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Sony's New WH-1000XM5 Headphones vs. Apple's AirPods Max

People have distinctly different perspectives when it comes to headphones. As devices they have been around for well over a century and good ones arguably for at least half a century. (I have Jecklin floats and Stax electrostatics that are approaching that age).

Those of us with a longstanding interest obviously have very good headphones already, like to be able to just plug them in and use them, and expect longevity from our purchases.

Apple sees headphones as, basically, iPhone accessories. To be replaced regularly to attach seamlessly over the latest wireless standard whatever that happens to be at the time. Apple users who share this viewpoint see little to no problem with this, nor with longevity issues by design.

Since I belong firmly in the first group, the AirPods Max (which I’ve owned since release), fill me with conflicting emotions. They are actually good headphones, and have some features in how they adapt to the individual user that are legitimately great in theory and at least partly in practise too! However, the battery will go bad over time since you can’t fill it midway and then turn the phone off. And in spite of being tuned digitally (as all of this class of headphones are), you still can’t tweak their frequency response by transfering a custom response curve. Once the wireless standards move on to the point where backwards compatibility is lost, your only option is to try to hook them up via Apples proprietary cable (will it even be available then?) or some horrific legacy wireless kludge.

The AirPods Max are good, but have inexplicable limitations because of Apple being Apple. I try to adopt a use-it-and-toss-it mindset, but it clashes with decades of audio interest.
 
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How about the fact that the AirPod Max don’t support lossless audio? How about the fact that the Sony’s do and also support Hi Res audio with a wired connection and an external DAC? How about the fact that the Sonys have far superior analogue amplification compared to the digital only AirPod Max?

Honestly who writes this stuff. Who cares about what the product is called?!
 
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Bawstun said:
The issue is greed and inflated brand value to due to unwarranted high prices.

The value of the dollar has been entirely misconstrued and lost, on millions.

Regardless of how much money you have, half a thousand dollars for a throwaway consumer product that will last a few years, *is* crazy.
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Such items and their comparative to the time cost have always existed.

Some made money for their company, some didn’t. I bought a lot of high end stereo equipment when I was young and single and didn’t have to justify what I spent to anyone. I had custom speakers built and bought a very early CD player and an expensive for the time turntable as well as purchasing 1/2 speed mastered vinyl records which were a new thing and expensive and I don’t regret any of it many decades later.

My hearing has deteriorated because of the work that I’ve done so I wouldn’t bother spending that much today but I really enjoyed discovering music that I had not been very exposed to on equipment that did a good job of accurately playing it.
 
How many folks in this thread actually purchased the XM5's?

I did on Friday, and I'm pretty happy (they replaced Bose QC35 ii's which started arbitrarily disconnecting from my iPad Pro after only 18 months). Sound is good, EQ controls more than I need, battery life seems better than other headphones claiming 20-30% greater battery life), and they work great with my Apple devices. There is definitely cost-cutting across three areas: on the units themselves, in the packaging, and the case (at least it HAS a case... AP Max looking at you).

Price wise, it was a rounding error vs. AirPods Max.

All in all, I like them a lot.
 
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Is it something with the suspension on the air pod maxes that suck? I dont even notice my 600 gram audezes but they have pretty awesome suspension.
 
Man those XM5s are gorgeous. I want to upgrade from the XM3s but these things are bulletproof... I could probably keep them for another 10 years.
 
Admiral Fart said:
Sony wins this one. I couldn't care less about the name, and lightweight plastic is better than heavy aluminum for headphones. I'm not wearing headphones as a fashion statement, and Apple needs to learn that plastic is fine for some products, especially those that are going to be on your head for long periods of time. Throw in better battery life, a carrying case that isn't cartoonishly stupid, and a better price, and Sony is the clear winner for me.
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Never heard aluminum described as "heavy" before. Nor do the AirPod Pros seem heavy to me. Also, I have come around on the carrying case. In actual use, it does what you need (except protect the headband) without taking up much more room than the headphones. You don't really have to pay $550 for the AirPods Pro anymore. I got mine for about $100 less during an Amazon sale.
 
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One important factor is also that sony's headphones are in general okay to be repaired.
I have the xm3, and you can change the battery in less than 5 minutes with a screwdriver.
Cushions can be changed fairly easily too.
 
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“Removal of folding seems so puzzling - what does this achieve other than mindlessly copying Apple?”

Annoyingly that seems to be EXACTLY all this has achieved. Ugh.

“Coming from the Sony XM3's, though, my big question is whether Bluetooth paring is much better, because that is a huge weakness of the XM3’s.”

Yes! I have the XM3’s, and they are servicable—now that the XM5s don’t fold up, I’m not sure I will upgrade. I basically have to hold the power button and manually repair every time I switch sources, which sucks, but they aren’t my primary headphones, so I put up with it.

“FYI used Sony WH-1000XM4 can be had on eBay for like $170”

I’m thinking if the XM5s aren’t a big enough change, I might buy a discounted XM4…and if *that* isn’t worth it, just go along with my XM3s, which tbh are pretty ok on the whole.

Anyone here who owns the XM5s know how they are on actual telephone calls, how the mics are? That would make a difference for me.
 
I can't help chuckling over the "deal breaker" outrage about the unfoldable XM5s. First of all, speaking as a seasoned traveler who did so for a living, you need to either rethink your packing strategy or think up another excuse to slam Sony over this "awful decision". For everything else, the actual difference is trivial.

Below is a photo of XM3 case on top of an XM5 case. You be the judge if this is significant enough to ignore the myriad of tangible improvements the newer headphones possess. The XM3 case is a bit thicker as well, which makes me think the overall volume is about the same.

IMG_3967.JPG
 
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"I can't help chuckling over the "deal breaker" outrage about the unfoldable XM5s. First of all, speaking as a seasoned traveler who did so for a living, you need to either rethink your packing strategy or think up another excuse to slam Sony over this "awful decision". For everything else, the actual difference is trivial."

Man, get over yourself and your tone.

It's not trivial at all—I don't use the carrying case. When I fold up the XM3s, I don't put the cups flat, I nest them together. It definitely takes up tremendously less room than using either of these cases.
 
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One "very minor" gripe I have with the Sony's (XM4's) is that you have to hold the on/off button for err? 5 seconds to turn on and off. I much prefer the Bose 700's that you just press once and they're on. Obviously the APM's turn on automatically but why the Sony's have this press and hold to turn on? Are the XM5's better? As I say a "MINOR" gripe.
 
AVBeatMan said:
One "very minor" gripe I have with the Sony's (XM4's) is that you have to hold the on/off button for err? 5 seconds to turn on and off. I much prefer the Bose 700's that you just press once and they're on. Obviously the APM's turn on automatically but why the Sony's have this press and hold to turn on? Are the XM5's better? As I say a "MINOR" gripe.
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In the same context, I hate the message "POWER ON", "POWER OFF" it's super loud! And I can't reduce the volume of this message.
 
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I have XM3s. Is it worth upgrading to the 5 version? I tried on the AMPs in the store and they were a little tight. I am concerned a little about the weight over the course of an 8 hour day. The XM3s I have are really good, my only quibble is that I don't love the look of them, and connecting them can be a pain sometimes, but they work fine. I will likely keep them, just looking for a compelling reason to upgrade.
 
gorkt said:
I have XM3s. Is it worth upgrading to the 5 version? I tried on the AMPs in the store and they were a little tight. I am concerned a little about the weight over the course of an 8 hour day. The XM3s I have are really good, my only quibble is that I don't love the look of them, and connecting them can be a pain sometimes, but they work fine. I will likely keep them, just looking for a compelling reason to upgrade.
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I just did that upgrade. The XM5s are lighter, more comfortable with much improved sound. Having multi point BT connections is a big upgrade. Whether or not this is economically feasible is up to you, but you will notice improvements.
 
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mrmister said:
Anyone here who owns the XM5s know how they are on actual telephone calls, how the mics are? That would make a difference for me.
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I asked my mother, who doesn't give a crap about mic sound quality like my nut job friends and coworkers, and she said:

"it sounds fine, but sounds like you're using a microphone/speakerphone"
 
I had the Max. Returned them in favor of the Sony XM4 and Bose 700. I will get the XM5 without a doubt while hoping Bose updates the 700 because they are still so beautifully designed to me.

I have tried a lot of headphones over the past few years. I'm 6'1" with a "normal" sized head and ears. I wanted to really love the AirPods Max as I am an iPhone, iPad, Apple Watch, and Apple TV user (soon to fully ditch Windows thanks to the M1 chips).

The best feature of the Max to me has been the ability to switch from one device to another without me having to do anything. The no power button also makes all the sense in the world. It wasn't until I got my hands on the Max that I realized how much I hate turning on/off my Sony XM4 and Bose 700. Pairing Bluetooth has always been a small pain but getting Bluetooth headphones to connect to what you want them to (which may not be the last device used) is sometimes a big pain with non-Apple, non-Max devices. Apple makes it smooth and painless IF you're using all Apple devices.

Even with all of the above, I returned my Max. Why? Because they are too heavy for me. I could wear them for 30min or so and be fine but trying to wear them for hours and I wanted to pull them off my head. My XM4 and Bose 700 don't have that problem. I don't care how premium the Max look or feel. They aren't jewelry. I truly wish Apple had gone with a plastic design. I've had my XM4 for about 2 years now and they still look brand new. No cracks, no dents, and I use them almost daily since I stopped using the Bose 700 on a regular basis (due to the XM4 having a few more features). Don't drop or sit on the Sony headphones, always carry them in their hard case and they'll last as long as you need them to.

Some people say the Max look really good. They do but the headband is anything but good-looking. It looks as funky as the carrying bra case. Personally, I still think the Bose 700 are the best-looking ANC headphones ever made. They just need more colors and an update with more features.
 
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