The BS about "smartphones requires a data plan"

[BeyondtheTech]

I hate to bring up the words "class action," but there really should be something about this "smartphone requires a data plan" thing.

1. A smartphone should not require a data plan, especially if it has Wi-Fi.

2. Wireless data can simply be turned off by the carrier, but even so, the APN can be configured so as to never touch the access point and thereby never using cellular data inadvertently.

3. To counterpoint their defense about disputed shock charges: to avoid them, any accumulation of data past a certain amount should automatically trigger and activate a data plan on that number for that month.

4. If AT&T is bitching so much about how we're using up 80% of their bandwidth that it's choking the network, not to mention the fact that us as customers get poor performance or unsatisfactory usage of wireless data, we should then have the ability to opt out of the plan.

5. If more cities and locations roll out and blanket the area with Wi-Fi, or if you're mostly in a locale that has Wi-Fi, you shouldn't need to pay for a data plan you'll hardly use.

6. The current tiered data plans are not proportionate. If you are on the $15 and go over the $200 mark, the additional $10 should get you a larger allotment. 600MB on the $15 plan is going to cost more than the 2000MB base of the $25 plan.

The iPhone has proven itself to be one of the easiest phones to work with - my then-2-year-old child could unlock, launch a game, play a movie, and answer a call. Why should kids, stay-at-home moms, and the elderly alike be forced into unnecessary $15 and $25 plans? Apple should realize that iPhone sales could climb so much more if it weren't for the imposed data plans.

At this time, FaceTime uses only Wi-Fi and cellular voice. One of the most highlighted features of the iPhone 4 won't work over cellular data. Is that worth a $15-25 "tax" to own an iPhone?

And, don't make the argument about "if you can afford an iPhone, you can afford a data plan." The iPhone is a one-time purchase as low as $99, and the data plan, especially if it's not wanted and/or isn't going to be used and/or isn't worth its price due to AT&T issues, is simply a waste of $15-25 every month for two years for people who don't want it.


What's your take on this issue?

 

[marksman]

So you are saying they should not charge a data plan, but charge you one if you use any data.

 

[Crotalus_Joe]

The required data plan is what allows for the $99 price.

Don't want the data plan? just pay full price for the phone.

 

[phobic99]

The way cell phone providers are allowed to operate in the US needs a total overhaul as far as I'm concerned.

 

[BeyondtheTech]

So you are saying they should not charge a data plan, but charge you one if you use any data.

That's fair, right? I'm not asking for free data, but you should have the option to opt out of any data plan. But, if your smartphone uses any data that month, you can get charged up to $30 (maybe $40) for that month by not having a standard plan on the line, but no shocker value like $15,000 that guy did when watching a Disney movie from Mexico.

Of course, if you opt out, they should be able to simply shut it down on their end, or they can send you a configuration file that will change the APN to something other than WAP.CINGULAR or ISP.CINGULAR. After all, they'll send something down when you enable tethering, right? Then, they should be able to send you down something to toggle the data.

 

[BeyondtheTech]

The required data plan is what allows for the $99 price.

Don't want the data plan? just pay full price for the phone.

Incorrect.

If you acquire an iPhone 3G, 3GS or 4 from AT&T or anyone, you will be imposed with a data plan. They check the IMEI of the device that the SIM card is logged into, and if they determine it's a smartphone, they currently have the right to instantly add a data plan onto the line.

 

[Bodhi395]

Incorrect.

If you acquire an iPhone 3G, 3GS or 4 from AT&T or anyone, you will be imposed with a data plan. They check the IMEI of the device that the SIM card is logged into, and if they determine it's a smartphone, they currently have the right to instantly add a data plan onto the line.

Is this true? Because if it is, its a crazy policy. If you pay full price for an unsubsidized iPhone, you should have the option of just getting a voice plan for it if you want.

 

[SAD*FACED*CLOWN]

The required data plan is what allows for the $99 price.

Don't want the data plan? just pay full price for the phone.

this about sums it up....the thread starter should re read this until it is fully comprehended

 

[BeyondtheTech]

Is this true? Because if it is, its a crazy policy. If you pay full price for an unsubsidized iPhone, you should have the option of just getting a voice plan for it if you want.

Yes, it's a crazy policy.

http://www.boygeniusreport.com/2009...smartphone-data-plans-starting-september-6th/

Comments from that post:

Went to get a sim card for an iPhone I was given and was told data would be added to my plan as soon as the system noticed the iPhone.

I had an AT&T tilt for years, but didn’t have a data plan because I didn’t need it. I recently purchased my wife an iPhone, with a data plan (all good so far) and gave her my number and changed the number on the Tilt, keeping just the bear minimum phone service since only my kids use the phone now. The AT&T store never told me this would be the case and a rude operator at AT&T told me that there is nothing they can do.

Yes, even if you have an unlocked phone, you will be required to purchase a data plan. I have a Palm Centro that I have been using for about a year on AT&T. Apparently, I was “grandfathered” in, because I wasn’t required to get a data plan. That is, until I tried switching phones. I got a BB from AT&T, knowing that it would require a data plan, used it for a couple of weeks, then returned it and cancelled the data plan. But then, when I put my SIM card back in my Centro, I got a text message saying that I would automatically be charged for a data plan because I was using a “smart phone.” I called “customer service” (yeah, right), and they said that it didn’t matter that it was my phone and that I had been using it for months without a data plan. Because I had “activated” it, the network detected it as a smart phone and I would be charged for a data plan–nothing they could do about it.

 

[BeyondtheTech]

this about sums it up....the thread starter should re read this until it is fully comprehended

Again, this is incorrect, as it's based on many users' experiences, so I need no further re-reading.

Another quote from that BGR post:

Your phone has a serial number of sorts called an IMEI (it’s the long number usually under the battery) this is sent out with any and every communication from your phone (txts, calls, whatever) ATT has a database of phones that are badged for them (ie. says ATT on the face of the phone) so when you put your SIM card into any ATT badged phone, locked or unlocked, ATT KNOWS it’s one of theirs cuz the IMEI will show up in a their database. If you get an unlocked GSM phone from another carrier (ie. T-Mobile) the IMEI is not in their database, therefore they can’t know the model.

...which means that one would have to purchase an iPhone 3G, 3GS, or 4 from another country in order for it to theoretically work without getting hit with an imposed data plan.

 

[nosser]

Incorrect.

If you acquire an iPhone 3G, 3GS or 4 from AT&T or anyone, you will be imposed with a data plan. They check the IMEI of the device that the SIM card is logged into, and if they determine it's a smartphone, they currently have the right to instantly add a data plan onto the line.

^This is true.
And every other US carrier requires a data plan of at least $30 and Att is the only carrier right now that lets you choose a $15 data plan for a smartphone. If you want to use a smartphone and only use wifi why not just get an iPod Touch or an iPad. I like having access to data when I'm not near a wifi hot spot. When and if more cities and locations roll out and blanket the area with Wi-Fi that would be a different story but it's not like that now.

 

[thelatinist]

Incorrect.

If you acquire an iPhone 3G, 3GS or 4 from AT&T or anyone, you will be imposed with a data plan. They check the IMEI of the device that the SIM card is logged into, and if they determine it's a smartphone, they currently have the right to instantly add a data plan onto the line.

While what you say is true, that does not change the fact that the data plan subsidizes the extra cost to AT&T of selling you an iPhone at a $350 loss. If AT&T allowed people who purchased subsidized iPhones to go data-free, they would lose money on every customer. Because smartphones cost AT&T more than so-called "feature" phones, AT&T chooses to build that extra cost into the required data plan so that they can continue to offer lower phone plans to non-smartphone users.

If you want to argue that AT&T should break out the cost of their subsidy and charge it as an amortized equipment fee (with interest) only until you have paid off your phone, I would agree with you. With 20% interest over 24 months, that would come to about $17.81/mo.

 

[SAD*FACED*CLOWN]

Incorrect.

If you acquire an iPhone 3G, 3GS or 4 from AT&T or anyone, you will be imposed with a data plan. They check the IMEI of the device that the SIM card is logged into, and if they determine it's a smartphone, they currently have the right to instantly add a data plan onto the line.

if you sign a contract you have to have data for two years, if you are out of a contract you can have AT&T turn data OFF

 

[coasterswim]

6. The current tiered data plans are not proportionate. If you are on the $15 and go over the $200 mark, the additional $10 should get you a larger allotment. 600MB on the $15 plan is going to cost more than the 2000MB base of the $25 plan.

Remember, AT&T is in this business to make money. They want to charge you more than what you use. If they allowed all $15-plan customers to roll up to the $25 plan only when they needed it, who would voluntarily pay for the $25 every month? AT&T is counting on people out there paying for 2GB of data but using under 200MB.

 

[SAD*FACED*CLOWN]

Again, this is incorrect, as it's based on many users' experiences, so I need no further re-reading.

Another quote from that BGR post:


...which means that one would have to purchase an iPhone 3G, 3GS, or 4 from another country in order for it to theoretically work without getting hit with an imposed data plan.

it is correct call AT&T and confirm this...if you have a smartphone CONTRACT you have to have a data plan...if you buy a iPhone from your buddy and are already an AT&T customer you can have AT&T TURN YOUR DATA OFF

 

[hcho3]

Without a data, iphone would be very useless as a phone. Considering the fact that you will be using an iphone on the go, you won't be able to use any apps that requires network. (google map, youtube and etc)

Also, I think you are being little bit harsh on AT&T. AT&T did not used to make the data plan as requirements on smart phones. (iphone it did, but not other smart phones)
Verizon was the one and AT&T followed the suit last year.

If you wish not to pay for data package, then why not just get ipod touch?
Unfortunately, I believe AT&T pays hefty prices on iphones to Apple, so they need to find a way to make up the cost. People will most likely spend more money on smart phones than a flip phones.

Now, that AT&T is offering limited data plan, I think this will benefit users who wish they never had a data plan in the first place.

 

[kdarling]

Data plans weren't required until after the carriers saw how willingly most people lined up for the iPhone's required one.

It's just another way that Apple changed the smartphone world.

 

[BeyondtheTech]

if you sign a contract you have to have data for two years, if you are out of a contract you can have AT&T turn data OFF

You try doing that with any smartphone other than the iPhone 2G, and tell me if they'll budge. They won't. It's policy and it needs to change. Do you not see the above comments from users with really old smartphones getting slapped with a data plan?

 

[slippery-pete]

^This is true.
And every other US carrier requires a data plan of at least $30 and Att is the only carrier right now that lets you choose a $15 data plan for a smartphone. If you want to use a smartphone and only use wifi why not just get an iPod Touch or an iPad. I like having access to data when I'm not near a wifi hot spot. When and if more cities and locations roll out and blanket the area with Wi-Fi that would be a different story but it's not like that now.

Well said, it is the NORM with all cell phone providers

 

[Givmeabrek]

If you use an iPhone on the AT&T network you have to have a data plan. Even if you buy the phone outright.

 

[SAD*FACED*CLOWN]

You try doing that with any smartphone other than the iPhone 2G, and tell me if they'll budge. They won't. It's policy and it needs to change. Do you not see the above comments from users with really old smartphones getting slapped with a data plan?

my friend...my son has my old 3G iPhone activated on AT&T's network with NO DATA for the last year and a half...and the data was turned off at my request and my mom uses a Sony Ericson smartphone on AT&T with NO DATA at her request....

 

[BeyondtheTech]

Without a data, iphone would be very useless as a phone. Considering the fact that you will be using an iphone on the go, you won't be able to use any apps that requires network. (google map, youtube and etc)

Also, I think you are being little bit harsh on AT&T. AT&T did not used to make the data plan as requirements on smart phones. (iphone it did, but not other smart phones)
Verizon was the one and AT&T followed the suit last year.

If you wish not to pay for data package, then why not just get ipod touch?
Unfortunately, I believe AT&T pays hefty prices on iphones to Apple, so they need to find a way to make up the cost. People will most likely spend more money on smart phones than a flip phones.

Now, that AT&T is offering limited data plan, I think this will benefit users who wish they never had a data plan in the first place.

On the contrary, the iPhone is excellent as just a phone. But, it's also a phone that can play games and movies and music. I just don't think it's right to have a "surtax" if you live in an area with a Wi-Fi hotspot, or don't need surfing the web or email.

The iPod touch has no phone feature at all.

I know over a dozen people on AT&T and T-Mobile that love their iPhone 2G's but have no data plan nor any need for a data plan whatsoever. They're either home or at work, both places which have enough Wi-Fi for them to do any data needed, if they wanted to. Maybe I'm only speaking for a minority, but while I appreciate AT&T having a low plan for only $15 a month, it just shouldn't be imposed.

 

[SAD*FACED*CLOWN]

it's real simple...if AT&T is providing a subsidy on the price of your device you have a two year data plan...if not you can have them TURN OFF DATA

 

[njpodder]

If I don't want a data plan, then instead of buying a $699 unsubsidized smartphone with no intention of using data unless on Wi-Fi, I will just buy a $499 Wi-Fi iPad and get a free flip phone with a $39.99 / month calling plan from the wireless carrier of my choice.

I really don't see the point of having a smartphone without a data plan, when so many Wi-Fi devices are cheaper and more capable alternatives to smartphones when connected to a hotspot. The reason we do both on one device is the convenience factor. Without the convenience factor, sounds like you just want a new and shiny without paying what it costs to operate said new and shiny to its fullest potential.

 

[kas23]

if you sign a contract you have to have data for two years, if you are out of a contract you can have AT&T turn data OFF

Hmmm. There is absolutely nothing in their TOS that states this. However, I did find this (which is repeated over and over):

"Data Plans: An eligible data plan is required for certain devices, including iPhones and other designated smartphones. Eligible data plans cover data usage in the U.S. and do not cover international data usage and charges. If it is determined that you are using an iPhone or other designated smartphone without an eligible data plan, AT&T reserves the right to add an eligible data plan to your account and bill you the appropriate monthly fee."

http://www.wireless.att.com/cell-phone-service/legal/plan-terms.jsp#data

So, they say if they find you using an iPhone without a data plan, they have every right to add one automatically and start charging you for it.