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Those who have a 4.4 kitkat device- how you finding it?

zbarvian said:
Android hasn't brought much to the table since 4.2 really, which was a year ago. I think people need to be a little more fair when criticizing Apple, too.
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The thing is, Android already does and allows so much more than what iOS does or allows. (This applies to the hardware as well.) So when something is "missing" or if an update hardware or software wise should come up short, there's really not much choice left in the matter.

This isn't true with Android's model. And saying each Android update isn't big anymore (which I more or less agree with) also ignores the very important point that Google updates their core apps individually throughout the year. There's been an insane amount of updates just these past few months to their apps.

I own both the Nexus 5 and the iPHone 5C, and I can say when something feels missing or inadequate with iOS and the iPhone, I feel stuck. Whereas if I'm displeased with the Nexus 5, if I really wanted to, I could probably find a replacement phone or launcher skin or change some default apps all to appease my particular need. This sort of flexibility, unfortunately, doesn't exist with iOS and the iPhone.
 
Ragnarianrok said:
The thing is, Android already does and allows so much more than what iOS does or allows. (This applies to the hardware as well.) So when something is "missing" or if an update hardware or software wise should come up short, there's really not much choice left in the matter.

This isn't true with Android's model. And saying each Android update isn't big anymore (which I more or less agree with) also ignores the very important point that Google updates their core apps individually throughout the year. There's been an insane amount of updates just these past few months to their apps.

I own both the Nexus 5 and the iPHone 5C, and I can say when something feels missing or inadequate with iOS and the iPhone, I feel stuck. Whereas if I'm displeased with the Nexus 5, if I really wanted to, I could probably find a replacement phone or launcher skin or change some default apps all to appease my particular need. This sort of flexibility, unfortunately, doesn't exist with iOS and the iPhone.
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Yes, but they still have lots of work to do for better app development and design. For instance, 4.4 introduced a new animation framework for doing some simple "scenes," and a full-screen mode for apps, both of which Apple has allowed for ages. iOS 7 has incredibly rich development tools for making apps more fun, immersive, interactive, and sophisticated. Look at some of them listed here: https://developer.apple.com/library/ios/releasenotes/General/WhatsNewIniOS/Articles/iOS7.html

Look at a quick demo someone made after iOS 7 was announced: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VX15G2gMK5o

You could never make an app even remotely similar to that on Android. The apps on Android still feel dated and crude. Google needs to majorly work on its development platform so it can empower developers to make great apps without making great pains and efforts. That would finally close the gap in quality and apps, I think.

Here's another video: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cdPTYHdZO-M

Using the user's wallpaper and great physics. Facebook did a terrific job with Chat Heads and Facebook Home on Android, but it was an arduous project and required them to rewrite much code.
 
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zbarvian said:
Yes, but they still have lots of work to do for better app development and design. For instance, 4.4 introduced a new animation framework for doing some simple "scenes," and a full-screen mode for apps, both of which Apple has allowed for ages. iOS 7 has incredibly rich development tools for making apps more fun, immersive, interactive, and sophisticated. Look at some of them listed here: https://developer.apple.com/library/ios/releasenotes/General/WhatsNewIniOS/Articles/iOS7.html

Look at a quick demo someone made after iOS 7 was announced: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VX15G2gMK5o

You could never make an app even remotely similar to that on Android. The apps on Android still feel dated and crude. Google needs to majorly work on its development platform so it can empower developers to make great apps without making great pains and efforts. That would finally close the gap in quality and apps, I think.

Here's another video: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cdPTYHdZO-M

Using the user's wallpaper and great physics. Facebook did a terrific job with Chat Heads and Facebook Home on Android, but it was an arduous project and required them to rewrite much code.
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No doubt Google can improve app development.

At this point in time I trust Google to develop this faster than I trust apple to allow users to set default apps for example.
 
Ragnarianrok said:
No doubt Google can improve app development.

At this point in time I trust Google to develop this faster than I trust apple to allow users to set default apps for example.
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I think it's a toss-up. It's taken Google this long and they're nowhere near, but 4.4 does show a focus on design and new tools. Tim Cook did say we would see them open up, and I think default apps is very likely in store for iOS 8.
 
zbarvian said:
I think it's a toss-up. It's taken Google this long and they're nowhere near, but 4.4 does show a focus on design and new tools. Tim Cook did say we would see them open up, and I think default apps is very likely in store for iOS 8.
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Hopefully. But it doesn't change the fact that where Android is overall compared to where iOS overall means their updates shouldn't be scrutinized the same way. Especially when you throw hardware into the equation. The flexibility of Android on nearly all fronts has really propelled that platform ahead.

As for it being a toss-up, unless I'm a developer, I don't think it's a toss up, at all. Far from it. As a daily Nexus 5 and iPhone 5C user, I can say with certainty my experience between the two isn't a toss up; the majority of the time one is better, more enjoyable, and easier to use than the other. The app disparity for the typical end user is just not as grave as many make it out to be. I can understand the grievances if I was a developer, however. My understanding is that Google is rapidly addressing these issues for devs, but I may be wrong.
 
Ragnarianrok said:
Hopefully. But it doesn't change the fact that where Android is overall compared to where iOS overall means their updates shouldn't be scrutinized the same way. Especially when you throw hardware into the equation. The flexibility of Android on nearly all fronts has really propelled that platform ahead.

As for it being a toss-up, unless I'm a developer, I don't think it's a toss up, at all. Far from it. As a daily Nexus 5 and iPhone 5C user, I can say with certainty my experience between the two isn't a toss up; the majority of the time one is better, more enjoyable, and easier to use than the other. The app disparity for the typical end user is just not as grave as many make it out to be. I can understand the grievances if I was a developer, however. My understanding is that Google is rapidly addressing these issues for devs, but I may be wrong.
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They're certainly making a concerted effort, but it means you won't have apps like TweetBot, Haze, Clear, Fantastical, Coast, and Paper. Hard to use alternatives after you've used those. But I'll agree, Android is getting very compelling, and Google's done some great things. Next major upgrade (5.0 next year?) will leave me very torn between platforms. Good timing, too, because my contract is up then.
 
zbarvian said:
They're certainly making a concerted effort, but it means you won't have apps like TweetBot, Haze, Clear, Fantastical, Coast, and Paper. Hard to use alternatives after you've used those. But I'll agree, Android is getting very compelling, and Google's done some great things. Next major upgrade (5.0 next year?) will leave me very torn between platforms. Good timing, too, because my contract is up then.
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Likewise, until iOS opens up some more, the iOS user will never get to experience widgets to their full potential or apps like Switfkey or Swype, different launchers, etc. Not having those, for my personal uses, is worse.

Regarding next year, I agree. Hopefully Android 5.0 and iOS 8 continue making choosing between the two harder and harder. ;) Ultimately, I think what will make the choice the hardest, though, will be the potential larger iPhone 6 screen -- it'll be a long time coming.
 
zbarvian said:
Yes, but they still have lots of work to do for better app development and design. For instance, 4.4 introduced a new animation framework for doing some simple "scenes," and a full-screen mode for apps, both of which Apple has allowed for ages. iOS 7 has incredibly rich development tools for making apps more fun, immersive, interactive, and sophisticated. Look at some of them listed here: https://developer.apple.com/library/ios/releasenotes/General/WhatsNewIniOS/Articles/iOS7.html

Look at a quick demo someone made after iOS 7 was announced: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=VX15G2gMK5o

You could never make an app even remotely similar to that on Android. The apps on Android still feel dated and crude. Google needs to majorly work on its development platform so it can empower developers to make great apps without making great pains and efforts. That would finally close the gap in quality and apps, I think.

Here's another video: http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=cdPTYHdZO-M

Using the user's wallpaper and great physics. Facebook did a terrific job with Chat Heads and Facebook Home on Android, but it was an arduous project and required them to rewrite much code.
Click to expand...

Have you ever developed apps for Android?? The reason "immersive mode" (not full screen mode) may exist in iOS and "not" in Android is because they're built differently. Back navigation is part of the OS rather than letting every application developer implement it any way they want (iOS). It's actually good as it creates a more consistent user experience. Besides, this mode has always existed, it just took a few extra lines of code to implement. With the new mode you just set a property and you're done.

A lot of the animation changes are to make certain animations easier to implement (or auto-generate between scenes). You can absolutely implement anything you want, so I don't get the whole "You could never make an app even remotely similar to that on Android." Of course you could - well, maybe not you, but you get my drift ;).

From a development perspective, there are pluses and minuses in both stacks. For example, designing layouts for Android is "fun work" since your app can run on any number of resolutions, aspect ratios and so on. No different than designing a website, you don't know which browser will be rendering the site, the users' resolution, the size of the window, etc.

I don't think most people buying a device really care how easy or hard it was for a developer to implement their app... they just care that it works, looks nice and most importantly: does the intended job. Good developers can make the same app look just as good and perform just as well on either platform. However, that developer can't influence the OS that the user interacts with on a daily basis - at least not iOS :rolleyes:. Unfortunately, this is where iOS falls short and looks dated in many ways.

Both OS's has skeletons in their closets and both have good and bad things. Android just allows the user to do more. Some people don't need more or shouldn't be allowed to do more, which is fine. To each their own...
 
OhHaiThere said:
Have you ever developed apps for Android?? The reason "immersive mode" (not full screen mode) may exist in iOS and "not" in Android is because they're built differently. Back navigation is part of the OS rather than letting every application developer implement it any way they want (iOS). It's actually good as it creates a more consistent user experience. Besides, this mode has always existed, it just took a few extra lines of code to implement. With the new mode you just set a property and you're done.

A lot of the animation changes are to make certain animations easier to implement (or auto-generate between scenes). You can absolutely implement anything you want, so I don't get the whole "You could never make an app even remotely similar to that on Android." Of course you could - well, maybe not you, but you get my drift ;).

From a development perspective, there are pluses and minuses in both stacks. For example, designing layouts for Android is "fun work" since your app can run on any number of resolutions, aspect ratios and so on. No different than designing a website, you don't know which browser will be rendering the site, the users' resolution, the size of the window, etc.

I don't think most people buying a device really care how easy or hard it was for a developer to implement their app... they just care that it works, looks nice and most importantly: does the intended job. Good developers can make the same app look just as good and perform just as well on either platform. However, that developer can't influence the OS that the user interacts with on a daily basis - at least not iOS :rolleyes:. Unfortunately, this is where iOS falls short and looks dated in many ways.

Both OS's has skeletons in their closets and both have good and bad things. Android just allows the user to do more. Some people don't need more or shouldn't be allowed to do more, which is fine. To each their own...
Click to expand...

Yes, that's what it's all about. It's not that these advanced design flourishes can't be done on Android, but they're much more difficult. Hence Facebook having to rewrite tons of code to get a fluid page controller. Still important for attracting developers or enticing them to polish their app up to iOS levels.
 
zbarvian said:
Yes, that's what it's all about. It's not that these advanced design flourishes can't be done on Android, but they're much more difficult. Hence Facebook having to rewrite tons of code to get a fluid page controller. Still important for attracting developers or enticing them to polish their app up to iOS levels.
Click to expand...

I've never had a bad experience with my Facebook on Android. It's always worked fine.
 
I have to say there seems to be a significant improvement in scrolling/fluidity in chrome with ART enabled. Sure showcases the 'higher speed' scrolling in android versus iOS well.

Perhaps good enough to justify the loss of native adobe flash with 4.4, though puffin works when flash is needed.

Some apps are broken in ART but I can live without them. None that I use are effected.

Using gs4 Google edition

Edit:Should mention using chrome beta, haven't tried regular.
 
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gotluck said:
I have to say there seems to be a significant improvement in scrolling/fluidity in chrome with ART enabled. Sure showcases the 'higher speed' scrolling in android versus iOS well.

Perhaps good enough to justify the loss of native adobe flash with 4.4, though puffin works when flash is needed.

Some apps are broken in ART but I can live without them. None that I use are effected.

Using gs4 Google edition
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I would enable ART if it didn't break Whatsapp.
 
gregrose said:
How do you enable ART?
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First, enable developer options: Settings > About phone and tap Build number seven times.

To change runtimes:
Settings -> Developer options -> Select runtime

Keep in mind if you do this, your phone will reboot and start precompiling all of your apps. This can take a significant amount of time, depending on how many apps you have (figure on ~20 mins or so).
 
zbarvian said:
Should've specified, I was talking about Facebook Home. Not sure how your experience would've mattered to my point anyways.
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Oh...i tried Home and i hated it. I dont like Facebook THAT much where it is on all the time and it is my launcher. I would think only those who reeally like and use FB a lot would like that.
 
I'm quite pleased that the "Facebook" phone failed.

It was interesting though cause if you turned off Facebook Home, you were sort of left with stock Android on the device.
 
I'm actually liking it better than I thought I would. The new dialer is actually nice and has helped me twice today. Performance is about the same. The S4 Pro is really holding up well. Nothing else has changed much. I'm not using hangouts or GEL.
 
TacticalDesire said:
I'm actually liking it better than I thought I would. The new dialer is actually nice and has helped me twice today. Performance is about the same. The S4 Pro is really holding up well. Nothing else has changed much. I'm not using hangouts or GEL.
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The dialer is great, especially the way it looks up numbers for you. Really puts Google's search resources to good use. I've been calling a few stores for questions regarding errands and whatnot, and they automatically load the vendor's name, etc. into my dial history so I know exactly who's who.

The dialer, overall, is very well designed and effective.
 
gotluck said:
I hear you but I could only imagine how smooth a GE Note 3 would be. Of course you lose the s pen and much else, but I'd wager thered be an increase in performance.
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I've also imagined what the Note 3 would be like as a GE phone. It would probably be overkill though. IMO, the 3 gigs of RAM is an absolute necessity for all of touchwiz and its bloat. I also had an S4 and the stutters drove me insane. Samsung should have went with the 3 gigs on the S4 or introduced a slimmer package right out the box, kill off some of the s-features and make the user experience more optimized. I hope that's the direction they're going with the S5.
 
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