The 2022-2023 Football Thread

daneoni said:
The PSG structure looks toxic. And Mbappe has started to believe his own hype like Neymar.
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Neymar is toxic. Neymar is more brand than player, is a spoiled brat, and is surrounded by a huge school of poisonous sharks sucking the life and money out of everything around them. He may be the most talented player of the post Robaldo-Messi era but his lifestyle and the people around him make him a problematic figure. And now he’s publicly pro Bolsanaro to boot. Ugh.
 
Lord Blackadder said:
Neymar is toxic. [snip] And now he’s publicly pro Bolsanaro to boot. Ugh.
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I didn't know that (shows how much I care about him).
That amplifies the opinion I have of him.

I think the problem with the uber-talented highly-paid modern football superstar is the "Yes Men." From agents to entourage, they are continually told that not only are they the best, but they are right. Not just right, but RIGHT!.
I don't remember there being this much ego in the days of Hoddle, Keegan and Shilton. Or Romario, or Pasarella, or even as modern as Kluivert and Roberto Carlos.
 
HandsomeDanNZ said:
I don't remember there being this much ego in the days of Hoddle, Keegan and Shilton. Or Romario, or Pasarella, or even as modern as Kluivert and Roberto Carlos.
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These issues existed in the past. But the ballooning finances of professional football have massively raised the stakes. It is now possible for an agent to make a secure lifetime fortune from a single deal, for entourage members to live very comfortably by siphoning off just a fraction of a percent of a footballer’s wages. For family members to carve out sketchy but hugely lucrative ‘careers’ brokering access to their famous sibling or child.

The lure is too great not to attract the lowest characters into seeking an ill -gotten fortune from these very young men who have had little education or life experience and are now surrounded by ‘friends’.
 
Lord Blackadder said:
These issues existed in the past. But the ballooning finances of professional football have massively raised the stakes. It is now possible for an agent to make a secure lifetime fortune from a single deal, for entourage members to live very comfortably by siphoning off just a fraction of a percent of a footballer’s wages. For family members to carve out sketchy but hugely lucrative ‘careers’ brokering access to their famous sibling or child.

The lure is too great not to attract the lowest characters into seeking an ill -gotten fortune from these very young men who have had little education or life experience and are now surrounded by ‘friends’.
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Such a sad indictment on the Human Condition....
 
Lord Blackadder said:
These issues existed in the past. But the ballooning finances of professional football have massively raised the stakes. It is now possible for an agent to make a secure lifetime fortune from a single deal, for entourage members to live very comfortably by siphoning off just a fraction of a percent of a footballer’s wages. For family members to carve out sketchy but hugely lucrative ‘careers’ brokering access to their famous sibling or child.

The lure is too great not to attract the lowest characters into seeking an ill -gotten fortune from these very young men who have had little education or life experience and are now surrounded by ‘friends’.
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I think the off pitch antics are also publicised much more with social media.
But like @HandsomeDanNZ says, I just watch the football. I’m not interested in all the rest. Another benefit of not being on any.
 
Firmino has become Liverpool's Willian - finding his best form when everyone else in the squad is struggling. Mo gets back to scoring form as well...but it was against an SPL team.

Clobbering Rangers is all fine and well, but Man City will tear 'Pool apart this weekend and that could well be the defining moment of the season, at least domestically...the league itself is long gone but a big defeat here will underline just how solid Man City's dominance is. A 'good' result for Liverpool will be a 3-1 loss (i.e. scoring at least one goal and avoiding a cricket score). Unless Pep does something silly like putting Haaland in goal, we're toast. The defense is too patched up at present, and even if all our attackers have a good day we won't out-score this opponent in a straight slugfest.

At this point I'd absolutely bite your hand off for a fourth place finish.

Apple fanboy said:
I just watch the football. I’m not interested in all the rest. Another benefit of not being on any.
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I also ignore the social media - though if you read any football journalism - even good stuff - you can't escape Twitter/Instagram/Tik Tok etc., because that's where most news stories, both genuine and garbage, happen these days.
 
I see football and loyalty are once again highlighted as mutually exclusive (unless there's something going on in the back room that we mere mortals don't know about):

Joe Shields (Saints' Head of Recruitment) is rumoured (strongly) to be heading to Chelsea.
https://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/2...recruitment-joe-shields-talks-switch-chelsea/

He's been with Saints for 3 months, after joining from Man City. We've done OK out of him - he's brought us a number of young Man City graduates and they are doing pretty well, all told, but 3 months feels like a short-term contract rather than a full-time job.

I'd imagine Chelsea could offer him a significant amount more than Southampton would pay him and it would likely be a decent career move, but surely it's just a bit on-the-nose to be leaving after 3 months, unless Saints are terrible to work for?
 
HandsomeDanNZ said:
I'd imagine Chelsea could offer him a significant amount more than Southampton would pay him and it would likely be a decent career move, but surely it's just a bit on-the-nose to be leaving after 3 months, unless Saints are terrible to work for?
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Clubs generally have little loyalty to any of their employees, so why should the latter reciprocate? It's frustrating for fans but that is what football's business culture has created for us.
 
HandsomeDanNZ said:
You're absolutely right objectively, but I am a fan, so objectivity has no place in this conversation. ;););)
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I was just listening to a podcast about Columbus firing their manager, Caleb Porter, and several of the panelists (local sports journalists) had gotten to know him and his family well. They seemed to genuinely have settled in central Ohio, and when you think about how his family are getting packed off with him...well, regardless of the sporting reasons I can understand why these guys take a mercenary approach to their jobs.

And, of course, the vast majority of pro soccer coaches aren't making the kind of money your Peps and Klopps and so forth are.
 
Lord Blackadder said:
And, of course, the vast majority of pro soccer coaches aren't making the kind of money your Peps and Klopps and so forth are.
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The vast majority of football professionals full stop are not earning what many would like to think.

Average wage in the MLS is something like $60k a year and that's supposed to also cover things like buying your own boots and paying for your hangers-on.
I know some lucky individuals earn more than that a week, but the vast majority of players, coaches, backroom staff etc earn pretty ordinary money.
 
HandsomeDanNZ said:
The vast majority of football professionals full stop are not earning what many would like to think.

Average wage in the MLS is something like $60k a year and that's supposed to also cover things like buying your own boots and paying for your hangers-on.
I know some lucky individuals earn more than that a week, but the vast majority of players, coaches, backroom staff etc earn pretty ordinary money.
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Right. $65k is the latest minimum figure in MLS…back when the league started in 1996 it was only $24k, and there were years where certain categories of player earned as little as half that. Which was not, even back then, a living wage.

Plus, you have to factor in that you’ll only earn that wage through your early to mid thirties…then you need to find a completely new career.
 
HandsomeDanNZ said:
I see Steve Bruce is looking for work again.
I wonder how long it'll be before he's linked with the upcoming gig at Southampton.

I dare say, if Saints don't win this weekend, Ralph will be given the heave-ho.

So, with that in mind, who would be a good manager to take over? We have a young, recently overhauled squad, with a few injuries and a lot of raw talent.
We need a striker, so Sean Dyche is out - he likes a big front man and we haven't got one. Although he might be able to lure a large man from the Championship up to the Prem in January...
Steve Bruce would be a disaster.
Saints couldn't realistically afford to go back to Poch or Ronnie K, so what's left out there?
Could Saints lure Ange Postecoglu from Celtic and European football to play in the lower end of the Premier League? I would doubt it.
There must be a gem of a manager out there in a smaller club (someone like Potter) who just needs the big break?
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John Herdman would be good for Southampton, I doubt their owners would have heard of him though.
 
That was intense.

I cant stop thinking was it Ramsdale who was so good or was it Bamford who was so poor.

We won ugly. Proud of my team.


Oooh to, oooh to be,
Oooh to, oooh to be,
Oooh to, ooh to be,
Oooh to be a Goo-ner.
 
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Sal09 said:
That was intense.

I cant stop thinking was it Ramsdale who was so good or was it Bamford who was so poor.

We won ugly. Proud of my team.


Oooh to, oooh to be,
Oooh to, oooh to be,
Oooh to, ooh to be,
Oooh to be a Goo-ner.
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Teams that do well over the course of a season rarely win all of their fixtures in a manner that can be considered beautiful, or elegant, though it is very nice when they do pull off an elegant victory.

Being able to grind out an ugly win, and cling, limpet like, tenaciously, to a narrow lead while securing the three points, is an equally valuable ability.

Anyway, a solid enough Arsenal victory; I must say that I like the resilience and tenacity of this team.
 
Liverpool looking like their old self. Brilliant goal by Salah (class is permanent). VVD/Gomez switched on today. Alisson up for it.

Wth was Darwin doing? should've passed to Salah who was free on goal. Ego before team.

Not a fan of Klopp's petulance at times. Needs to chill out

Good game by Arsenal but boy did they ride their luck. And their invincible's record remains intact.
 
daneoni said:
Liverpool looking like their old self. Brilliant goal by Salah (class is permanent). VVD/Gomez switched on today. Alisson up for it.

Wth was Darwin doing? should've passed to Salah who was free on goal. Ego before team.

Not a fan of Klopp's petulance at times. Needs to chill out

Good game by Arsenal but boy did they ride their luck. And their invincible's record remains intact.
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Unfortunately, Darwin missed two pretty good chances, and poor judgment (influenced by ego) certainly counted in one of those chances; at this level, such chances don't come too often - some of these players need to learn how to make the right choice almost by instinct.

Salah was back to some semblance of his excellent self, and Virgil van Dijk also had a very good game; Alisson excellent, as well.
 
I expected Liverpool to up their game for this match - much as Man Utd did when they beat us - but I did not expect it to be enough to win. I was thinking a 3-1 loss after a hard-fought performance. But Virgil did find an extra gear today, more like his past dominant self indeed. I need to re-watch when I cool down and try to understand how they pulled it off.

It makes no difference to the league campaign. But it could be a platform for turning things around in Liverpool’s remaining competitions, and at least easing the challenge of a top four finish.

The clean sheet feels more impressive than the win, really. It’s damned hard to blank Man City.

Arsenal find themselves in a very interesting position…ahead of Man City and with the pressure on to maintain their hot form. I’d bet the farm against them, but I would sure love to be proved wrong.
 
I'd predicted a hard-fought but ultimately very predictable 3-1 loss to Liverpool as well.
Haaland kept relatively quiet and not scoring this week is some what of a feat in and of itself.

Saints & Hammers drew, which may have given Mr Hassentuttl a stay of execution.
But as usual, it was not our strikers scoring.

On a different note, I read over the weekend that ultimately, the cost of signing Haaland for ~$50k GBP will be more like $235m once all the other factors are drawn into the equation:
  • Wages - $24m per year (5 year deal = $120m)
  • Sign-on Bonus - $30M
  • Transfer fee - $51m (possibly rising to $85m with "performance based addons"
  • Agent fee - $35m
  • Total (assumed) = $236m GBP (or $265, with "addons")
Fair Play indeed.
 
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Goal scorers/creators and a shot stopper.

Interesting. Not a single defensive player in the top 10, other than the said goalkeeper.

Final
Rank		NamePositionClubNational Team
1.Karim BenzemaFWReal MadridFrance
2.Sadio ManeFWLiverpool /
Bayern Munich		Senegal
3.Kevin De BruyneMFMan CityBelgium
4.Robert LewandowskiFWBayern Munich /
Barcelona		Poland
5.Mohamed SalahFWLiverpoolEgypt
6.Kylian MbappeFWPSGFrance
7.Thibaut CourtoisGKReal MadridBelgium
8.Vinicius Jr.FWReal MadridBrazil
9.Luka ModricMFReal MadridCroatia
10.Erling HaalandFWMan CityNorway
 
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