The Home Depot and H-E-B Finally Rolling Out Apple Pay in Stores

[BuffaloTF]

I don't know about this. The Home Depots near me have the exact same hardware everyone else does. It even has the little wireless logo on it. They just don't enable it.

Home Depot wants to track its customers by credit card number, phone number, phone MAC address, facial recognition, etc etc.

That's why every single time after I stick my credit card in like a savage, it loudly yells at me "WOULD YOU LIKE AN E-RECEIPT?!" prompting me to enter my phone number. Every. Single. Time.

As much as that’s a slam on their e-receipt shenanigans… it’s still too kind. The options are:

-Printed Receipt
-Printed Receipt & e-Receipt

They’re just screaming they want your phone number here, they don’t have any interest in saving some costs. Can’t escape the paper, the usual trade that’s offered. Why would I want this Sugar Honey Iced Tea if I’m still saddled with the paper?

 

[BigBlur]

So the story is actually just about contactless payment generally and not actually about Apple Pay?

Yes, exactly. A more fitting title for this article would be "The Home Depot and H-E-B Finally Rolling Out NFC Contactless Payments in Stores"

I still think Walmart will eventually allow tap to pay credit/debit cards, but will set it up so you cannot use Apple Pay/Google Wallet.

That would be impossible. They can either accept contactless payments or they don't. Apple Pay, Google Pay, Samsung Pay, etc. are just brand names for NFC. There's nothing special about them per se. The POS terminal cannot tell whether you tapped a credit card or a phone. They only just receive your banking info.

When we see stories about someone blocking or not accepting Apple Pay...they actually just didn't accept NFC/contactless payments at all. One could not tap their debit/credit card either.

 

[deeddawg]

I don’t understand how this works in America

In Canada if you can tap to pay then you can use Apple Pay, it doesn’t matter what you are tapping

Do retailers in America block specific payment methods on the debit machine itself?

Or do they not accept contactless payment at all?

Certain retailers such a Home Depot simply don't accept NFC / tap-to-pay. HEB grocery stores aren't in my region, but Kroger is and had similarly refused to allow NFC payments for a long time. I don't remember just when that changed since I usually don't shop there.

 

[nathansz]

Yes, exactly. A more fitting title for this article would be "The Home Depot and H-E-B Finally Rolling Out NFC Contactless Payments in Stores"

Thanks

Every time I see these headlines I get confused about why or how they would specifically not allow paying with an iPhone

Now i understand the headlines are just misleading

Now I’m just surprised that there are big (or any) retailers in the US that you can’t pay by tap

It’s been the standard here for many many years

 

[tmiw]

Merchant fees didn’t really change. Though both master card and visa generally now only take 2% vs 3% when you use Apple Wallet or another biometric locked wallet as it tends to be less fraud.

If a store wants to give users the same experience for tapping both debit cards and credit cards, it can very well cost them more than simply not supporting tap at all (i.e. due to just running everything "as credit"). That's not really an Apple Pay specific thing, though.

 

[nathansz]

Merchant fees from banks.

In can only speak to Canada

But here the fees don’t change regardless of whether you insert a card or tap a card or phone

The categories aren’t even broken down. It’s just debit, visa or Mastercard. The physical method doesn’t matter

 

[nathansz]

Some places still have you sign a piece of paper for credit card transactions. Most restaurants I’ve been to still take your card and walk away from the table for payment instead of just bringing you a credit/debit machine.

You’ve got to be kidding!!

 

[nathansz]

If a store wants to give users the same experience for tapping both debit cards and credit cards, it can very well cost them more than simply not supporting tap at all (i.e. due to just running everything "as credit"). That's not really an Apple Pay specific thing, though.

No that’s not how it works

Debit is still debit and credit is still credit

 

[tmiw]

No that’s not how it works

Debit is still debit and credit is still credit

If you're running a card from a bank or credit union that isn't big enough, it does in fact cost more running it as a Visa or MC (typically not needing PIN) than running over the separate "debit" network (which typically requires entering PIN). Making people enter a PIN after tapping is a way around that but people rightfully complain that they still need to enter one when they already used Touch or Face ID, making for a bad user experience.

 

[nathansz]

If you're running a card from a bank or credit union that isn't big enough, it does in fact cost more running it as a Visa or MC (typically not needing PIN) than running over the separate "debit" network (which typically requires entering PIN). Making people enter a PIN after tapping is a way around that but people rightfully complain that they still need to enter one when they already used Touch or Face ID, making for a bad user experience.

That’s simply not how it works

At least not in Canada

the fees are broken down between debit, visa and Mastercard

It absolutely does not matter whether you tap, insert a card or swipe

And it makes absolutely no difference whether you type in a pin or not

 

[SactoGuy18]

Yes, exactly. A more fitting title for this article would be "The Home Depot and H-E-B Finally Rolling Out NFC Contactless Payments in Stores"


That would be impossible. They can either accept contactless payments or they don't. Apple Pay, Google Pay, Samsung Pay, etc. are just brand names for NFC. There's nothing special about them per se. The POS terminal cannot tell whether you tapped a credit card or a phone. They only just receive your banking info.

That's probably the reason why Walmart won't accept Apple Pay/Google Wallet--you either support Apple Pay/Google Wallet and tap-to-pay cards together, or not at all. Hence the reason why they don't support NFC payments and forces you to do mobile payments using Walmart's own app.

In short, Walmart craves the sales information gleaned from more conventional payments and the Walmart app. That gives them much more control over advertising and inventory control.

 

[tmiw]

That’s simply not how it works

At least not in Canada

the fees are broken down between debit, visa and Mastercard

It absolutely does not matter whether you tap, insert a card or swipe

And it makes absolutely no difference whether you type in a pin or not

I was talking about the US. For instance, the Federal Reserve keeps track of debit interchange fees and there is definitely a significant cost difference between running debit cards as "credit" (i.e. Visa and MC) versus as debit. In fact, based on their most recent data, it costs merchants about 40% more on average to run debit cards as credit. It's no surprise that there was a bunch of resistance to supporting contactless for a long time when stores have long been unhappy about interchange fees in the first place.

Again, this isn't an Apple Pay specific thing, just an unfortunate downside of the US market.

 

[nathansz]

I was talking about the US. For instance, the Federal Reserve keeps track of debit interchange fees and there is definitely a significant cost difference between running debit cards as "credit" (i.e. Visa and MC) versus as debit. In fact, based on their most recent data, it costs merchants about 40% more on average to run debit cards as credit. It's no surprise that there was a bunch of resistance to supporting contactless for a long time when stores have long been unhappy about interchange fees in the first place.

Again, this isn't an Apple Pay specific thing, just an unfortunate downside of the US market.

So in Canada fees are higher for credit cards then debit

The difference here seems to be that you are saying that in order to not use a pin in the US that the debit card needs to be run as if it were a credit card?

 

[tmiw]

So in Canada fees are higher for credit cards then debit

The difference here seems to be that you are saying that in order to not use a pin in the US that the debit card needs to be run as if it were a credit card?

With a few exceptions, yes.

 

[mk313]

What's the reluctance here for this? Generally the fees are the same whether its tap or pin payments. At least here in Canada it is.

I didn't read through all of the comments so maybe this was already addressed, but I'd guess the reluctance is based on tracking. Since (as I understand it) you get a fake credit card number that changes with every transaction using Apple Pay, it's likely much harder for retailers to track your purchases over time. If you log into your Home Depot (or whatever) rewards program they still can, but if you just pay without connecting to an account, then there is no easy way to build a purchase history for shoppers.

 

[zarmanto]

So the story is actually just about contactless payment generally and not actually about Apple Pay?

I would suggest that maybe that's a matter of perspective. Take another look at the article I linked previously, and if you have time, go down the rabbit hole for a bit: what you will find is something along the lines of 1) Android's had contactless payments first, 2) contactless payment terminals -- where they existed -- reportedly worked just fine by-and-large both before and after Apple jumped into the game, and 3) selected retailers abruptly decided to disable contactless payments across the board shortly after Apple released Apple Pay.

I even have personal experience with pulling out my iPhone when I found that lovely icon on the terminal, preparing to use it to pay... and being told by the cashier that it wasn't supported, just about at the same time that I successfully paid. I and the cashier both watched the receipt scroll out of his register, much to the surprise of the cashier. And I am by no means the only person who can relay such a tale from that time period; others have also written about their experiences of going back later and discovering that some stores had disabled it. It seems like maybe retailers weren't expecting this kind of a shift to take place quite so soon, and somehow they had no idea that they'd already installed hardware which supported it... until some geek like me walked up with their phone in hand. It just happens that these stories became quite a bit more common almost overnight, when Apple introduced Apple Pay -- thus, the response.

So, is this story just about contactless payments in general, and not about Apple Pay? In light of the history behind it all, I'm not so sure that an answer is necessarily clear cut.

 

[nathansz]

I would suggest that maybe that's a matter of perspective. Take another look at the article I linked previously, and if you have time, go down the rabbit hole for a bit: what you will find is something along the lines of 1) Android's had contactless payments first, 2) contactless payment terminals -- where they existed -- reportedly worked just fine by-and-large both before and after Apple jumped into the game, and 3) selected retailers abruptly decided to disable contactless payments across the board shortly after Apple released Apple Pay.

I even have personal experience with pulling out my iPhone when I found that lovely icon on the terminal, preparing to use it to pay... and being told by the cashier that it wasn't supported, just about at the same time that I successfully paid. I and the cashier both watched the receipt scroll out of his register, much to the surprise of the cashier. And I am by no means the only person who can relay such a tale from that time period; others have also written about their experiences of going back later and discovering that some stores had disabled it. It seems like maybe retailers weren't expecting this kind of a shift to take place quite so soon, and somehow they had no idea that they'd already installed hardware which supported it... until some geek like me walked up with their phone in hand. It just happens that these stories became quite a bit more common almost overnight, when Apple introduced Apple Pay -- thus, the response.

So, is this story just about contactless payments in general, and not about Apple Pay? In light of the history behind it all, I'm not so sure that an answer is necessarily clear cut.

as interesting as your story is, that doesn't change that what is happening is that these stores are enabling contactless payment (I'm still stunned the US is so far behind on this)

they are not, as the title implies, enabling apple pay

 

[zarmanto]

they are not, as the title implies, enabling apple pay

I'm sorry, but if you're trying to be pedantic, it seems to me you've misstepped. In fact, they are enabling Apple Pay... as well as enabling other contactless payment providers. As the author himself pointed out on page 4 of the thread, the clarification of this fact is specifically provided in the very first sentence of the article. The "half-truth" of the title that you and a couple of others have criticized is simply a matter of catering to an audience of mostly Apple focused readers... because this is an Apple focused website. Further, many of the readers here are likely to remember the history behind it all, just as I did, and therefore understand exactly where he's coming from. And beyond that: if customers walk into any of these stores in a day or a week or whatever and happen to see an Apple logo on the register or in the store window... that is a very definitive rolling out of Apple Pay, precisely as stated in the title -- regardless of whether there are other logos alongside that Apple. And I would suggest that US customers are extremely likely to encounter exactly this.

You will of course not be even remotely swayed from your opinion by my statement, any more than you were by the author's... and that's perfectly okay. I just thought that your critique should take into account the details a bit more accurately.

 

[lightrack]

Home Depot, Walmart and many others in Ontario, Canada accept Apple Pay. I use it every time as it is very convenient

 

[Michael Scrip]

On an Apple website the article says "Apple Pay" in the headline.

I'm guessing on Android sites they say "Google Pay" or "Samsung Pay" in the headline.

Yes... the correct term is "Contactless Pay" but in the grand scheme of things I don't think it really matters.

I'm just glad to have it! Finally!

 

[eoblaed]

Home Depot's delay of NFC feels more about having a contract with a hardware and/or software suppliers that don't support tap-to-pay. Not concisely forbidding the method, but picked a vendor that wasn't supporting it.

When Apple Pay first came out, Home Depot's readers supported it. I used it several times there the first few months Apple Pay was available. Shortly after, Home Depot actively disabled it. This was a deliberate action on their part and not due to having readers that didn't support it; demonstrably, the readers were capable. When they came out with their new fancy terminals/readers a couple of years ago I was hopeful but, nope, still no Apple Pay.

I'll be down there again this weekend. Will give it a try and see if my local Home Depot has activated it yet.

 

[garyjones027]

I wouldn’t bother dealing business with them, if they can’t accommodate the future of paying then they deserve to fail

It looks that pizza restaurant that does not have a card chip reader will be doing manual entry of cards from Mastercard when the magstripe is removed by 2030.

 

[garyjones027]

Do some USA businesses still use payment card imprinters?

 

[fromgophonetoiphone]

Lowes started accepting Apple Pay late 2023.

Really? Wow. Finally. One day I decided to run errands and forgot my wallet. I hit up HD, Lowes, and then finally Harbor Freight. The first 2 couldnt' do Apple Pay, but thank goodness Harbor Freight could.

 

[gsmornot]

Essentially, it comes down to one thing: Walmart and Home Depot wanted the ability to track user purchases for various reasons, something that cannot be done with Apple Pay/Google Wallet and much harder to do with tap to pay.

I still think Walmart will eventually allow tap to pay credit/debit cards, but will set it up so you cannot use Apple Pay/Google Wallet.

Kroger wont apply card member discounts until you scan a Kroger card. If War-Mart or Home Depot priced based on card holder discounts, people would scan for the order providing the information. As it is today, there is no incentive to use a store card at either location. Not that I can think of.