

    I'm wondering if some of the teething nonsense we see in Yosemite is not linked to this bad example the very CEO of Apple is showing his staff.

    Rest and creativity go together. Too much creativity leads to necessary rest, no rest hinders creativity. And this percolates down to looking after little details, those details that distinguish "good" from "fantastic".

    So let's face it, if the CEO does not take holidays, why should a junior developper taken any ? And hence if Apple staff has not "breaks", "holidays", "vacations" because their CEO is not giving a lead, then i'm not surprised of some abysmal errors we can see in Yosemite today.

    Tim, you are not "irreplaceable", take your time-off, set a positive example to all, and come back with that "fresh look" that we seek from Apple.
     
  2. Gav2k macrumors G3

    Gav2k

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    #2
    Might want to look back...

    http://www.macrumors.com/2012/10/01/tim-cook-thanks-apple-employees-for-outstanding-2012-with-extended-thanksgiving-vacation-time/

    That's just one example of many ;)

    He might not personally take vacation time which I doubt but he certainly makes sure others do.
     
  3. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

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    #3
    This never would have happened if Steve Jobs were still alive. :rolleyes:
     
  4. heehee macrumors 68020

    heehee

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    #4
    You know how many vacation days he took last year because?

    Have you been stalking him?:rolleyes:
     
  5. cambookpro macrumors 603

    cambookpro

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    #5
  6. roadbloc macrumors G3

    roadbloc

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    #6
    His loss in my mind. I guess he really enjoys his work.
     
  7. heehee, Jan 29, 2015
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2015

    heehee macrumors 68020

    heehee

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    #7
    I've read an article similar to that, but more in-depth, but it still doesn't say how many holidays he took.

    His based salary is $1.7 million, which is $6,538.46 / day. Which means he has a bit more than 8 days of vacation left ($56,923 payout). He could have 25+ days of vacation for all we know not including the lieu days for weekend business trips, if they do count those.
     
  8. RoccoFan macrumors regular

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    #8
    Keep in mind that you're talking about money he got paid for vacation days he had left at the end of the year. A long time employee may get 30 days worth of vacation. If he only used 20, he might get paid out the rest. In short, you don't know that he didn't take ANY vacation, he just might not have used it all up. What sucks is the time you have to forfeit if you don't use or get paid for all of it. Been there. Not fun.
     
  9. aicul thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #9
    It's actually publicly annonce information from Apple, they indicate how much holiday time he is paid cash; hence not take as "rest".


    The whole usefulness of vacation time is to ensure employees (any level) actually get a different rest from the down to earth night sleep.

    I've noticed so many times how I am much more creative, efficient, motivated, focused after a nice break (5 days or more), than after a night's sleep or a weekend.

    When I see certain atrocious bugs in Apple (software), I can only wonder if employees are really resting and taking a step back to look at what they are doing with fresh eyes.

    Frankly, if the CEO is not setting the example, its difficult to perceive how a junior programmer can do the same, whatever corporate rules say (and these rules apply to the CEO as well).
     
  10. heehee, Jan 29, 2015
    Last edited: Jan 29, 2015

    heehee macrumors 68020

    heehee

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    #10
    Read the rest of the thread.

    He was paid cash for unused vacation, 8 days from my calculation, but you don't know how many vacation days he has and used. He could have a lot of vacation days.

    Again, he could have took 4, five day vacations (9 including weekends) and still have 8 days (the pay for unused vacation). It's not unreasonable for someone to have 30 vacation days / year.
     
  11. aicul thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #11
    The point is not whether Tim took sufficient holidays - we know that we cannot state that.

    What my post is about is if Tim does not take ALL his holidays he is not setting a great example for those junior staff that would like to take ALL their holidays.

    So if Tim takes only a partial chunk say 75% (figurative example) of his allotment he stays with a comfortable holiday break (as per your calculations).

    Please do the calculations for 75% (same figurative example) that a junior staff has from his allotment on holidays.

    So Tim has MANY holidays and takes a % of these, he should think the example he sets on those that have FEW holidays and dare not take a higher percentage than Tim.

    Hence leading to my abstract link that some of the really absurd bugs in some Apple products can only be justified by over-worked, tired, not-brain-refreshed staff.
     
  12. Tyler23 macrumors 603

    Tyler23

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    #12
    I know for a fact that the CEO of the company I work for (a very large one with over 60,000 employees) takes very few vacation days. I also know that myself, my coworkers, several SVPs and VPs that I know, etc. use the entirety of their vacation allotment.

    I don't think Tim would be the sort to care if his employees are using vacation as long as they actually have it. He's CEO, not in HR.
     
  13. aicul thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #13
    Point taken Tyler23, I doubt he much cares, nor notices, but the fact is his very actions can be taken as a cue by others. Sort of sheep behaviour.

    What I notice are appalling bugs in Apple products that cannot reasonably pass any testing without the person responsible for the testing being either outright incompetent, or distracted/overworked. Just have a look at what types of problems people are encountering in this forum ...

    Reason for my post, I was giving apple the benefit of "overworking staff with little holidays" as an excuse for these atrocious bugs.

    But assuming my post is wrong, and Apple staff are rested and creative. Are we then saying Apple has incompetent employees ?
     
  14. aristobrat macrumors G4

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    #14
    Going back through Apple's history, it's easy to see that they've brought many products to market with both hardware and software issues.

    This history predates Cook being the CEO by at least a decade.

    So what's with the fixation just now on atrocious bugs?
     
  15. aicul thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #15
    Maybe fixation is a little strong term. I'm trying to see if there is a point here, not saying i'm right (or wrong), trying to see if there is a connection.

    First wouldn't you say that something that worked in a previous SW (with a smaller Apple and a different CEO) and does not work in latest SW is an atrocious bug.

    And if it worked previously, there should be some test script of a sort. And if the Beta testers raised this, then there should also be heightened attention.

    But yet, surprisingly, atrocious bug ends up in golden master. Just look back at the iOS update Apple had to pull from distribution because it actually killed iPhones.

    Why is a company so rich, so full of wonderful staff, still doing high-school bloopers ?

    Either they don't care (I doubt this), or they are just brain-dead (from exhausting - what I'm digging into).

    And if its exhaustion, should the CEO take ALL his holidays to pass the message to the whole staff that EVERYONE needs rest ?
     
  16. aristobrat macrumors G4

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    #16
    I have no idea why, but they've got a long history when it comes to bloopers. That's why I was curious as to why you were trying to correlate it to their culture just now, based on Tim Cook not taking all of his PTO.

    Do you remember back in 2003 when they shipped the new PowerBook that had so many quality control issues that MacWorld warned about them in their review of the model? "We can't check the vital signs of every computer Apple ships. We can, however, report on the quality of the PowerBooks we've received, and that report is not encouraging. Of six 15-inch PowerBooks Macworld ordered from a non-Apple retailer, three had to be returned."

    Do you remember the high-school blooper from back in 2001 where iBooks had enough issues with components failing on logic boards that Apple has to create a world-wide repair extension program for them?

    Or how much of a rookie mistake was it to build early 2000s PowerBooks out of titanium, only to have the hinges that hold the monitor on break under normal use?

    2006 Intel machines that shut down when they got too hot, 2008 MacBook Pros with yellow screens that got customers banned from companies for doing too many returns trying to find one without an issue, 2010 iMacs with the exactly same problem, iPhones with "antenna gate"?! Amateur hour x4?

    From what I can recall (I don't have time to keep on Googling), virtually every release of OS X and iOS has hit GM with known bugs in it, which is why the sage advice around here that many seem to follow is to wait for the .1 release before upgrading.
     
  17. aicul thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #17
    Indeed quite a surprise the .1 release of the latest iOS, it bricked some phones and was pulled from the APP store.

    ;) its easy to prove anything with anything ;)


    My proposed theory for discussion was that it was somehow linked to "exhausted brain dead junior staff who do not dare take more holidays (percentage wise) than their CEO".

    Obviously no one really cares, or more precisely, people don't see the value that a CEO should set an example by taking his holiday allotment to ensure company staff have no qualms in taking benefit from their deserved allotment.

    My attempt to make a correlation was started on the Apple announcement that Tim did have his holidays paid out ... and that by now they should have certain things "in control". So I thought, maybe it's the "absence of rest" link.

    As you say "trying to correlate". Maybe there is nothing here.

    :eek:
     
  18. aristobrat macrumors G4

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    #18
    IIRC, that was 8.0.1, not the 8.1 a lot of folks were holding out for. Shouldn't have happened regardless.

    Your point is interesting. If it's true, then based on Apple's long history with "high-school" mistakes, it appears to be something that's been going on for many years before Tim took over.
     
  19. rdowns macrumors Penryn

    rdowns

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    #19
    I always love how we take a data point or two and we construct these fabulous stories on how Apple works.
     
  20. heehee macrumors 68020

    heehee

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    #20
    I can already see the next headline. "So Tim takes all his vacation instead of fixing atrocious bugs. What kind of example is Tim setting for his juniors?."
     
  21. aicul thread starter macrumors 6502a

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    #21
    made me smile

    ----------

    Please do not mistake me, the fact that Tim is named is not a pointed finger to him, but to the current CEO.


    Maybe the point is that some believe "high-school" mistakes should not be present in Apple products (or be addressed very very quickly). They remain, and often last a long time.

    After all the - infamous - apple-tax that consumers pay should serve some use ?
     

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