Hello all, I posted this yesterday, as my first post, and I guess it was deleted .... If I am missing something about posting, could someone message me? THX I recently retrieved access to my old mac [g4 dual 500] that I had lost passwords for and which had been dormant for awhile. I did this by starting in single user and creating a new admin account. [starting the whole intro again and everything] Once back in, I could reset the passwords for the old accounts jsut fine. So I was ready to switch users and clean up shop. I had planned to get this machine running in my studio again, and wanted to reset it as much as possible. I should also mention that it had a slaved drive that had only 38 MB left out of 40GB [wasn't my doing ] Before switching users, answered the call of the Software updater. Software Update had a version of 10.4.xxx[?] ready to install, so I clicked OK, and waited. I have no original disks for this machine, and have no clue what my roommates that shared it with me had done in a couple years. So for all I know, there was another OS upgrade done in the last couple years that I wasn't aware of ... anyway, here's what happened: The machine rebooted with no chime, [was already silent before] it then hung on the gray Apple, and the spinner never came up ... even after an hour. I am unable to invoke any keyboard commands while it is in this state. I couldn't enter Single User ... I couldn't zap the NVRAM ... I couldn't enter Open Firmware ... I couldn't boot from CD. So, I'll spare the details of trying to boot from CD ... I reset the CUDA button [or whatever it's called nowadays, PMU?] That didn't do a thing, replaced battery too, nada. I had another old G4 with 10.2.8 on it. I booted from that drive finally, and ran Disk Utility to verify and repair the original disk and permissions by setting it to slave and re-selecting the 10.2 drive as the startup disk from a CD boot. [ok, maybe I WON'T spare you the details of the CD booting ;P] Everything reported back as having been done successfully by the disk utility. It still won't boot, but now the spinner at least comes up and sits forever ... I left it overnight to be sure. I DID notice though, that it said "Thread count is 26, and should be 3". After running the utility a couple more times to make sure, it still found that thread count difference, but also still said right afterwards that "the disk has been repaired". Any ideas? I can navigate the drive fine as a slave, is there a way I can do something by hand? dangit. Thanks for helping folks!