Some silly decisions

[matttye]

I've always thought of Apple as the company that's quite slow to adopt things, but the one that does things properly.

Just lately, although I love my iPhone, I've been finding that it's really irritating at certain things and they're just not well thought out at all.

SIRI being the main one. Why on earth do we need to connect to Apple's data centres to perform simple, local tasks on the phone? This results in not being able to use Siri when in a signal blackspot, or at busy times. So when I'm driving and I want to use Siri to call someone or add a reminder or something, especially when I'm out driving in some quiet back roads with patchy signal, it's easier to just pull over and do it manually.

Google has managed to add the entire Google Voice Search, which is not dissimilar to Siri, to Android and the entire thing is usable while offline. This is how it should be.

I actually find the "it just works" mantra laughable when I try and fail to use Siri to call someone about 5 times before giving up!

The second one, although not as annoying as Siri, is maps. Why can we not save entire countries or at least cache journeys prior to setting off? Surely maps is one of the OBVIOUS things that should work without a data connection. If you're out and about and lose signal, you're lost! Where is the sense in that?

I appreciate that these aren't specific to iOS 7, just iOS in general; it just made sense to post in the latest iOS forum.

Come on Apple... sort it out

 

[Tankmaze]

SIRI being the main one. Why on earth do we need to connect to Apple's data centres to perform simple, local tasks on the phone? This results in not being able to use Siri when in a signal blackspot, or at busy times. So when I'm driving and I want to use Siri to call someone or add a reminder or something, especially when I'm out driving in some quiet back roads with patchy signal, it's easier to just pull over and do it manually.

Google has managed to add the entire Google Voice Search, which is not dissimilar to Siri, to Android and the entire thing is usable while offline. This is how it should be.

Well yeah, offline siri is probably one of the feature that I really want. Probably will come out in iOS 8, apple can make like basic function to run without internet connection. That's why siri I think is still a gimmick pushed by apple marketing department.

The second one, although not as annoying as Siri, is maps. Why can we not save entire countries or at least cache journeys prior to setting off? Surely maps is one of the OBVIOUS things that should work without a data connection. If you're out and about and lose signal, you're lost! Where is the sense in that?

I appreciate that these aren't specific to iOS 7, just iOS in general; it just made sense to post in the latest iOS forum.

Come on Apple... sort it out

Yeah I agree, even a nokia phone from 3 years ago can download gps maps based on the region for free. But there is a workaround for this, as I use sygic for gps.
But still, apple can make downloadable offline maps when we setup the phone in the welcome screen so we dont download the maps we dont need.
So maybe a feature for iOS 8.

 

[Paddle1]

This is in the wrong section.

 

[matttye]

This is in the wrong section.

Where do you think it should be? Like I said at the end of my post, there is no general 'iOS' forum - there are simply forums for each version of iOS. It therefore makes sense to post in the latest version's forum, as these problems are still present.

 

[SakuraSuki]

Well yeah, offline siri is probably one of the feature that I really want. Probably will come out in iOS 8, apple can make like basic function to run without internet connection. That's why siri I think is still a gimmick pushed by apple marketing department.



Yeah I agree, even a nokia phone from 3 years ago can download gps maps based on the region for free. But there is a workaround for this, as I use sygic for gps.
But still, apple can make downloadable offline maps when we setup the phone in the welcome screen so we dont download the maps we dont need.
So maybe a feature for iOS 8.

I care less about offline Siri, since Siri isn't that useful after all. I care about offline dictation. That I hate how slow it can be from time to time. OS X gets this on Mavericks, but not on iOS.....

You can download limited size of maps using Google Maps. It isn't quite useful for foreigner travelling to other country, but certainly useful for driving around cities.

 

[Paddle1]

Where do you think it should be? Like I said at the end of my post, there is no general 'iOS' forum - there are simply forums for each version of iOS. It therefore makes sense to post in the latest version's forum, as these problems are still present.

This forum is specifically about a currently in development beta version, the iOS 6 forum makes more sense.

 

[tymaster50]

I couldn't care for offline siri or maps since I almost always have an internet connection (verizon iPhone + AT&T iPad Mini)

I don't use Siri a lot either, Since this time last month (July 17th) I have used Siri a grand total of 4 times lol

 

[matttye]

This forum is specifically about a currently in development beta version, the iOS 6 forum makes more sense.

The problem is still present in iOS7. Why discuss a problem on the iOS 6 forum when it's still present in a later version of the OS?

This forum isn't just for things unique to iOS 7.

 

[nikicampos]

Where do you think it should be? Like I said at the end of my post, there is no general 'iOS' forum - there are simply forums for each version of iOS. It therefore makes sense to post in the latest version's forum, as these problems are still present.

The general iOS forum could be consider the current official release which is iOS6.

You could also post this is Wasteland... Just kidding.

 

[Paddle1]

The problem is still present in iOS7. Why discuss a problem on the iOS 6 forum when it's still present in a later version of the OS?

This forum isn't just for things unique to iOS 7.

Because it's not an actual release yet. iOS 7 can change.

 

[matttye]

I couldn't care for offline siri or maps since I almost always have an internet connection (verizon iPhone + AT&T iPad Mini)

I don't use Siri a lot either, Since this time last month (July 17th) I have used Siri a grand total of 4 times lol

Having an internet connection doesn't help when Siri says "Sorry, I cannot do that right now... please try again later" because the server is down / too busy. That happens quite a lot to me.

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Because it's not an actual release yet. iOS 7 can change.

You could say that about everything being discussed in this forum - let's just get rid of the whole thing shall we?

 

[Paddle1]

Having an internet connection doesn't help when Siri says "Sorry, I cannot do that right now... please try again later" because the server is down / too busy. That happens quite a lot to me.

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You could say that about everything being discussed in this forum - let's just get rid of the whole thing shall we?

But you're talking about iOS 6 and earlier. It's not exclusive to iOS 7.

 

[aimee.elizabeth]

I don't use Siri ever, so it doesn't bother me.

But I agree about maps, you should be able to download maps and use them offline.

 

[matttye]

But you're talking about iOS 6 and earlier. It's not exclusive to iOS 7.

It's absurd to suggest that features should be discussed on the forum corresponding to the iOS version they were introduced, rather than on the latest version of the software that people are using. Especially when Siri has been (at least partially) redesigned and rewritten in iOS 7, and the things I'm discussing are still present in the latest (albeit beta) version.

In any event, does it really matter? If the mods want to move it I'm sure they will do. Can we just stick to the topic now please?

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Even if Siri works well for people with an internet connection, there is no good reason for it to require one. The only possible reason I can think of is because the servers that process the voice data use GBs and GBs of sample data and it wouldn't be practical to put it on the device.

IMO the ideal solution would be some sort of hybrid, whereby it can translate simple commands on the device itself ('dial so and so') but it has to 'phone home' to translate more complex commands ('I want to call so and so'), and it will only phone home if the built-in recognition system cannot translate what's being said into an action.

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I don't use Siri ever, so it doesn't bother me.

But I agree about maps, you should be able to download maps and use them offline.

I only use it whilst driving, but it's really annoying when it won't work as it means I have to pull over. That's not always possible, like if I'm on a motorway.

 

[aimee.elizabeth]

It's absurd to suggest that features should be discussed on the forum corresponding to the iOS version they were introduced, rather than on the latest version of the software that people are using. Especially when Siri has been (at least partially) redesigned and rewritten in iOS 7, and the things I'm discussing are still present in the latest (albeit beta) version.

In any event, does it really matter? If the mods want to move it I'm sure they will do. Can we just stick to the topic now please?

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Even if Siri works well for people with an internet connection, there is no good reason for it to require one. The only possible reason I can think of is because the servers that process the voice data use GBs and GBs of sample data and it wouldn't be practical to put it on the device.

IMO the ideal solution would be some sort of hybrid, whereby it can translate simple commands on the device itself ('dial so and so') but it has to 'phone home' to translate more complex commands ('I want to call so and so'), and it will only phone home if the built-in recognition system cannot translate what's being said into an action.

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I only use it whilst driving, but it's really annoying when it won't work as it means I have to pull over. That's not always possible, like if I'm on a motorway.

One way I can see the Siri requiring data problem being fixed is that Siri can actually differentiate between commands that require a connection vs. the ones that can be done locally on your phone. And yeah that would require a voice recognition system locally on your phone.

 

[Cougarcat]

Even if Siri works well for people with an internet connection, there is no good reason for it to require one. The only possible reason I can think of is because the servers that process the voice data use GBs and GBs of sample data and it wouldn't be practical to put it on the device.

Saving space is probably the reason. In Mavericks, there is now offline dictation but it requires a 700+ MB download. Apple should do something similar with Siri and allow you to download the data if you have the space. Or maybe they will start including it when iPhones start at 32 GB.

 

[Zerilos]

I totally agree about Siri. I rarely find myself without a signal, but it seems obvious that certain tasks should be available offline.

As far as Maps, I doubt Apple wanted to replicate every feature provided by the paid GPS services. They have to maintain a good relationship with App developers and stealing all of their features and providing it for free is not the way to do it. This is why their podcasting app is so inferior to the other podcast downloaders.

 

[Paddle1]

It's absurd to suggest that features should be discussed on the forum corresponding to the iOS version they were introduced, rather than on the latest version of the software that people are using. Especially when Siri has been (at least partially) redesigned and rewritten in iOS 7, and the things I'm discussing are still present in the latest (albeit beta) version.

In any event, does it really matter? If the mods want to move it I'm sure they will do. Can we just stick to the topic now please?

But people aren't using iOS 7 yet. Ok, now I'll stay on topic.


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Siri should be able to do offline tasks like scheduling reminders or setting alarms without internet. I don't know how you would be able to use Siri to place calls if there is no signal, but not everything that Siri does like changing the brightness should need internet. I thought they were going to add offline Siri features in iOS 7?

 

[Cougarcat]

I totally agree about Siri. I rarely find myself without a signal, but it seems obvious that certain tasks should be available offline.

As far as Maps, I doubt Apple wanted to replicate every feature provided by the paid GPS services. They have to maintain a good relationship with App developers and stealing all of their features and providing it for free is not the way to do it. This is why their podcasting app is so inferior to the other podcast downloaders.

I doubt this is the reason. Apple "steals" from developers all the time. There is even a term for it-- sherlocked.

 

[matttye]

Saving space is probably the reason. In Mavericks, there is now offline dictation but it requires a 700+ MB download. Apple should do something similar with Siri and allow you to download the data if you have the space. Or maybe they will start including it when iPhones start at 32 GB.

Totally agree they should give us the option to install something to allow it to work offline.

I totally agree about Siri. I rarely find myself without a signal, but it seems obvious that certain tasks should be available offline.

As far as Maps, I doubt Apple wanted to replicate every feature provided by the paid GPS services. They have to maintain a good relationship with App developers and stealing all of their features and providing it for free is not the way to do it. This is why their podcasting app is so inferior to the other podcast downloaders.

Even if they don't allow you to install entire countries, they could let you cache specific journeys or something.

Siri should be able to do offline tasks like scheduling reminders or setting alarms without internet. I don't know how you would be able to use Siri to place calls if there is no signal, but not everything that Siri does like changing the brightness should need internet. I thought they were going to add offline Siri features in iOS 7?

It's not only when you have no internet connection that Siri fails, it's also when the server is too busy or down.

Also, if you're only on GPRS or Edge, Siri will be quite slow to interpret your command even though you have sufficient signal to make a telephone call.

There's hidden code in iOS 7 that indicates offline dictation is being tested apparently but I don't think there's anything that points to Siri commands.

 

[dhlizard]

I don't use Siri a lot either, Since this time last month (July 17th) I have used Siri a grand total of 4 times lol

Agree !

In a head to head comparison, Google voice search beats Siri every time.

Siri's constant response - "Would you like me to search the Internet for that"

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...when iPhones start at 32 GB.

I agree !

So very tired of reading about people worry/complain about their phone being full and their large "other" file.

Sorry, you bought the cheapest phone available

 

[Gogurt48]

Because it's not an actual release yet. iOS 7 can change.

That's exactly why problems should be discussed here. Why discuss them in a forum for an OS version that can't change, and that is about to be rendered obsolete?

 

[Zerilos]

I doubt this is the reason. Apple "steals" from developers all the time. There is even a term for it-- sherlocked.

Every OS developer does that to some extent, but Apple's free iOS apps are never as feature rich as the better 3rd party Apps provided in the App Store to my experience. Apple could easily make Maps and Podcaster as feature heavy as the 3rd party apps, but they don't. They actually want people to purchase 3rd party Apps, which we would never do if they were offered free by Apple.

 

[aimee.elizabeth]

Agree !

In a head to head comparison, Google voice search beats Siri every time.

Siri's constant response - "Would you like me to search the Internet for that"

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I agree !

So very tired of reading about people worry/complain about their phone being full and their large "other" file.

Sorry, you bought the cheapest phone available

You're tired that not everyone has 400 dollars to blow on a 64gb phone? Maybe you should do a good deed and buy one for them so you don't have to hear them complain

 

[Cougarcat]

Every OS developer does that to some extent, but Apple's free iOS apps are never as feature rich as the better 3rd party Apps provided in the App Store to my experience. Apple could easily make Maps and Podcaster as feature heavy as the 3rd party apps, but they don't. They actually want people to purchase 3rd party Apps, which we would never do if they were offered free by Apple.

Sure, they want people to buy apps, but I don't think they intentionally gimp their own to do so. If their apps are feature light, it's for different reasons. One of them being, default apps are designed for a general audience, so simplicity is prioritized over feature load.