iPad The iPad is not for traditional Mac users

[Retskrad]

There has recently been a lot of conversation among tech circles, here and on social media, about the iPad in and it's current state. Apple has practiced restraint and kept the iPad as simple to use as long as possible and tried to keep it a a separate product from the Mac.

Out of curiosity, I checked iPad commercials on YouTube and Apple's website to see how Apple themselves see the iPad and how they envision people using them. They have honed in and focused on note taking and drawing with the Apple Pencil as the core features and they're are all over the marketing material. It's the same situation with the Apple Watch: fitness and notifications.

Every year people are exited and hopeful that the next iPadOS version will make the iPad more Mac-like but aren't they setting themselves up for disappointment? The iPad and Mac bring in around the same revenue for Apple so their current strategy with the iPad is working. Anecdotally I have seen a ton of iPads all over high schools and colleges. There are a lot of happy iPad users.

 

[Digitalguy]

After Apple gave the M1 and 16GB RAM to the pro, it was more than fair to expect some big productivity improvement at least for the iPad pro last year. However after last year's disappointement, which followed the previous year one, most people no longer have such high expectations for iPadOS, so the disappointement will not be as big... There will always be happy iPad users, but as a university teacher I can tell you that iPad is way less common than Macs and PCs among students.

 

[XIO[-]OIX]

Every year people are exited and hopeful that the next iPadOS version will make the iPad more Mac-like

so, lets make something quite clear - I dont want iPad to be more Mac like.

I would HATE IT if iPad became more Mac Like. I would hate it so much I would probably stop using the ipad and go back to the Mac / Windows. And there are lots of people like me. That is not to say iPadOS doesn’t have a lot to improve - it does - it has wayyy much to improve still. There are plenty of things that could be better - and especially when it comes to third-party software - we need more Pro apps, and full featured powerful apps. Some are already here, but others need to follow suit.

As for the iPadOS - I firmly believe its superior to MacOS not inferior. Its still not as feature packed or mature as MacOS is, but that is to be expected. What it lacks in maturity it provides with sophistication. iPadOS is by far the most sophisticated personal computing OS in existence today, in my humble opinion. What do I mean by this? How can it be ‘most sophisticated’ when it doesn’t have even basic features like - looking at folder size in Files App or formatting a usb drive (was this added?). Well, iPadOS may lack some tools like these, but it has incredible integration across the OS (so many ways for apps to talk to eachother), it has incredible security *(each app is sandboxed basically), it has really smart system wide features like ‘Shortcuts’ App, Share sheet, urls and app Apis (this is almost linux from 80s like), it has incredible app catalogue - and amazing Installing / Uninstalling / even offloading features, it has a wast variety of widgets, and it has completely new and unique memory management - where apps have ‘states‘ and can - depending on the state be chosen to be pre-warmed by the system / refreshed in background / active / not active but in memory / unloaded - and so on. Apps get apis to say what and how to transition these states so could save data and so on. Think about how great it is that iPad can hold literally infinite programs ‘open’ whilst the system itself decides if an app should be given more memory should have memory taken or closed and so on. think about ‘pre warming’ of apps! What an incredible concept! Or think about background running time , where app is given an opportunity to do some background housekeeping - but only when the OS decides its time to do so. And all this is there to make your device work snappier / quicker / use less battery and do more with its cpu. Think about this too - you never need to quit apps, yet the app in the foreground gets 100, or close to 100% CPU power! This is unheard of in the PC world, but in fact makes more sense than the PC way - since - in most cases - you want your app in the foreground to have all the resources for yourself - since you are working in it now.

And I could go on and on. iPadOS - in my mind - and by these examples - is way more sophisticated than MacOS, and iPads time is only yet to come.


/// We do need more people to realize this - and by more people mostly I mean more Pro tool developers - so more pro tools would come to iPad too.

 

[turbineseaplane]

As for the iPadOS - I firmly believe its superior to MacOS not inferior.

No, it's just all locked down and gimped.
It's not superior and it's not "more sophisticated"

That's what we need "more people to realize"

 

[XIO[-]OIX]

No, it's just all locked down and gimped.
It's not superior and it's not "more sophisticated"

That's what we need "more people to realize"

You seem quite angry that I like iPadOS,
better than MacOS

Why does this make you mad?

 

[Retskrad]

Apple and Google spend billions each year to make iOS and Android extremely efficient and as robust as possible. iPadOS is not as capable as MacOS but iPadOS has more refined animations, gestures, UI, etc. I need my Mac for work but I always miss my iPad when I use a Mac. I always get a dopamine rush when using and interacting with iPadOS. MacOS is much more stale and "stiff".

 

[yitwail]

Think about this too - you never need to quit apps, yet the app in the foreground gets 100, or close to 100% CPU power! This is unheard of in the PC world, but in fact makes more sense than the PC way - since - in most cases - you want your app in the foreground to have all the resources for yourself - since you are working in it now.

Just looking at my MacBook Air dock, I have 16 apps open currently, and CPU is 95% idle according to iStat Menus. Now, I do occasionally close apps when there's memory pressure, which is currently 55%, but that's mainly due to having 4 Chrome Windows, 9 Safari Windows, and 17 Edge Windows, mostly minimized, with lots of tabs. In part that's because I'm a web developer and actually need multiple windows. But anyway, on my MacBook Air at least, leaving apps open is NOT unheard of. I'll also tell you that regardless of the sophistication you spoke of, my workflow absolutely requires more than 2 windows open to be efficient. For instance, a window for a text editor to modify code, another for emails or slack for client communication, a browser tab for the website I'm working on, an FTP client for uploading modified code, Preview, Pages, or OpenOffice for viewing specifications, and so forth. I don't doubt you can be adept at app switching in iPadOS but I'd rather have windows positioned in various places on the screen and switch between them by simply clicking the title bar.

 

[Digitalguy]

so, lets make something quite clear - I dont want iPad to be more Mac like.

I would HATE IT if iPad became more Mac Like. I would hate it so much I would probably stop using the ipad and go back to the Mac / Windows. And there are lots of people like me. That is not to say iPadOS doesn’t have a lot to improve - it does - it has wayyy much to improve still. There are plenty of things that could be better - and especially when it comes to third-party software - we need more Pro apps, and full featured powerful apps. Some are already here, but others need to follow suit.

As for the iPadOS - I firmly believe its superior to MacOS not inferior. Its still not as feature packed or mature as MacOS is, but that is to be expected. What it lacks in maturity it provides with sophistication. iPadOS is by far the most sophisticated personal computing OS in existence today, in my humble opinion. What do I mean by this? How can it be ‘most sophisticated’ when it doesn’t have even basic features like - looking at folder size in Files App or formatting a usb drive (was this added?). Well, iPadOS may lack some tools like these, but it has incredible integration across the OS (so many ways for apps to talk to eachother), it has incredible security *(each app is sandboxed basically), it has really smart system wide features like ‘Shortcuts’ App, Share sheet, urls and app Apis (this is almost linux from 80s like), it has incredible app catalogue - and amazing Installing / Uninstalling / even offloading features, it has a wast variety of widgets, and it has completely new and unique memory management - where apps have ‘states‘ and can - depending on the state be chosen to be pre-warmed by the system / refreshed in background / active / not active but in memory / unloaded - and so on. Apps get apis to say what and how to transition these states so could save data and so on. Think about how great it is that iPad can hold literally infinite programs ‘open’ whilst the system itself decides if an app should be given more memory should have memory taken or closed and so on. think about ‘pre warming’ of apps! What an incredible concept! Or think about background running time , where app is given an opportunity to do some background housekeeping - but only when the OS decides its time to do so. And all this is there to make your device work snappier / quicker / use less battery and do more with its cpu. Think about this too - you never need to quit apps, yet the app in the foreground gets 100, or close to 100% CPU power! This is unheard of in the PC world, but in fact makes more sense than the PC way - since - in most cases - you want your app in the foreground to have all the resources for yourself - since you are working in it now.

And I could go on and on. iPadOS - in my mind - and by these examples - is way more sophisticated than MacOS, and iPads time is only yet to come.


/// We do need more people to realize this - and by more people mostly I mean more Pro tool developers - so more pro tools would come to iPad too.

We have very different views, most of the things you mention are things I hate in iPadOS...
It does not mean I hate the OS as a whole, and I love the hardware, but again we have almost opposite views.
To each his own I guess.... ?

 

[XIO[-]OIX]

We have very different views, most of the things you mention are things I hate in iPadOS...
It does not mean I hate the OS as a whole, and I love the hardware, but again we have almost opposite views.
To each his own I guess.... ?

I understand what you would hate about, lets say - memory management. Noone likes reloads. But as iPad is increesingly getting more RAM, those reloads seem to be less often (sometimes very rare).

As for apps being sandboxed - I really really love this. It means no app can mess my whole system up - and maaaan do I appreciate this - as someone who came thru windows hell, than to mac, and has a lot of experience with Linux systems as well.. iPad being managed by Apple, and not being allowed to be messed up with various bad actor apps (Like we had on windows - and still have to a certain extent) - is amazing to me. Apps still colaborate one with another quite easily, just are not allowed to mess the system up.

And the way apple only lets apps comunicate to certain APIs if allowed - to do certain things - means Apple can further optimize things and create a better experience.

As for backgroud apps - its only not good for torrents / IRC / and a coupe other usages. I hope - apple could fix this by creating a new tier api where an app can request to remain open— and make it something I have to approve of - like I do with Notifications. I would only allow my IRC / *(non existent torrent app) to remain open in bcg. I want other apps not waiting my battery cpu when I am not using them - but be snappy when I bring them back.



@yitwail - not claiming its for everyone and every usage. I do thinkk its the most sophisticated ‘personal computer’ os, I think I stated this (or have I?). Its obviously not a good Server OS ? and I don't see iPad becoming a Sudio Music production workstation any time soon.
But - for a personal computng experience - ipad seems to be better than the personal computer… ?‍♂️ I find it so, for sure…

And, again - I do value my system not slowing down when I have 5 open big programmers (like 3d modeling), and another 100 tabs of internet + a couple of ’small’ programs like ms word… I really like iPad managing all this for me.

As for multiple windows - App switching on ipad works quite fine. I have no problems going form app to app, and its kinda like going from window to window. I do use cmd+tab on both devices / or I will use swiping on iPad. It’s a pretty similar experience, iPad being more versatile as you can use swiping gestures in addition to keyboard mouse combo…

Having said all that — one thing is beyond obvious. iPad has a small screen (and external screens don't really make the screen realestate any bigger) - so - any application that would benefit from more screen real estate / or applications where fine direct control of the OS in a hands on fashion definitely are not perfectly suited for the iPad.

I love my device, but for work I use a setup with 3 monitors, and I need all that real estate. But thats not to say iPad is not a good tablet / mini laptop / personal computer.

I still consider it to be the best personal computer one can get.
Its just not the best Workstation POWERHOUSE.

For that, you need a desktop ?

 

[Digitalguy]

I understand what you would hate about, lets say - memory management. Noone likes reloads. But as iPad is increesingly getting more RAM, those reloads seem to be less often (sometimes very rare).

As for apps being sandboxed - I really really love this. It means no app can mess my whole system up - and maaaan do I appreciate this - as someone who came thru windows hell, than to mac, and has a lot of experience with Linux systems as well.. iPad being managed by Apple, and not being allowed to be messed up with various bad actor apps (Like we had on windows - and still have to a certain extent) - is amazing to me. Apps still colaborate one with another quite easily, just are not allowed to mess the system up.

And the way apple only lets apps comunicate to certain APIs if allowed - to do certain things - means Apple can further optimize things and create a better experience.

As for backgroud apps - its only not good for torrents / IRC / and a coupe other usages. I hope - apple could fix this by creating a new tier api where an app can request to remain open— and make it something I have to approve of - like I do with Notifications. I would only allow my IRC / *(non existent torrent app) to remain open in bcg. I want other apps not waiting my battery cpu when I am not using them - but be snappy when I bring them back.



@yitwail - not claiming its for everyone and every usage. I do thinkk its the most sophisticated ‘personal computer’ os, I think I stated this (or have I?). Its obviously not a good Server OS ? and I don't see iPad becoming a Sudio Music production workstation any time soon.
But - for a personal computng experience - ipad seems to be better than the personal computer… ?‍♂️ I find it so, for sure…

And, again - I do value my system not slowing down when I have 5 open big programmers (like 3d modeling), and another 100 tabs of internet + a couple of ’small’ programs like ms word… I really like iPad managing all this for me.

As for multiple windows - App switching on ipad works quite fine. I have no problems going form app to app, and its kinda like going from window to window. I do use cmd+tab on both devices / or I will use swiping on iPad. It’s a pretty similar experience, iPad being more versatile as you can use swiping gestures in addition to keyboard mouse combo…

Having said all that — one thing is beyond obvious. iPad has a small screen (and external screens don't really make the screen realestate any bigger) - so - any application that would benefit from more screen real estate / or applications where fine direct control of the OS in a hands on fashion definitely are not perfectly suited for the iPad.

I love my device, but for work I use a setup with 3 monitors, and I need all that real estate. But thats not to say iPad is not a good tablet / mini laptop / personal computer.

I still consider it to be the best personal computer one can get.
Its just not the best Workstation POWERHOUSE.

For that, you need a desktop ?

The base iPad and iPad mini are still RAM-constrained, let alone older devices. iPads should start at 8GB like Macs. Also I much prefer that, for instance, Samsung allows me to decide which apps should not reload (in my Android devices). So here I clearly prefer the desktop way. Hate the iPadOS way of chosing for me.

I generally don't like the sandboxed apps. I have not have a single issue with any of my Windows devices, in the last 10 years or more. For me Windows is far from hell, it's not perfect, but it's the best OS (I know, saying this here is almost like cursing...). But I am a tech guy, I understand that simpler people are better off with a simpler system.

I prefer centralized systems where the file it at the center, not the app.

I rarely use torrents so I don't care, but I do multitask a lot and background apps are essential for that. Main use for me would be real-time syncing of cloud storage like on a desktop (e.g. Dropbox), even when I am doing something else.

My Windows desktop is my main device and, believe it or not, at home it's now also my main tablet. It would be too long to explain but imagine if sidecar supported touch and sound, had zero latency and could therefore sort of create that iPad running MacOS that many want (but with no impact on battery life and no throttling). I know MacOS does not work well with touch, but Windows works much better, despite what some detractors say. Not like iPadOS, but for me it's the best compromise. And I found an app that can make that work with Android (would love it for iPad too, but the device does not matter much, as you are not using its native OS, as long as it has good speakers, a good screen and it's large enough to make sense with Windows, which anything above 12in is, maybe even 11in).
I still use my iPads but much less at home since I have this set-up.

 

[exoticSpice]

it has really smart system wide features like ‘Shortcuts’ App

The Mac got this in macOS 12 and it's implemented into the OS pretty well. In the menu bar, in the dock and in the share sheet you can access the shortcuts.

 

[XIO[-]OIX]

The Mac got this in macOS 12 and it's implemented into the OS pretty well. In the menu bar, in the dock and in the share sheet you can access the shortcuts.

Are you talking about Automator? I am aware of it - and use it plenty. It is however not the same as shortcuts - since shortcuts can do certain automations depending on System states or outside events. (do certain something - when you open an app / close an app / time of day / sunrize sunset / Battery at certain percentage / conected to power not contected / certain profile is activated / connected to wifi or certain wifi /certain geolocation / depending on callendar events / when you get a certain email or message / or even when ipad hears you say something). Its quite sophisticated and advanced. Way more so than on MacOS, as far as I am aware none of this is available on MacOS

 

[exoticSpice]

Are you talking about Automator? I am aware of it - and use it plenty. It is however not the same as shortcuts - since shortcuts can do certain automations depending on System states or outside events. Its quite sophisticated and advanced. More so than on MacOS as far as I am aware

I am talking about Shortcuts, the same app that is the iPadOS. The Mac version is also a bit more advanced as it also allows for scripts to be run. It was released in macOS 12, last year.

Complete guide to the Shortcuts app on macOS

Building powerful shortcuts can save you time down the road!

www.xda-developers.com

 

[Apple_Robert]

There has recently been a lot of conversation among tech circles, here and on social media, about the iPad in and it's current state. Apple has practiced restraint and kept the iPad as simple to use as long as possible and tried to keep it a a separate product from the Mac.

Out of curiosity, I checked iPad commercials on YouTube and Apple's website to see how Apple themselves see the iPad and how they envision people using them. They have honed in and focused on note taking and drawing with the Apple Pencil as the core features and they're are all over the marketing material. It's the same situation with the Apple Watch: fitness and notifications.

Every year people are exited and hopeful that the next iPadOS version will make the iPad more Mac-like but aren't they setting themselves up for disappointment? The iPad and Mac bring in around the same revenue for Apple so their current strategy with the iPad is working. Anecdotally I have seen a ton of iPads all over high schools and colleges. There are a lot of happy iPad users.

The iPad is for anyone and everyone who can find a purpose in using it. Saying it isn't for the traditional user is wrong and very short-sighted on your part.

 

[Abazigal]

No, it's just all locked down and gimped.
It's not superior and it's not "more sophisticated"

That's what we need "more people to realize"

To me, it’s different. Better than the Mac in some ways, worse in others. And at the end of the day, I like that it’s not just “macOS in tablet mode”.

When using my iPad in the classroom, I find I am glad to not have to deal with the idiosyncrasies of a desktop operating system.

Simplicity is its key selling point here, not complexity. I agree that there are still plenty of updates to be had, but I am wary of cramming it full of “power user” features requested by a small and vocal group of people, at the expense of making the whole iPad experience so much more confusing and overwhelming for everyone else.

 

[XIO[-]OIX]

But I am a tech guy,…

But I am a tech guy as well. I think we all are here. But me being advanced doesnt mean I don’t enjoy not having to be all the time - for all things. I like some stuff being done for me, without me intervening. ?
And I grew up on windows I know its hart and soul. Same for OSX.

*(I do also use a desktop, and don’t think desktops are obsolete or will be. Thats why I called them PowerhouseWorkstations)

 

[exoticSpice]

iPadOS needs good external support thats the major issue for me. Even chromeOS has it until iPadOS has external display support it will never be a deskop/laptop replacement for me.

I am talking about extending the desktop and also it should work with all display ratios.

 

[XIO[-]OIX]

So.. you use Remote Desktop protocol to connect to a windows machine? @Digitalguy

It seems a lot like Remote Desktop Protocol / or VNC. I remember the first time I used it and how blown away I was with the possibility to connect to my main computer from my phone.
I think I first used RDC/VNC in 2006 which is the year it came out - and first connected a portable device to a computer - in 2008 by connecting my iPhone ? to my desktop back at home. Of course at the time internet was way to slow for this to work the way it works today. Man, come to think about it it was around 18 years ago ?

 

[XIO[-]OIX]

iPadOS needs good external support thats the major issue for me. Even chromeOS has it until iPadOS has external display support it will never be a deskop/laptop replacement for me.

I am talking about extending the desktop and also it should work with all display ratios.

I agree.
That being said I am writing this on a external display connected to my iPad. ?

As for desktop/laptop replacement - iPad is a laptop replacement for me
and iPad will never be a desktop replacement for me.

 

[JahBoolean]

This has already been said on the now countless threads reciting the same old line of inquiry.

Given the incentives that Apple has to create a strong demarcation between their two product lineups, iPadOS will always have to operate within a slightly different Logic than macOS. If you can fit your workflow on one of these devices, great for you. If a combination of both devices compliment your workflow, Apple's all the better.

But, if you try to shoehorn tasks better accomplished on the other device and work proactively to try and emancipate yourself from limitations put forth and enforced by Apple, you're doing yourself this disservice out of your own fondness for the device and should seek accountability only within yourself.

But I start to feel like don Quixote at this point.

 

[Digitalguy]

(Its kinda stupid to assume I am a ‘simpler person’)

But I am a tech guy as well. I think we all are here. I would say I am in the top 1% or 0,1% of computer users.. Maybe thats not even correct probably in 0,001%. But me being advanced doesnt mean I don’t enjoy not having to be all the time - for all things. I like some stuff being done for me, without me intervening. ?
And I grew up on windows I know its hart and soul. Same for OSX.

iPad manages cloud storadge as well as a couple of other things for you in the background btw…


So, just to conclude - its exactly because I am a tech guy - I appreciate iPad being simple and robust.
I really know what lurks on the other side.
*(I do also use a desktop, and don’t think desktops are obsolete or will be. Thats why I called them PowerhouseWorkstations)



So.. you use Remote Desktop protocol to connect to a windows machine?

First, I was not assuming you are a simpler person. You use a desktop for work. A simpler person is someone like my 80-year old mother, who is fine with a phone and an iPad.
So I'll consider that your use of the work "stupid" is just the result of you misuderstanding me....

Now let me address the rest in a separate message

 

[Digitalguy]

Just to reference your ’hard to explain’ Remote Desktop Protocol / or VNC - especially with me being a ‘simpler person’ by your assumption. So I first used RDC/VNC in 2006 which is the year it came out - and first connected a portable device to a computer (what you are impressed with now) - in 2008 by connecting my iPhone (yes iphone) to my desktop back at home. Of course at the time internet was way to slow for this to work the way it works today.But yes, I used VirtualComputing way way back. Come to think about it I first used it 18 years ago.
And I still use it. Its great on iPad

I am definitely not using remote desktop, remote desktop is far from turning a mobile tablet into something like a surface pro. The framerate is always lower than native or there is latency or both. And while it can work well with keyboard and trackpad, it's rarely as good as using a OS nately (try to remote into Windows with any iPad or Android tablet and compare it to using a surface pro natively, it's not the same).
What I use is an app called Superdisplay, which, as I said, is a sort of Sidecar on steroids, and it's indistinguishible from a native device (it even supports 120hz), at least if you have a desktop with a decent GPU connected to ethernet (I don't know exactly how it works but it works best with ethernet, not wifi, while still being wireless).

PS Sorry if I won't be able to reply to any message till tomorrow, I am going to bed now, it's almost 3am where I live....

 

[ian87w]

There has recently been a lot of conversation among tech circles, here and on social media, about the iPad in and it's current state. Apple has practiced restraint and kept the iPad as simple to use as long as possible and tried to keep it a a separate product from the Mac.

Out of curiosity, I checked iPad commercials on YouTube and Apple's website to see how Apple themselves see the iPad and how they envision people using them. They have honed in and focused on note taking and drawing with the Apple Pencil as the core features and they're are all over the marketing material. It's the same situation with the Apple Watch: fitness and notifications.

Every year people are exited and hopeful that the next iPadOS version will make the iPad more Mac-like but aren't they setting themselves up for disappointment? The iPad and Mac bring in around the same revenue for Apple so their current strategy with the iPad is working. Anecdotally I have seen a ton of iPads all over high schools and colleges. There are a lot of happy iPad users.

I agree. The iPad is a new paradigm of computing.

Most of the complainers come from the traditional desktop OS. Meanwhile, new users who have smartphones as their first computers have no issues with the iPad. I myself have been using an Android tablet as my PC replacement, and I've been doing fine. In reality, majority of tasks are doable on these "post-PC devices."

If you read the complainers, they are all complaining basically the same things, ie things that they traditionally do on their desktops. It's like hearing truck users complaining that sedans cannot carry big loads in the trunk. Clearly there are the right tool for the job, but most people would be using sedans just fine to get from point A to point B.

 

[PandaPunch]

The iPad is for anyone and everyone who can find a purpose in using it. Saying it isn't for the traditional user is wrong and very short-sighted on your part.

I would have to echo this. The iPad isn't perfect, but it's still a computer that can be used. This idea that the iPad is for "lesser" users or "lesser" workflows needs to be put to rest.

 

[PandaPunch]

I agree. The iPad is a new paradigm of computing.

Most of the complainers come from the traditional desktop OS. Meanwhile, new users who have smartphones as their first computers have no issues with the iPad. I myself have been using an Android tablet as my PC replacement, and I've been doing fine. In reality, majority of tasks are doable on these "post-PC devices."

If you read the complainers, they are all complaining basically the same things, ie things that they traditionally do on their desktops. It's like hearing truck users complaining that sedans cannot carry big loads in the trunk. Clearly there are the right tool for the job, but most people would be using sedans just fine to get from point A to point B.

I used a "traditional" PC back in the XP days as a kid, I have no issues with an iPad even though I like elements of using the "traditional" desktop and I can easily go from iPad to Mac and back in a matter of seconds.