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Teachers are bad luck in space

johnee said:
I understand your point and you are completely correct wrt/ historical missions and the attitude taken by NASA about them.

However we do have the glaring fact that 7 (?) astronauts died as a result of damaged tiles.

The question is: when tile damage occurs, is it the lethal kind or not? Without definitive studies showing what type/location of tile damage leads to hull integrity deterioration, all tile damage situations must be treated as if they will lead to it.

it's sad that many talented people had to die for tile damage to be taken seriously.
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While I agree that this is a serious issue, I believe the news media is hyping it up way more than it needs to be. The damage to Columbia was on the leading edge of the wing, an area that experiences huge amounts of thermal pressure on reentry. Additionally, the area of Columbia which was struck is made out of composite materials, and is different than the tile on the bottom of the ship. I have full faith in the engineers working on the shuttle to make a decision that is best for both the ship and the crew - no one at NASA (esp. after Columbia) wants to see ANYTHING bad happen, and they all take their jobs very seriously.


Ah, so you were there for the launch too? How far did you travel for it? I road tripped all the way from Montreal to see it, haha. My job hooked my friends and I up with launch passes and tours of the KSC, so we had a great time. We got to the 600-ft barrier the day before the launch and got some great shots of Endeavour on the pad, even though the shuttle itself was still in its protective housing.
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I came from Los Angeles...I was on one of the VIP tours too (I managed to snag an invite from NASA HQ)! There were actually some people on my bus from Montreal...do you happen to remember what bus you were on, or who your tour guide was?
 
MacFan25863 said:
I came from Los Angeles...I was on one of the VIP tours too (I managed to snag an invite from NASA HQ)! There were actually some people on my bus from Montreal...do you happen to remember what bus you were on, or who your tour guide was?
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Congrats on the invite from NASA HQ! How did you swing that?

I work for the Canadian Space Agency, so everyone here gets invitations to every launch. This one was especially big for us because one of our astronauts (Dave Williams) went up for his second flight. There were several hundred people affiliated with the CSA who attended the launch, so we had a whole lot of busses, haha.

I was on the Causeway B bus, and our tour guide was actually a NASA engineer working on the Constellation/Orion project. He knew pretty much everything about everything, so that was awesome. The day before the launch when we were cruising around the KSC for the tour, he took our bus away from the group and brought us around the back side of the launch pad where we weren't supposed to go. There were some pissed off guards, haha.

EDIT: Forgot to mention that our tour guide's name was Gary. Our bus driver was Bob. They made quite a pair!

Just by random chance, I happened to meet the families of Dave Williams and Barbara Morgan at our hotel (apparently Dave and Barbara are really close friends), and they invited my friends and I to a beach breakfast on the morning of the launch. We accidentally slept through the breakfast because we went skinny-dipping at Jetty Park the night before, but it was cool meeting them anyway. :eek:

Did you get a chance to try the Shuttle Experience ride at the KSCVC after your tour? I couldn't stop laughing the whole time, haha.
 
jczubach said:
hey J., methinks your tinfoil hat is too tight, please adjust your set...:p
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Yeah, no one should take me seriously, i don't. I also don't take most things in the physical/mental/spiritual world seriously either. I used to be serious about most things in life, but i've learned there's no point to that. Life is much better with the former method. :)

I recommend it.
 
Hey J., no offence intended, just havin' fun and loving your threads, by the way. i'm making my own tin foil hat out of cigarette liners, light and have a distinct, pleasing aroma. they just won't let me out of the house wearing it, too avant garde, or so i am able to delude myself into accepting.:D
 
jczubach said:
Hey J., no offence intended, just havin' fun and loving your threads, by the way. i'm making my own tin foil hat out of cigarette liners, light and have a distinct, pleasing aroma. they just won't let me out of the house wearing it, too avant garde, or so i am able to delude myself into accepting.:D
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none taken. I admit i'm a jerk sometimes but that's only because i like exploring the bounds of how we think. many people seem to, "accept" what is and what isn't without questioning, but I try not to do that. That's why I can flip from one side of an argument to another so easily. I'm not tied to a "position" per se so I can instigate an engagement and exploration of the bounds.

avant garde is where you want to be :)

elfin buddy said:
I work for the Canadian Space Agency
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Great robotic arm! :D

seriously, that's really cool. Do you ever get to check out the russian space agency? I hear they're upping their price for private citizens because they're running out of cash :(
 
johnee said:
Great robotic arm! :D

seriously, that's really cool. Do you ever get to check out the russian space agency? I hear they're upping their price for private citizens because they're running out of cash :(
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Haha, thanks! We do tend pride ourselves on the Canadarm and Canadarm2, especially since we don't have independent launch capabilities :p

I'm not directly involved with the Canadarm in my current job, but I worked on software for the arm last summer. Many of my friends here at the CSA are working on the SPDM (DEXTRE), which is an extension for the Canadarm2 that will reduce the need for spacewalks by providing very precise and dextrous tools that mimic what a human can do. The completed SPDM was shipped to Florida just a few months ago, and it's scheduled to go up in February. Funny story, they actually had trouble getting the SPDM across the border into the US because its protective packaging had a giant "LAUNCH" sticker on it and it spooked the border guards, haha.

I've never looked much into the Russian Space Agency, though I knew they have been sending up space tourists to the ISS. It really wouldn't surprise me if they were running out of money :rolleyes:
 
elfin buddy said:
Haha, thanks! We do tend pride ourselves on the Canadarm and Canadarm2, especially since we don't have independent launch capabilities :p

I'm not directly involved with the Canadarm in my current job, but I worked on software for the arm last summer. Many of my friends here at the CSA are working on the SPDM (DEXTRE), which is an extension for the Canadarm2 that will reduce the need for spacewalks by providing very precise and dextrous tools that mimic what a human can do. The completed SPDM was shipped to Florida just a few months ago, and it's scheduled to go up in February. Funny story, they actually had trouble getting the SPDM across the border into the US because its protective packaging had a giant "LAUNCH" sticker on it and it spooked the border guards, haha.

I've never looked much into the Russian Space Agency, though I knew they have been sending up space tourists to the ISS. It really wouldn't surprise me if they were running out of money :rolleyes:
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that is funny about the border check. I live in vermont about an hour away from the border and crossing the border has gotten "fun" as of late.

That's awesome you work on the arm's software. great job and keep it up!
 
elfin buddy said:
Congrats on the invite from NASA HQ! How did you swing that?

Did you get a chance to try the Shuttle Experience ride at the KSCVC after your tour? I couldn't stop laughing the whole time, haha.
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Ah...I was on the Administrator's Guest bus. Did you watch it from Banana Creek or the Causeway?

I was a finalist in a video contest about NASA last year so they sent me an invite.

Yeah...I thought it was kinda lame. I enjoyed Mission:Space at EPCOT wayyy more than the Shuttle Experience. Too bad they didn't combine the two...that would be a pretty awesome ride.

Speaking about the SPDM....

(the first picture is of the SPDM on the ISS assembly floor, the second is of the decal on the floor next to it ;) )
 
If teachers are such bad luck it still doesn't explain what happened to the Columbia. IIRC, there was no teacher aboard for that mission. Why, then, did that one happen to go so wrong?
 
Could you imagine if that thing blew up again???

"We dont need no education.
We dont need no mission control.
No dark sarcasm in the vessel.
Teacher, leave those shuttles alone.
All in all its just another tile in the hull."

Pink-Floyd---Dark-Side-of-The-Moon-Poster-C10055523.jpeg
 
johnee said:
that is funny about the border check. I live in vermont about an hour away from the border and crossing the border has gotten "fun" as of late.

That's awesome you work on the arm's software. great job and keep it up!
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We had a terrible time crossing into Vermont on the way south. There was a lineup at the border that took about an hour and a half to get through. We amused ourselves by rolling down the windows and rocking out to Backstreet Boys :p

MacFan25863 said:
Ah...I was on the Administrator's Guest bus. Did you watch it from Banana Creek or the Causeway?

I was a finalist in a video contest about NASA last year so they sent me an invite.

Yeah...I thought it was kinda lame. I enjoyed Mission:Space at EPCOT wayyy more than the Shuttle Experience. Too bad they didn't combine the two...that would be a pretty awesome ride.

Speaking about the SPDM....

(the first picture is of the SPDM on the ISS assembly floor, the second is of the decal on the floor next to it ;) )
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Nice pic of the SPDM! Small world, eh? I especially like the sense of humour about it being Canadian, haha. We have a model of the SPDM in the High Bays right next to my lab. It's a neat little piece of technology!

floriflee said:
If teachers are such bad luck it still doesn't explain what happened to the Columbia. IIRC, there was no teacher aboard for that mission. Why, then, did that one happen to go so wrong?
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Though it's complete ********, one could argue that it happened because Barbara Morgan was in training at the time and was scheduled to go up not too long after the Columbia mission. It delayed her trip to space by several years ;)
 
yellow said:
Bah. Just drink a whole crapload of whisky before takeoff and landing and everything will be fine!
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I think the whole astronaut drinking thing is a whole bunch of bs. I've met and talked with a bunch of astronauts, and they would NEVER put themselves or their crew at risk. Going to space takes YEARS of training and hard work (most astronauts file their application 15 to 20 years before they even get to sit in the seat of a shuttle!) and I seriously doubt they would even want to risk putting that on the line. Not to mention the fact that the medical exams they receive before launch are VERY detailed and any sign of intoxication would immediately result in a scrubbed launch (and an astronaut without a job!).
 
Unless they showed stock footage on the news of a different shuttle landing it seems they made it home safely.:)
 
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