Some questions about MacBook Pro

[LathspeLL]

Hi, I'm new here.

I'm from Turkey and will be in UK in October.
So I'm selling my PC and planning to get a laptop. I'm a gamer so performance is important for me. I do some research about MacBook Pro's and generally everyone says "its performance is really good".

So I'm planning to buy MacBook Pro 15" then install WinXP for my games. I mostly play Valve games (CS: Source, DoD: Source, Team Fortress 2...) So are there anyone playing these games on a MacBook pro? Is the Performance good?

I heard there are three ways to run WinXP on a Mac. 1. Parallels 2. Boot Camb, I don't remember the third one. Which way is good?

Also How is the WinXP performance? Can I use WinXP like other laptops? Are there any compatibility problems?

You can say "if you want to use WinXP, go and buy another laptop." But I need to use Final Cut Pro. Also I want to use OSX from now on .

Thank you for answers. Sorry for my English if I made mistakes.

 

[Lovesong]

I don't know about these games (I'm not a gamer), but the best way to use the MBP for Windows gaming is to run Boot Camp, as it gives you full hardware acceleration. Final Cut Pro will run great on it though.

 

[webgoat]

use bootcamp

if you are using windows primarily for gaming then bootcamp will be your best bet since windows will be running natively on your macbook with full hardware support (also it will be free)... virtually i would recommend vmware fusion over parallels

 

[squeeks]

NO ONE here is going to tell you to buy another laptop, im pretty sure such a person would be banned

 

[aaron.lee2006]

NO ONE here is going to tell you to buy another laptop, im pretty sure such a person would be banned

To be honest I got sick and tired of gaming on my mac so I recently built myself a PC. Still love using my mac but I'm a competitive gamer.

 

[squeeks]

well, sure building your own system is awesome, every system in my house save for my mbp, and my parents laptop ive hand built (including all of my lan party computer, that totals about 11)

but do you really think anyone on this board is going to tell him to go buy a dell xps?

i think not

as far as gaming goes, UT2k4 runs ok on my MBP (using the universal version for OSX) but id much rather play it on my Athlon 64 6000+ Radeon 1950XTX

 

[LathspeLL]

I wonder how MCP performs with newer games. How much FPS do you get in CS: Source, DoD: Source or Team Fortress 2.

 

[LathspeLL]

And, Is WinXP working fully in MCP? I mean it's not emulated, is it?

 

[Sesshi]

The problem with the MBP is that if you begin using the power that it's supposed to have, it is compromised in terms of heat management.

The question then is, if you have to invest carry about an additional cooling system to be able to use it to the full, is it a) that portable and b) if you don't happen to have such an option with you, useful?

The vast majority of the users here aren't going to even scratch the surface of a Macbook, let alone a Macbook Pro. I think there's a reason why they're Mac users and not being tempted / not being involved in work or play to make full use of the machine is one of those attributes. These are more likely the people who tell you 'the performance is really good'.

For light-duty users who will very rarely even begin to approach to need the power that the MBP nominally has, in terms of utility it's passable - most people will think it's fine, just be a little worried about heat from time to time. However as a CPU/GPU-heavy (although not gaming, although I also game but definitely not on the MBP) user, I think the utility of the Macbook Pro is flawed when compared to a bigger, somewhat noisier, better engineered (nothing beats Apple in design right now, but there are many which are far better engineered) notebook which retains it's ability to be hammered all the time better.

Personally, I have little choice - the applications I'm running run under OS X and we've not had completely acceptable results trying to run OSX86 on Thinkpads, Dell XPS / Latitudes / Vostros and so forth, all of which are better performers in terms of heavy-use notebooks. So the MBP is my only choice. For that, I cannot recommend it for people who like to hammer the CPU and the GPU who're merely curious about the Macbook Pro and aren't set on having OS X. But if you, as you say, 'want to use OS X' then you're in the same boat as me if you want a software kludge-free experience: The MBP is the only machine you can buy.

 

[LathspeLL]

I'm gonna need a MBP for Final Cut Pro, but not for now. And I'm want to learn OS X. I did some research over net and found articles/reviews that recommends MBP. I couldn't find anything about heat problem. Also some MBP owners reports good gaming performance. But I had to be sure.

It's hard to pick one really. Dell XPSs are good too. But MBP look better I guess. But also the rumors about "multitouch MacBook's" make me consider again. Should I wait for Apple to announce new features? Because If I buy one now and then Apple announce "multitouch" thing, I'll kill my self . I'm really confused.

 

[Teucer]

I play both CS:Source and DoD as well as Medieval 2 on my MBP 2.2 with 2GB of ram, and all these games run great, I can play the source engine games at full settings fine, the fps seems good enough for multi-player. I run Medieval 2 at medium/high settings but I think it is much more demanding than the source games.

Overall I was pleasantly surprised with the gaming performance of the MBP and you won't be disappointed with the performance of the games you want to play.

However the second poster is right, and during gaming my macbook does get extremely hot - definitely too hot to use on my lap.

 

[cervaro]

I agree with the sentiments of an earlier poster, buy a PC for games use, or a console for that matter. Not that I do much gaming these days as I think most titles are bloated eye candy just for the sake of using up storage space and selling high end graphics hardware.

I bought one game for my iMac, namely Call of Duty 2. Will probably install it on a MacBook Pro when I get one, but that'll be the only one I imagine given I have an Xbox 360 and a PS3 sitting under the PC.

 

[panda]

an interesting alternative

iyi gunler LathspeLL,

i think its great that you want to switch to mac.

i don't know anything about gaming, but i have some thoughts on what you are doing anyhow.

have you thought about getting an imac? an imac will have a much larger screen and be much more pleasureable to use on an ongoing basis than a mbp.

if indeed you also need a laptop, you will find that buying an imac 20" + macbook, will cost you almost the same as buying the mbp 15" !!!

in otherwords, 2 computers for the price of 1.

another thing to remember when buying the computers in the uk and taking them to turkey, is that you can buy the computers without tax (no vat), which will save you a lot of money. you can have the apple store fill in all the paperwork you need and then you are prepared to take care of the rest when you get to the airport you are leaving from in the UK. it shouldn't be too complicated and will save you lots of money. the tax is refunded after you leave the UK.


i would travel back to turkey with the laptop in a bag (not in its box) you take on the plane with you, preferably protected in a 'sleeve' case. i would keep the imac in its box, put it in a suitcase and check it in as luggage. if you want to be really safe, you can take out a bit of travel insurance for the imac, in case it could get lost. this insurance is very cheap. i would try to bring both items through the turkish customs without declaring them. this would save you having to pay turkish import taxes.

of course, you may find that buying the imac in turkey might not be that much more expensive and be worth saving yourself the hassle by buying it there.

feel free to contact me directly if you have any more questions on jpshore@yahoo.com

good luck.

 

[mrgrieves]

I wonder how MCP performs with newer games. How much FPS do you get in CS: Source, DoD: Source or Team Fortress 2.

What might be useful is to just go look for benchmarks on laptops with the same hardware config as the MBP, not necessarily first hand MBP accounts.

With that said, a very similar laptop is produced by Asus, the G1. The main difference is that the processor is about 200 mhz slower, which isn't a big deal, not to mention that the GPU is much more of a bottleneck in this case.

I, too, plan on buying a MBP soon and will be using it to replace my desktop. I also tend to play a lot of video games, and I'm pretty ambivalent about the purchase in regards to the performance of the 8600m.

At the moment it's a pretty underwhelming card. In fact there are three or four mobile DX10 capable cards that perform much better, and *many* <DX10 cards that perform far better.

Anyway, here is a review of the G1, with some included gameplay benchmarks:

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Review-Asus-G1S-Notebook.3889.0.html

As you can see, the selection of games was actually fairly old (other than Supreme Commander), and still the results were "meh" at best.

I believe the source engine is less demanding on the GPU than F.E.A.R. and possibly Doom 3, however with the updates coming with Orange Box you can probably expect it to become more of a GPU hog if it doesn't already surpass the aforementioned games.

All in all, I'm waiting until they release Leopard and really crossing my fingers that they upgrade the MBP at least in terms of offering a better video card. If not, it looks like you may be doomed to 15-20ish FPS rates on recently released games, and any intensive games released within the next year or two will most likely be unplayable.

(I would guesstimate that source games run in the 20-30 FPS range at the moment)

 

[PhatBoyG]

I posted this in another thread too, but I get between 50-70 FPS in TeamFortress 2 on an MBP w/8600m GT 256mb. I have 4GB of RAM and that is under BootCamp 1.4 Beta.

Even in player heavy fights (6+ characters on the screen) I never drop below 40 FPS.

All measurements are done using FRAPS.

 

[theman]

I just think of it this way. My current computer I built 2 years ago and has an A64 3200+, 6600gt, 1gb ram. My new MBP is a dream compared to it. so i'm really excited about gaming now.

 

[LathspeLL]

Sanada iyi gunler panda!

I don't want a desktop thing. I need a laptop.

I'm selling my desktop PC and going to London for a year or more. I'll be changing places all the time I guess. So thats why I need a Laptop.

Why MacBook Pro?

1. I'm a Director. At least I'm trying to be. I shot short films etc. I was using Adobe Premiere and Avid Xpress for editing. But I need to learn Final Cut Pro before it's too late. And I want it to be my primary application. So I need MAC for that.

2. I'm a Hardcore Gamer, My comp.'s spec: AMD64 3200+, 1 GB Memory, nvidia 7950GT...
So buying a MCP gives me same or a little bit better performance.
UPDATE: I just saw MBP gaming performance videos on YouTube. Most of the games run fine. Even Bioshock runs 30 FPS average.


I thought about trying to eliminate VAT too. But I didn't know that I can buy it straight from the store without VAT because I'm a foreigner. Here in Turkey, the old MCPs (the ones with ATI video cards on it) is around 1600-1700 Pound. So I need to buy it in UK. But I will be there for a year, so after 1 year are they still refund the tax? Is there time limit?

 

[macduke]

honestly? if you want bleeding edge performance with all the settings cranked up pretty high and must have a laptop, get one of those 9lb alienware gamer laptops. i would recommend buying a mac though for everyday use and building a pc on the side which you can do for a decent price for gaming. that way you can get the best of both worlds, and can easily upgrade your gaming rig. just my two cents.

 

[DoFoT9]

honestly? if you want bleeding edge performance with all the settings cranked up pretty high and must have a laptop, get one of those 9lb alienware gamer laptops. i would recommend buying a mac though for everyday use and building a pc on the side which you can do for a decent price for gaming. that way you can get the best of both worlds, and can easily upgrade your gaming rig. just my two cents.

yes of course if you can afford the $5k for the 7950's it would be really really nice in a laptop. yea i love having 60-80minutes of battery!!! its loverly in a laptop.. like going back ot the stone age.

you really should get the MBP, i have the older x1600 and it runs every game fine. i have just OC'd the gpu and its sweet i run at max res on cod2(50-60fps), and quake4, prey etcetc.

 

[panda]

i see your point

sanada iyi gunler LathspeLL,

i do indeed see your point.

i was just making the case for the 2 computers based on the fact that apart from screen size, i don't feel that there is generally that much of a difference in specs between the macbook and macbook pro and that there is a HUGE difference in terms of screen size between a mbp 15" and an imac.

i currently have a last gen powerbook g4 15" and i must say, that when i next upgrade (within the next 6 months probably), i am thinking that a macbook + imac may be a good plan. plus when you buy an imac, you also get a 'free' mouse and keyboard. its a very good deal when you think about it.

again, i know nothing about gaming, but i can imagine that running games and final cut etc on an imac would be much nicer than on a 15" mbp.

if daily portability were your concern, then i feel your mbp choice is right. if it is moving from flat to flat a few times in a year, then i think moving an imac along with your other things should not be a big problem.

as to the tax rebate, i believe that you have one year to take the computer out of the eu. but that you could check up on with apple before buying.

compliments on your great english, by the way. and london will be a great place for you to spend a year.