SSD needs Trim (Puppy Needs Home)

Discussion in 'OS X Mavericks (10.9)' started by sharon22, Apr 28, 2015.

  1. sharon22, Apr 28, 2015
    Last edited: May 27, 2015
  2. WilliamG macrumors 604

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    #2
    Just use Trim Enabler, as you said. I'm not sure why you want to use anything else?
     
  3. sharon22, Apr 29, 2015
    Last edited: May 27, 2015

    sharon22 thread starter macrumors regular

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  4. bobdamnit, May 5, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: May 25, 2015

    bobdamnit macrumors regular

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    #4
    Perhaps Apple has updated their software to disallow using previously known Terminal commands from working, however I doubt it. If Chameleon Trim Enabler can do it, I'm sure its public knowledge somewhere. Or you perhaps entered one of the commands incorrectly.

    I'm not sure why it matters. TRIM was enabled. Mission accomplished.
     
  5. keysofanxiety macrumors 604

    keysofanxiety

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    Nov 23, 2011
    #5
    Good afternoon,

    I can confirm that TRIM can no longer be natively enabled in either Mavericks or Yosemite through the old Terminal commands. I would sincerely recommend against using TRIM Enabler as people who have used it have had issues with the OS not booting after an update.

    In all honesty the life of an SSD will likely exceed that of the machine's. Without TRIM it's not going to do a whole lot of damage. The only way to now enable TRIM is to purchase a TRIM-enabled SSD in the firmware - there is a third-party company who provide them, but I can't remember who it is.

    In my opinion the benefits of having TRIM enabled on OS X are not worth the potential problems that are caused by using TRIM Enabler. I've been using non-TRIM enabled SSDs on OS X for some time, in addition to upgrading them on a number of Macs through my work. I haven't had any tech issues for the last year on non-TRIM enabled SSDs.

    I hope this provides some reassurance.
     
  6. zzzachi, May 12, 2015
    Last edited: May 12, 2015

    zzzachi macrumors member

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    #6
    you can read all about trim enabling for mavericks and yosemite on cindoris website:
    https://www.cindori.org/documentation/#disksensei

    in addition i can tell you that apple on purpose denies trim to all non apple ssds.
    this is very simply done by recognition of "apple" in the vendor id of the ssd's firmware.

    the older terminal commands, trim enabler, disk sensei etc all do the same thing:
    they patch the comparison in apples driver, so that trim doesnt get disabled for non apple ssds.

    note that newer drivers need a newer patch, so take care what you do with your terminal commands.
    better use trim enabler if you're not knowing what you're doing.

    by the way:
    the reason for all this nonsense is also simple: apple's greed for more profit.
    (there was a time when apple were the good guys, good old time)
     
  7. fhall1 macrumors 68040

    fhall1

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    #7
    Trim Enabler has no problems on Mavericks....it's Yosemite that may cause issues on restarts after s/w upgrades.
     
  8. keysofanxiety macrumors 604

    keysofanxiety

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    #8
    I wasn't talking about TRIM Enabler, I was talking about enabling TRIM using the Terminal commands. It doesn't work in either Mavericks or Yosemite.
     
  9. fhall1 macrumors 68040

    fhall1

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    #9
    Sorry if I misunderstood - but reading your first two sentences above sure sounds like you were talking about Trim Enabler:

    "I can confirm that TRIM can no longer be natively enabled in either Mavericks or Yosemite through the old Terminal commands. I would sincerely recommend against using TRIM Enabler as people who have used it have had issues with the OS not booting after an update."
     
  10. zzzachi, May 13, 2015
    Last edited: May 13, 2015

    zzzachi macrumors member

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    #10
    you guys seriously mix things up.

    as said above:
    there is no "natively enable" for trim!
    the terminal commands dont do another thing than the trim enabler.
    the trim enabler is just a nice gui for the same thing.
    both simply apply a patch to apple's sdd driver.

    however you apply the patch,
    yosemite doesnt like a patched kext (driver) due to the new kext signing feature.
    so to be able to boot from an ssd you need to disable kext signing with this os.
    the so called "boot problem" is that if kext signing gets re-enabled (by a hard reset, pm reset)
    you cant boot anymore because the patched driver doesnt get loaded.
    this problem is the same if you use trim enabler or a terminal command patch.

    by using terminal commands you dont understand,
    its just more likely that you mess up your system.
    so stay away from the terminal and better use trim enabler.
     
  11. keysofanxiety macrumors 604

    keysofanxiety

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    #11
    Or even better, don't enable TRIM at all. It's not going to do it any harm if TRIM isn't enabled.
     
  12. zzzachi macrumors member

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    Jun 16, 2012
    #12
    thats what i'd like to know… is it so? who says that?
    until now i didnt find a solid source about the disadvantages when trim is disabled.
     
  13. keysofanxiety macrumors 604

    keysofanxiety

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    Nov 23, 2011
    #13
    Well general reliability of SSDs will almost always exceed the life of the system. TRIM being enabled is basically just garbage collection and prevents future writes to blocks that are already in use. However with almost all modern SSDs, the firmware has some level of this anyway. Furthermore on Sandforce SSDs, enabling TRIM will actually do damage rather than benefiting it.

    Let's consider the worst-case scenario without TRIM being enabled. Let's say that due to it not being enabled, things are being written over, and over, and over, to the same blocks, rather than other ones. Well, modern SSDs are so incredibly reliable that the lifespan will exceed that of the system, even under stresses that no consumer/professional would get anywhere close to. See following article: http://techreport.com/review/27062/the-ssd-endurance-experiment-only-two-remain-after-1-5pb

    So are there slight benefits in enabling TRIM? Technically, yes -- but with the reliability of modern SSDs and the built-in firmware doing most of the garbage collecting anyway, it's not going to be a difference that you notice.

    However if you enable TRIM in OS X for a non-Apple SSD, there is a chance that it will be bricked in a future OS update. It's happened before, and it'll happen again.

    So for those reasons, that's why I always recommend against enabling TRIM. On Mountain Lion/earlier you used to be able to enable it through Terminal commands. Now that you can't, there's an awful lot of danger in using TRIM Enabler to write over OS KEXT files ... I mean, come on guys, who in their right mind would think that's a good idea. The benefits of enabling TRIM with a 3rd-party tool definitely are not worth the potential problems IMHO.
     
  14. zzzachi, May 13, 2015
    Last edited: May 13, 2015

    zzzachi macrumors member

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    #14
    1) sigh, again..
    the trim enabler modifies the driver/kext file
    the terminal command modifies the driver/kext file
    same thing!

    the trim enabler at least checks which version/kext you are using and
    applies the correct patch for it, while a low level terminal command
    applied to the wrong driver version might kill your sytem right away.

    2) on the other hand i want to use my ssd as boot drive, which
    means gazilions of small files are read and deleted all the time.
    with a lazy garbage collection i fear the ssd fills up faster, or
    access times get slower… anyway.. a lot of talk out there, but
    nothing really solid.

    (your source doesnt say anything about trim, and on a normal
    windows system trim is enabled for those ssd drives)
     
  15. keysofanxiety macrumors 604

    keysofanxiety

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    Nov 23, 2011
    #15
    Yes yes, - but that's not what I'm arguing. I'm saying you don't need to enable TRIM and that the potential problems are not worth the minimal benefits. I've given my sources and arguments, you're welcome to reply with yours.
     
  16. sharon22, May 24, 2015
    Last edited: May 27, 2015

    sharon22 thread starter macrumors regular

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  17. bobdamnit, May 25, 2015
    Last edited by a moderator: May 25, 2015

    bobdamnit macrumors regular

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    #17
    You said yourself that TrimEnabler managed to get TRIM enabled where the terminal commands wouldn't.

    So again...

    Also, nowhere in my post did I ever mention anything about speed or life of TRIM vs no-TRIM SSD's. That argument was brought up after my post. Please leave my name out of that argument. Thanks.
     

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