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SSD in Optical Bay Woes...

T

Texaspaul

macrumors newbie
Original poster
Jul 10, 2012
7
0
Well I initially installed a Crucial m4 256GB in my brand new 2012 2.7 i7 in the hard drive bay. I had cloned from the original drive before installing anything on there. Everything was going well, until I decided to move it to the optical bay and put the Apple 1TB drive in the HD bay. I'm still booting from the m4, but I'm getting a bunch of random beachballs and freezes. The worst part is... I had several screws strip on me in the process, so now I can't take the drive in the optical bay out to trouble shoot! Anybody know the best way to back out these small stripped screws and find replacements for them?

I've worked on Macbooks before, but never had this many issues. I'm sick to my stomache about all these problems with the SSD install. I need some recommendations... I've tried repairing disk permissions, resetting SMC and PRAM all with no luck. Should I try to return the m4 and get a Samsung 830 while they're on sale? The M4 worked fine until I moved it...
 
The SATA connection in the optical it's much slower than the one in the HD bay. The SSD it's not performing at it's capacity there. You should put back the SSD on the HD bay and run the HDD fro the opti bay.
 
kmpoboy2 said:
The SATA connection in the optical it's much slower than the one in the HD bay. The SSD it's not performing at it's capacity there. You should put back the SSD on the HD bay and run the HDD fro the opti bay.
Click to expand...

not true. in the new macbooks mid 2012 (i think 15" only), both the optical drive and hd are running at full 6gb/s.
 
kidstrech, You are correct. I'm getting the same speeds with it in the bay, it's just randomly beachballing on me!
 
why did you switch the two drives? Why not just leave the SSD in the HDD spot and put the HDD in the optical spot? That could be why you only see it done that way
 
mattopotamus said:
why did you switch the two drives? Why not just leave the SSD in the HDD spot and put the HDD in the optical spot? That could be why you only see it done that way
Click to expand...

Now that the newer Macbooks have the 6gb/s in the optical, I've heard people doing it either way. By putting the HDD in the HDD Bay, you retain the motion sensor feature in case you drop it. I would be willing to swap them to see if it solves it, but the optical bay screws stripped (very very easily). Any tips for getting these smalls screws out?!
 
On previous 17 and 15" MBPs the Optical drive interface was nominally 6g but according to OWC who tested this the rest of the wiring couldn't handle 6g speeds - not an issue for Apple as it only has to support Optical Drive speeds.

I thought the 15" 2012 had solved this problem but apparently not.

If you swap the drives over they should work fine as long as the HDD is not a SATA 3 drive.

Seems like an ongoing issue - I also found the same problem putting a SATA 3 drive in a 2009 MBP Optical bay which should have just reduced the speed to SATA 2 but instead just kept freezing.
 
Rajpdx said:
On previous 17 and 15" MBPs the Optical drive interface was nominally 6g but according to OWC who tested this the rest of the wiring couldn't handle 6g speeds - not an issue for Apple as it only has to support Optical Drive speeds.

I thought the 15" 2012 had solved this problem but apparently not.

If you swap the drives over they should work fine as long as the HDD is not a SATA 3 drive.

Seems like an ongoing issue - I also found the same problem putting a SATA 3 drive in a 2009 MBP Optical bay which should have just reduced the speed to SATA 2 but instead just kept freezing.
Click to expand...

OWC said the 15" MBP Mid-2012 Model could handle 6Gbps just fine.
 
ugp said:
OWC said the 15" MBP Mid-2012 Model could handle 6Gbps just fine.
Click to expand...

Apparently not.

In their earlier investigations they also found differences within 2011 units. I'm surmising that this is a unit where the wiring doesn't support 2 x Sata 3 based on the symptoms reported - which are the same as for the previous model.

----------
Texaspaul said:
Now that the newer Macbooks have the 6gb/s in the optical, I've heard people doing it either way. By putting the HDD in the HDD Bay, you retain the motion sensor feature in case you drop it. I would be willing to swap them to see if it solves it, but the optical bay screws stripped (very very easily). Any tips for getting these smalls screws out?!
Click to expand...

HDD motion sensor works fine in the optical bay too.
 
its because you cloned it instead of a fresh install. most likely. (and because you cloned it from hdd to ssd)

did you use carbon copy? every time i have used it to clone a boot disk (either hdd to hdd or hdd to ssd) it has caused the same problems. i have done it probably around 10 times, 5 different drives, 5 different macbooks....

i dont use it anymore (or any cloner) because i cant trust it. to be honest, i am a firm believer that fresh install on any pc or mac to solve any issue or to upgrade any hardware is the easiest, fastest, and most efficient and reliable thing to do....however, making a clone for an emergency, isnt a bad idea. just saying.

----------

ps

i just added a samsung 830 into my optical bay of my 15" 2012 2.6". i was wondering if you came across something i did. when i went to remove the cover (bottom plate) it was like it was glued on. i pryed and pryed and it wouldnt come off. it eventually popped off (which scared the crap out of me) it flew up and almost hit the logic board on its way down with one of its edges, luckily i was quick enough to bump it away with my arm....i couldnt find any sticky tape/pads or glue. i dont know what it was stuck on. it took me a while to catch my breath...
 
garstudios said:
its because you cloned it instead of a fresh install. most likely. (and because you cloned it from hdd to ssd)
Click to expand...

Well, funny enough, when I had cloned it and just installed the single SSD in the HD Bay, everything worked great. It wasn't until I took out the optical drive and put the SSD there.

I was able to go get a new set of SHARP torx drivers and an oversized one with alot of force was able to get the stripped screw out. I put the SSD in the hard drive bay and the HDD in the optical bay and everything is working great... Guess the SSD didn't like being in the optical bay... I was getting the same speeds in both locations though, so it supported 6G kinda.
 
Rajpdx said:
On previous 17 and 15" MBPs the Optical drive interface was nominally 6g but according to OWC who tested this the rest of the wiring couldn't handle 6g speeds - not an issue for Apple as it only has to support Optical Drive speeds.
Click to expand...

This is a load of tripe.....

I have two Samsung 830's in a 2012 13" MBP and both measure the same speed.
 
Damn, I was planning on installing my SSD in the optical bay of my 2012 15" because of the motion sensor thing. Has OWC or anyone else posted any conclusive test results on this? I was planning on doing the deed this weekend...
 
Guys I've been there, done that....I think my thread will be really helpful to you guys....It talks about all the info one could possibly need to know regarding dual-drive setup.....FYI though SSD's in the Optical Drive bay have never been a success without issues as long as one continues to try to make do with a SATAIII....there is a lot of success with SATAII SSD's in Optical drive and it has nothing to do with the year....my MBP 15 last year was a Early 2011 model that I bought in October Brand new and it came with SATAIII 6gbps on both bays but what is happening to you....happened to me as well.....

Also I have confirmed in my thread and will do it again here 100%, tested over 8months that Motion Sensor works in Optical Drive + Main Bay, It is not limited to the location, rather it just disables the drive regardless of what SATA port its connected to when MBP put into free fall or sudden movement detected by it.

Goodluck to you all, I have graduated from the tinkering and moved up to a MBAir as its easier for my needs and I really didn't have the need for all that storage & it was weighing me down during school but it was fun nonetheless while I had it to upgrade the RAM and do the dual drive SSD+HDD setup:) Please read carefully just about every single question has been answered throughout the pages, I will see if I have time to reply any new ones that may possibly be left out.


https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1278494/
 
Last edited:
Satnam1989 said:
FYI though SSD's in the Optical Drive bay have never been a success without issues as long as one continues to try to make do with a SATAIII....there is a lot of success with SATAII SSD's in Optical drive and it has nothing to do with the year...
Click to expand...

While I appreciate you trying to help, you are in fact spreading outdated information. With the 2012 models, there have been reports that the optical bay can, in fact, deliver SATA-III speeds. In the 15" model at least.

http://blog.macsales.com/14064-expand-the-2012-macbook-pros-with-an-owc-data-doubler

OWC said:
You may recall the problems people had using 6Gb/s SSDs in the optical bay of some 2011 MacBook Pros, so we did some preliminary tests this time around, too. We’re happy to say that the 15” model can take a 6Gb/s drive in either bay.
Click to expand...


Now there are people in this thread saying that they are having problems, so we're trying to narrow down the possible reason. Drive cloning seems to be a possible culprit. However, I'm wondering if the problem steams from the OP initialing using the SSD in the HDD bay and then moving it to the optical bay? Maybe if you start with the SSD there won't be any errors? I'm not a tech wizard but I'm still going to try my new 830 in the optical bay. My caddy should arrive on Saturday...
 
Last edited:
mattopotamus said:
why did you switch the two drives? Why not just leave the SSD in the HDD spot and put the HDD in the optical spot? That could be why you only see it done that way
Click to expand...

I think this way works best. In my MBP, if it is the other way around, while it does work, it doesn't work as well. I can't hibernate under Bootcamp with my SSD in the optical bay, either.
 
jbzcar said:
I think this way works best. In my MBP, if it is the other way around, while it does work, it doesn't work as well. I can't hibernate under Bootcamp with my SSD in the optical bay, either.
Click to expand...

Do you have a 15" Mid-2012?
 
I had a similar problem when I also tried swapping my SSD (512gb crucial M4) from the main bay to the optical bay on my late 2011 17" which reports a 6 gigabit link speed on both drive bays. After I swapped it, I could select the boot drive by holding the option key on start up but it wouldn't boot. I then attempted a clean install of lion but the installation was ridiculously slow, quoting about 60 hours left to install. When I swapped the SSD back to the main bay, everything worked again without issue (restored a time machine backup).
 
Cisco_Kid said:
This is a load of tripe.....

I have two Samsung 830's in a 2012 13" MBP and both measure the same speed.
Click to expand...

If a 13" MBP was a 15" or 17" MBP I would agree with you. Since a 13" MBP isn't a 15" or a 17" MBP though, you appear to have the wrong end of the stick. Being an honourable sort I'm sure you'll want to apologise.

For the record - it is correct that OWC tested Sata 3 in 2011 MBPs and found they worked fine. I didn't mention that as we weren't discussing the 13" machines.

Thanks in advance for the apology :)
 
its been a solid day since i installed a samsung 830 256gb drive in my 2012 15" 2.6ghz optical bay. the link speed of the optical bay is 6 gigabit per second, the negotiated link speed is now 6 gigabit per second (vs. the 3 gigabit per second it had when the superdrive was installed). the sad part is, the 750gb 7200rpm HDD that came with my macbook pro is reading at 3 gigabit per second in the main bay, but from what i understand an hdd can't saturate the full sata2 connect. so whatever. apple used a sata2 hdd not a sata3 hdd. i am just confirming my optical bay is running at sata3 speeds. no hiccups yet and i did a fresh install. I just finished installing my software and now i need to transfer files over. i have yet to see an issue, knock on wood.
 
Texaspaul said:
Everything was going well, until I decided to move it to the optical bay and put the Apple 1TB drive in the HD bay. I'm still booting from the m4, but I'm getting a bunch of random beachballs and freezes.
Click to expand...
Did you try a fresh install with the SSD in the ODD bay, or only ever the cloned version?

What ODD adaptor are you using? OWC Data Doubler? Other?

It would be good to narrow down the reasons for your beach-balling (though I appreciate you've ameliorated it by moving the SSD back to the HDD bay).

The four reasons I can think of (in no particular order)...
1. Cloned drive-image not liking the ODD bay
2. Substandard ODD/SDD adaptor caddy
3. Miscellaneous Crucial M4 incompatibility
4. OWC are wrong, and the 2012's ODD is not fully SATA III compatible
 
garstudios said:
i just added a samsung 830 into my optical bay of my 15" 2012 2.6". i was wondering if you came across something i did. when i went to remove the cover (bottom plate) it was like it was glued on. i pryed and pryed and it wouldnt come off. it eventually popped off (which scared the crap out of me) it flew up and almost hit the logic board on its way down with one of its edges, luckily i was quick enough to bump it away with my arm....i couldnt find any sticky tape/pads or glue. i dont know what it was stuck on. it took me a while to catch my breath...
Click to expand...

If the 2012 bottom panel is like the mid-2010, there are a couple of points in the middle where it latches on. As long as you know they are there (I think one of the OWC videos details this), it's easy and worry free to pop it loose. Also, when you put the bottom cover back on, you should press on it around the middle to secure it properly, although perhaps just turning the machine back over and setting it down will do this anyway.
 
NMF said:
While I appreciate you trying to help, you are in fact spreading outdated information. With the 2012 models, there have been reports that the optical bay can, in fact, deliver SATA-III speeds. In the 15" model at least.

http://blog.macsales.com/14064-expand-the-2012-macbook-pros-with-an-owc-data-doubler




Now there are people in this thread saying that they are having problems, so we're trying to narrow down the possible reason. Drive cloning seems to be a possible culprit. However, I'm wondering if the problem steams from the OP initialing using the SSD in the HDD bay and then moving it to the optical bay? Maybe if you start with the SSD there won't be any errors? I'm not a tech wizard but I'm still going to try my new 830 in the optical bay. My caddy should arrive on Saturday...
Click to expand...


You might be correct to some degree, 13" MBP even 2011 that came with Dual-SATAIIII ports were working perfectly without issues....its always been a issue with 15" & 17".....now in 2012 only 15" came along so its the 15" thats still suffering. My information might be slightly out-dated to the fact I haven't done anything like it since late 2011 but results are results and they have yet to change but I highly doubt they actually will....knowing apple is working on bringing all models of MBP up to the retina & thin level that support only SSD's with no Optical-Drive....so I think we will never see the light of day where MBPro's 15" work with SATAIII on both bays without issues......

It might be certain SSD's that work without issue, so if one has the money then sure go and try many different brands till you find the one that doesn't face the issue....
 
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