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The 2020-2021 Football Thread

The-Real-Deal82 said:
Glad to see Barca effectively show Messi the door. It’s a huge reality check for him as the money he has been earning for so long is obscene (£123m a season). As much as I’d like to see him play here in England, I’d hope the clubs here have more sense. It looks like he’ll either go to the low standard French league with PSG or perhaps even home to Argentina. He’s still got a few more years yet I think he’s simply too expensive to play in any of Europe’s top leagues now. There will always be that question over him I think, he should have played in more than one country IMO.
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Damage is done though...retaining him did not ruin the club all by itself. But the club totally fumbled its dealings with BOTH Neymar and Messi. In the former case, they might has well have lit his transfer fee on fire for all the good it did on the pitch. They bought remarkably badly. In the latter case, they should have shown him the door years ago, before they bankrupted themselves paying his wages.

Barcelona's story is one of a rich, privileged club breaking itself trying to keep up with still richer, even more privileged clubs.

Man City and PSG have pushed the insanity of football finances into stomach-churning new territory. It's madness to try and compete with them financially, because their plan has always been to disrupt the hierarchy through financial doping. Typically, mere corporations can't compete with nation-states at that game.

What's next? Does nation-state ownership of professional teams become a normal model? It's pretty much the only way to keep on the current trajectory...
 
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The-Real-Deal82 said:
Glad to see Barca effectively show Messi the door. It’s a huge reality check for him as the money he has been earning for so long is obscene (£123m a season). As much as I’d like to see him play here in England, I’d hope the clubs here have more sense. It looks like he’ll either go to the low standard French league with PSG or perhaps even home to Argentina. He’s still got a few more years yet I think he’s simply too expensive to play in any of Europe’s top leagues now. There will always be that question over him I think, he should have played in more than one country IMO.
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I don’t think he would cut it in England. You can’t teach an old dog new tricks and I think he would spend most of his time on the deck not used to how physical it can get. I just don’t see him playing at Brentford on a Wednesday night in November having lumps kicked out of him.
 
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Lord Blackadder said:
Damage is done though...retaining him did not ruin the club all by itself. But the club totally fumbled its dealings with BOTH Neymar and Messi. In the former case, they might has well have lit his transfer fee on fire for all the good it did on the pitch. They bought remarkably badly. In the latter case, they should have shown him the door years ago, before they bankrupted themselves paying his wages.

Barcelona's story is one of a rich, privileged club breaking itself trying to keep up with still richer, even more privileged clubs.

Man City and PSG have pushed the insanity of football finances into stomach-churning new territory. It's madness to try and compete with them financially, because their plan has always been to disrupt the hierarchy through financial doping. Typically, mere corporations can't compete with nation-states at that game.

What's next? Does nation-state ownership of professional teams become a normal model? It's pretty much the only way to keep on the current trajectory...
Click to expand...
Excellent post and very well said.

Both The Guardian and The Irish Times (an article by the excellent Simon Kuper of the Financial Times) have fascinating pieces on that very subject today (Friday August 6) which are well worth a close read.
 
danny842003 said:
I don’t think he would cut it in England. You can’t teach an old dog new tricks and I think he would spend most of his time on the deck not used to how physical it can get. I just don’t see him playing at Brentford on a Wednesday night in November having lumps kicked out of him.
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He's old. So he won't be able to maintain the required level of athleticism much longer, and he can't outrun anyone anymore. He can still out-dribble and out-pass any player alive, has amazing finishing, his deadball skills are unsurpassed, and he has world-class game intelligence. I think he’d be a great addition to any team on the planet. If referees let him get kicked to death that’s the fault of the league, not Messi.

He’s just ruinously expensive, that’s all. No player, however good, should cost that much.
 
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Lord Blackadder said:
He's old. So he won't be able to maintain the required level of athleticism much longer, and he can't outrun anyone anymore. He can still out-dribble and out-pass any player alive, has amazing finishing, his deadball skills are unsurpassed, and he has world-class game intelligence. I think he’d be a great addition to any team on the planet. If referees let him get kicked to death that’s the fault of the league, not Messi.

He’s just ruinously expensive, that’s all. No player, however good, should cost that much.
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He would out puzzle people for sure. Still people would stick their foot in and walk the line just enough that it make him hesitate. At least that’s my opinion.
I’m not doubting his skill but I think he would be terrified of the prospect playing in the EPL.
Schumacher was the best F1 driver ever, his return was truely awful and it wasn’t just the car. I think a move to EPL has the same potential.
 
As the Charity Shield (Leicester the deserving victors, they defeated Manchester City) - which is often viewed as a sort of curtain raiser to the new season - has just been played this afternoon, I have taken the liberty of starting a new thread for the 2021-2022 season.
 
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Man City may win a basketful of trophies this season with their stacked squad, but there is one 'trophy' they can't win now, and that's the Community Shield. Leicester stood up well and looked the better team as the match wound down, though the speed of play for both sides was more 'friendly' than 'cup final.' 100 million-pound man Grealish came on late to much fanfare.

Former Columbus Crew keeper Zack Steffen looked sharp between the sticks for Man City, it's the one area where I actively root for a player in a City shirt. He made several very good saves and nearly saved the spot kick that resulted in the game's only goal.

danny842003 said:
He would out puzzle people for sure. Still people would stick their foot in and walk the line just enough that it make him hesitate. At least that’s my opinion.
I’m not doubting his skill but I think he would be terrified of the prospect playing in the EPL.
Schumacher was the best F1 driver ever, his return was truely awful and it wasn’t just the car. I think a move to EPL has the same potential.
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Columbus Crew won MLS with a 36 year-old diminutive Argentinian No. 10 with no pace but superb vision, passing, and dead ball skills. He got kicked all the time, but also regularly made fools of defenders. Sure, that was 2008, But Messi is younger and (as much as it pains me to admit it) another notch up in skill compared to our own dear Guillermo Barros-Schelotto. I think he'd be OK wherever he went, provided he was paired up with other midfielders who could do the physical work.
 
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danny842003 said:
I don’t think he would cut it in England. You can’t teach an old dog new tricks and I think he would spend most of his time on the deck not used to how physical it can get. I just don’t see him playing at Brentford on a Wednesday night in November having lumps kicked out of him.
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That’s a comment many of my friends have said too, Messi is just not used to hard football.

I do think it’s sad a player if his calibre though is joining the weak French league. It’s probably on par with Scotland for competitive edge. He’s a player that is a bring his career at the mercy of agents all after a cut of his huge salary demands. I’ve always said he is one of the greatest ever, but staying at Barca an entire career will always raise questions. Going to France just raises further questions I think. It’s all about the money at the detriment of part of his legacy. Oh well, he’s rich and doesn’t care no doubt lol.
 
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The-Real-Deal82 said:
That’s a comment many of my friends have said too, Messi is just not used to hard football.

I do think it’s sad a player if his calibre though is joining the weak French league. It’s probably on par with Scotland for competitive edge. He’s a player that is a bring his career at the mercy of agents all after a cut of his huge salary demands. I’ve always said he is one of the greatest ever, but staying at Barca an entire career will always raise questions. Going to France just raises further questions I think. It’s all about the money at the detriment of part of his legacy. Oh well, he’s rich and doesn’t care no doubt lol.
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Surely a little tougher than the SPL? No?
 
The-Real-Deal82 said:
That’s a comment many of my friends have said too, Messi is just not used to hard football.

I do think it’s sad a player if his calibre though is joining the weak French league. It’s probably on par with Scotland for competitive edge. He’s a player that is a bring his career at the mercy of agents all after a cut of his huge salary demands. I’ve always said he is one of the greatest ever, but staying at Barca an entire career will always raise questions. Going to France just raises further questions I think. It’s all about the money at the detriment of part of his legacy. Oh well, he’s rich and doesn’t care no doubt lol.
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I don't think there's any question he's one of the greatest, and one of the most naturally talented, footballers to have ever played the game. As to trophies, it's a team sport...had he been born in Spain or Brazil he alone would probably have been worth an additional world cup trophy in addition to what they already won...it was his misfortune to be born in an era where Argentina was maybe not as deep in terms of talent as they've been in years past.

As to 'hard football', I get in discussions with friends all the time over this (and to be fair, many of my friends agree with you!)...I don't really believe in the existence of 'hard football' in elite leagues. The Premiere League is definitely a league where the average speed and size/athleticism of players is higher than most, and I agree that Messi would have to change his game a little to adapt to that. But a player of his caliber could absolutely do that. He'd probably win a lot of fouls in dangerous areas and leave opposing teams soiling themselves at the free kick possibilities.

As an example - look at Shaqiri at Liverpool. Tiny fella, technical play is his stock in trade rather than speed/power, but while not a superstar he's done just fine in the Premier League. He also has bigger, faster players around him creating space. Again, a team sport.

'Hard Football' is another way of saying 'mediocre football'. I see a lot of 'hard football' in CONCACAF...lower skilled players kicking and pulling down players they can't catch. WC qualifiers against the likes of Honduras or Costa Rica can get really ugly. But at the end of the day that style hurts you more than your opponent.
 
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