Stray Plane Forces Capitol Evacuation (AGAIN)

evilernie

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Jan 6, 2005
306
0
Another one.

I'm not a pilot and I can't say I know anything about filing a flight plan or stuff like that. But if I was I sure as hell would STAY AWAY from Washington DC. Especially since this has happened what, 5 times in the last month or two?

http://www.nbc4.com/news/4668982/detail.html
 

iGary

Guest
May 26, 2004
19,583
0
Randy's House
He was supposedly avoiding weather, and we did have some bad storms here last night.

BUT

Why he was flying VFR in a King Air is beyond me.
 

MongoTheGeek

macrumors 68040
evilernie said:
Another one.

I'm not a pilot and I can't say I know anything about filing a flight plan or stuff like that. But if I was I sure as hell would STAY AWAY from Washington DC. Especially since this has happened what, 5 times in the last month or two?

http://www.nbc4.com/news/4668982/detail.html
Reminds me of a joke. A man was flying around in his cesna and got a bit lost over the Nevada desert. He wandered over area 51 and was forced down by some rather irate air force pilots, held for 24 hours, interrogated, subjected to body cavity searches, his plane was thoroughly checked out and he was released and told not to do it again.

Sure enough the next day, theres the same guy in the same plane flying over area 51. The Air Force forces him down and is about to read him the riot act again when he points to his wife in the plane, and says "Tell her, she didn't believe me."
 

stubeeef

macrumors 68030
Aug 10, 2004
2,702
2
iGary said:
Why he was flying VFR in a King Air is beyond me.
The plane originated in Delaware and was headed to Ohio, said Gary Bracken, a spokesman for the Bureau of U.S. Customs and Border Protection. Bracken said the pilot wrote a flight plan but did not file it with federal officials.
BINGO! Probably an owner operator, rich enough and successful enough to know everything. (could be wrong, but would fit the scenario)
 

IJ Reilly

macrumors P6
Jul 16, 2002
17,915
1,466
Palookaville
According to the story:

The pilot of plane was Scott Murwin of Athens, Ga., a longtime pilot for Standridge Color Corp., a plastics products company based in Social Circle, Ga., his wife confirmed.
Apparently, a corporate pilot. Probably ATP rated to boot.
 

IJ Reilly

macrumors P6
Jul 16, 2002
17,915
1,466
Palookaville
Incidentally, where does it say he was VFR? I couldn't find any reference to that in the article, except for the confused mention of a flight plan.
 

Mr. Durden

macrumors 6502a
Jan 13, 2005
716
0
Colorado
How long before one of these planes gets shot down? There can only be so many instances of this happening before someone gets a SAM fired at them.

I wouldnt doubt they do the next guy on purpose to make an example of 'em. I bet after someone gets blown from the sky, these accidents stop happening, or at least become much more rare.
 

iGary

Guest
May 26, 2004
19,583
0
Randy's House
IJ Reilly said:
These incursions are already quite rare, and no we don't need any dead pilots and passengers to prevent it.
Uh huh:

General Aviation News

How did two Cessna 150 pilots cause worldwide hysteria?

Charles Spence

6/3/2005

WASHINGTON, D.C. — From January to mid-April of this year, Blackhawk helicopters patrolling the sky in the ADIZ around the Washington/Baltimore area have responded to more than 280 incursions. That averaged three a day. But one last month — when two persons in a Cessna 150 came close to the White House — generated worldwide hysteria. What made this one so different?

Apparently there were two differences with this flight. First, after entering the ADIZ the aircraft, according to a depiction in "The Washington Post" — appeared to be exiting the ADIZ and then suddenly turned back, aiming directly toward the government buildings and, second, the pilots refused to alter course after the intercept. As a result, the flight came within three miles of the White House. That distance is less than one-and-a-half lengths of a runway at Dulles Airport. The plane came within seconds of a decision to shoot down.

After first heading for the airport at Leesburg, Va., and then going to Frederick, Md., the plane landed and both pilots were taken into custody. It was explained that neither the pilot nor the person with a student license had checked weather or NOTAMS. Reports indicated when Blackhawk helicopters came alongside the 150, the elder man "froze" and the student pilot had to take over and follow the intercepting aircraft.

No charges were filed against the two pilots, but the FAA has actions pending against the older man with a private license, and you can bet your bottom dollar that both pilots are being investigated to a point that there will be a record of their lives down to knowing every time they burped.

Much of the Homeland Security Department's efforts are classified. But some information indicates the extent of ADIZ incursions. From January 2003 to July 2004, there were more than 2,000 "targets of interest" detected over the Washington airspace. The Blackhawks based at Reagan National Airport scrambled 350 times. Some of these were aircraft violating the ADIZ, some were the result of poor communications, and some were reported to be radar problems.
 

rainman::|:|

macrumors 603
Feb 2, 2002
5,438
2
iowa
far as i'm concerned, we should just evacuate washington dc at this point. at least that way, people could get some work done, rather than acting like a stoned teenager in the dark: "what was that??! and that!? aaaa!" actually the government kind of reminds me of Tweak, from southpark. Well, I'm sure the countless evacuations will prove to be worthwhile, at some point, in the next 1000 years...
 

rickvanr

macrumors 68040
Apr 10, 2002
3,256
11
Brockville
It might just be me, but its borderline ridiculous with all the hysteria that they are causing. Makes me think they are just trying to scare the public by making them think that they are in real trouble, when they aren't at all, so it looks like they are doing a good job at 'protecting' them.
 

iGary

Guest
May 26, 2004
19,583
0
Randy's House
rickvanr said:
It might just be me, but its borderline ridiculous with all the hysteria that they are causing. Makes me think they are just trying to scare the public by making them think that they are in real trouble, when they aren't at all, so it looks like they are doing a good job at 'protecting' them.
Damned if you do, damned if you don't.

I feel no pitty for any pilot that strays into the Balt/Wash ADIZ - it's huge.

If you make it into the Washington No Fly area, you deserve to be escorted out and have your ticket yanked.
 

FoxyKaye

macrumors 68000
Didn't they throw a bunch of my taxpayer money into some fancy-schmancy alternating-red-green laser system that's supposed to keep Cessnas and other threats out of the DC airspace? Or is that kind of like the Star Wars space defense system - it costs money but doesn't really work?
 

iGary

Guest
May 26, 2004
19,583
0
Randy's House
FoxyKaye said:
Didn't they throw a bunch of my taxpayer money into some fancy-schmancy alternating-red-green laser system that's supposed to keep Cessnas and other threats out of the DC airspace? Or is that kind of like the Star Wars space defense system - it costs money but doesn't really work?
Still in testing, but yes.

Planes are like cars - there are a lot of idiots that have no business in them.
 

IJ Reilly

macrumors P6
Jul 16, 2002
17,915
1,466
Palookaville
If drivers had to meet even one tenth the number of standard required to get and then retain a pilot's license, then America's roads would be much safer -- if only because they'd be nearly empty.

Which of course doesn't make it impossible for "idiots" to get pilots licenses, but it does make it much more difficult, and then harder for them to keep if they screw up.
 

Dont Hurt Me

macrumors 603
Dec 21, 2002
6,056
6
Yahooville S.C.
rickvanr said:
It might just be me, but its borderline ridiculous with all the hysteria that they are causing. Makes me think they are just trying to scare the public by making them think that they are in real trouble, when they aren't at all, so it looks like they are doing a good job at 'protecting' them.
Looks like Osama has allready won if you ask me.
 

Apple Hobo

macrumors 6502a
Mar 19, 2004
795
0
A series of tubes
But one last month — when two persons in a Cessna 150 came close to the White House — generated worldwide hysteria.
rickvanr said:
It might just be me, but its borderline ridiculous with all the hysteria that they are causing. Makes me think they are just trying to scare the public by making them think that they are in real trouble, when they aren't at all, so it looks like they are doing a good job at 'protecting' them.

After 9/11, small-time pilots have made for convenient scapegoats. The media also loves making up wild stories of daredevil terrorist pilots and their ultra-dangerous Cessnas. They want you to believe that a C-152 or Piper Cub will bring down an entire nuclear plant. Of course, the Gov can implement a bunch of useless rules that do absolutely nothing for safety, but it will make them appear that they are doing something. These rules simply make things more difficult for the honest, law-abiding pilots; do you think terrorists on a suicide mission care about breaking a few FAA regulations?

Also, The death toll and collateral damage from shooting down a Cessna over a city would probably be worse than just letting crash into a building.
 

IJ Reilly

macrumors P6
Jul 16, 2002
17,915
1,466
Palookaville
I prefer "private" to "small time" pilot, thank you, but you are correct -- general aviation has been a convenient punching bag since 9/11 despite the fact that no act of terrorism has ever been committed with a general aviation airplane. GA was grounded for a long time after 9/11 and it took much intense lobbying on the part of AOPA to get even some of the airspace reopened. Even then, the rules and restrictions applied to GA were so complicated and arbitrary (and ineffectual), that they were practically begging to be violated. Honestly, it's amazing that nobody got shot down during the first few months after GA resumed post-9/11 because we really didn't know for certain where we weren't allowed to go. The situation is better now, but flight restrictions can still pop up virtually without notice, and some of the really dumb ones that were created right after 9/11 still haven't been dropped.
 

Mr. Durden

macrumors 6502a
Jan 13, 2005
716
0
Colorado
IJ Reilly said:
These incursions are already quite rare, and no we don't need any dead pilots and passengers to prevent it.
I wasnt advocating shooting anyone down, just wondering aloud when it will happen (I'm willing to be it will eventually happen).

They dont seem so very rare when you see something about it on the news every couple of weeks. Surely all those politicians who get jarred out of their naps and payoffs are sick of running for their lives everytime someone accidently flies too close to "sensitive" areas.

Bush just might order them to shoot down the next one and blame it on Saddam, for all we know.
 

IJ Reilly

macrumors P6
Jul 16, 2002
17,915
1,466
Palookaville
Mr. Durden said:
I wasnt advocating shooting anyone down, just wondering aloud when it will happen (I'm willing to be it will eventually happen).

They dont seem so very rare when you see something about it on the news every couple of weeks. Surely all those politicians who get jarred out of their naps and payoffs are sick of running for their lives everytime someone accidently flies too close to "sensitive" areas.

Bush just might order them to shoot down the next one and blame it on Saddam, for all we know.
You mean twice, in total? The Washington ADIZ and restricted airspace has been in place for nearly four years now. I don't think two incidents of this kind is such a terrible record, or that two incidents over a period of as many months indicates a developing trend of some kind.

Incidentally, I've been looking for another story on this incident but can't seem to find one. I'm still trying to figure out what this pilot did.