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From what I hear, Tiger is a very promising upgrade. I can't wait until it comes out and reaches greece... I will buy it as soon as it gets here, since at the time it arrives, it will have reached 10.4.1 and some release problems will have been addressed...

Can anyone tell me what problems does the current beta have?
 
Soulstorm said:
From what I hear, Tiger is a very promising upgrade. I can't wait until it comes out and reaches greece... I will buy it as soon as it gets here, since at the time it arrives, it will have reached 10.4.1 and some release problems will have been addressed...

Can anyone tell me what problems does the current beta have?

I have the build before the GM build (8A425), as the GM is not available yet -

It's VERY stable at this point. In fact, I've used it as my main OS for several days now, and I haven't noticed any bugs at all. One could safely say that Tiger WILL be released this April, it feels ready for primetime.
 
iindigo said:
Here's the comparison I promised. Sorry about the delay -

Iindigo, thanks a bunch for those pictures - they exhibited what you meant perfectly. The change seems very subtle, but makes it look much smoother when put side-by-side to the old. One of those changes that goes almost unnoticed until you switch back to Panther and wonder how you ever lived with it. Also it looks like brushed metal looks nicer in Tiger. Just me?
 
The Tiger interface is overall nicer than Panthers (those subtle differences make a difference). One more difference that I just noticed now was that the "button" on the side of the sidebar that allows you to control it's width, has changed. A small little change, but it somehow looks smoother and more Aqua-ish.

The only things that I don't like about Tiger in the latest build (8A425) are the new Mail buttons, I think they're not inline with the rest of the interface, and how you select widgets in Dashboard (I liked the WWDC 2004 way much better).
-Chase
 
rendezvouscp said:
The Tiger interface is overall nicer than Panthers (those subtle differences make a difference). One more difference that I just noticed now was that the "button" on the side of the sidebar that allows you to control it's width, has changed. A small little change, but it somehow looks smoother and more Aqua-ish.

The only things that I don't like about Tiger in the latest build (8A425) are the new Mail buttons, I think they're not inline with the rest of the interface, and how you select widgets in Dashboard (I liked the WWDC 2004 way much better).
-Chase

Although I haven't used the newer version of Tiger with the new way of selecting widgets; why do you like to old way of selecting widgets? It seems like the old way didn't allow enough space to display a lot of 3rd party Widgets. It seems like the new way will offer unlimited space. The only problem is that it seems like it would take longer to select widgets because you'd have to flip through multiple pages and then drag them where you wanted them. The old way you just point and click. Is this why you like the old way better? :confused: I like the eye candy of the new way, but I agree that functionality is better than looks. :)

By the way... Are you able to open new widgets as files in the Library and have them pop-up into the dashboard? Or can you only put them on the dashboard via the dashboard dock?
 
GodBless said:
Although I haven't used the newer version of Tiger with the new way of selecting widgets; why do you like to old way of selecting widgets? It seems like the old way didn't allow enough space to display a lot of 3rd party Widgets. It seems like the new way will offer unlimited space. The only problem is that it seems like it would take longer to select widgets because you'd have to flip through multiple pages and then drag them where you wanted them. The old way you just point and click. Is this why you like the old way better? :confused: I like the eye candy of the new way, but I agree that functionality is better than looks. :)

By the way... Are you able to open new widgets as files in the Library and have them pop-up into the dashboard? Or can you only put them on the dashboard via the dashboard dock?

There might be "unlimited space" and all that jazz, but I don't like the Dashboard Dock. It's just a personal preference, many will disagree, but I don't like it. I don't know if it's the whole interface, or that it moves your screen up (Dashboard is supposed to be a transparent layer behind your head!), or what, I just like the old way better. Maybe it's just because of the old eye-candy...

When you put them in the Library, you can open them up, and they'll pop up and be added to the dashboard dock (if that makes sense).
-Chase
 
rendezvouscp said:
There might be "unlimited space" and all that jazz, but I don't like the Dashboard Dock. It's just a personal preference, many will disagree, but I don't like it. I don't know if it's the whole interface, or that it moves your screen up (Dashboard is supposed to be a transparent layer behind your head!), or what, I just like the old way better. Maybe it's just because of the old eye-candy...

When you put them in the Library, you can open them up, and they'll pop up and be added to the dashboard dock (if that makes sense).
-Chase
I thought there was more eye candy in the new dashboard because it had more core image effects like the "ripple effect". What is missing that was in the old dashboard eye candy wise?
 
iindigo said:
Actually, in Tiger the Finder is much faster - I'd estimate at least 70-80% faster, if not more. It seems Apple has used Tiger to fix bugs in the Finder rather than add features to the Finder.

I was in no way talking about the speed of the Finder, actually. I'm more concerned with the lack of features, lack of sense, and lack of care for how the user might want to use the Finder. As far as I'm concerned, the Finder in Pather still feels like beta software.
 
shidoshi said:
I was in no way talking about the speed of the Finder, actually. I'm more concerned with the lack of features, lack of sense, and lack of care for how the user might want to use the Finder. As far as I'm concerned, the Finder in Pather still feels like beta software.

What is missing in your opinion? other than those Tabs everyone misses from OS 9...
 
GodBless said:
I thought there was more eye candy in the new dashboard because it had more core image effects like the "ripple effect". What is missing that was in the old dashboard eye candy wise?

Well, with the original dashboard dock it was just a transparent widget with all of your widgets (by name) and your favorite widgets, with a trash can. You could expand and contract the widget to show or hide your favorites, or contract the whole widget itself and turn it into a small circle. Then it would quickly slide out at your request. The ripple effect was in the old dashboard too—when you clicked on a widget's name, the widget would "plop" down into dashboard and then you could move it wherever you wanted.

In all practicality, the new dashboard dock is better. You can move widgets around the dock, drag them out of the dock wherever you want to, etc. That wasn't really available to the old dock. But I still like the old dock better. Next time I boot into Tiger, I'll have to see if I can replace the new dock with the old one...
-Chase
 
Soulstorm said:
And seriously, the finder's features are so many, that you are not going to use them all.

The way you say it seems that you prefer Windows OS better that the Mac OS.

First, I've been a Mac user since my original Mac Plus, which I got in 1988, maybe 1989. Before that, I was using an Apple //e. So I wouldn't have used a Mac all of this time if I didn't prefer the Apple way of doing things.

That said, you have to give Microsoft / Windows credit when it is due. In a number of ways, their "Finder"... whatever the hell it is called, is better than the Mac Finder. (I also, at times, prefer the Windows Open/Save dialog boxes, because you can actually do stuff like delete/rename/etc. files, which is handy at times. To accomplish the same on Mac OSX, you have to back out of the dialog, switch to the Finder, make your changes, and then go back and try again.)

And I'm sorry, for me, the Finder we have now still feels terrible. It isn't about "using all of the features" - that's a ridiculous comment. You don't use every feature of everything - what features are there for is to give a better experience to people who prefer to do things in different ways.

I'll be happy to actually back myself up here, and make a list of the points where I think the Mac OSX Finder is terrible. I'll post it later today or tomorrow.
 
shidoshi said:
That said, you have to give Microsoft / Windows credit when it is due. In a number of ways, their "Finder"... whatever the hell it is called

It is called Windows "Explorer" not to be confused with "Internet Explorer". (Even though it is easy to confuse the two because of their names.)

I agree with you here. When Steve Jobs said, "I think we finally got the Finder right", at the 2003 WWDC conference, I thought they were going to have something like Windows too. When Panther was released a little later I was very disappointed.

Somebody should list the lack of features in the Finder as a bug. Then it should be fine when 10.5 comes out. Maybe 10.5 will be the beginning of the dog names to scare the lack of Features in the 10.0 to 10.4 cats away.
 
I've started a a new thread about Finder improvement- I can think of my own gazillion annoyances with the OS X Finder. For 10.5, I would love for Apple to simply ask for user feedback - we all use the Finder everyday, and I think that's enough to qualify for feedback.

Thread
 
rendezvouscp said:
The Tiger interface is overall nicer than Panthers (those subtle differences make a difference). One more difference that I just noticed now was that the "button" on the side of the sidebar that allows you to control it's width, has changed. A small little change, but it somehow looks smoother and more Aqua-ish.

The only things that I don't like about Tiger in the latest build (8A425) are the new Mail buttons, I think they're not inline with the rest of the interface, and how you select widgets in Dashboard (I liked the WWDC 2004 way much better).
-Chase

How is it different and why do you like the old way better?
 
shidoshi said:
First, I've been a Mac user since my original Mac Plus, which I got in 1988, maybe 1989. Before that, I was using an Apple //e. So I wouldn't have used a Mac all of this time if I didn't prefer the Apple way of doing things.

That said, you have to give Microsoft / Windows credit when it is due. In a number of ways, their "Finder"... whatever the hell it is called, is better than the Mac Finder. (I also, at times, prefer the Windows Open/Save dialog boxes, because you can actually do stuff like delete/rename/etc. files, which is handy at times. To accomplish the same on Mac OSX, you have to back out of the dialog, switch to the Finder, make your changes, and then go back and try again.)

And I'm sorry, for me, the Finder we have now still feels terrible. It isn't about "using all of the features" - that's a ridiculous comment. You don't use every feature of everything - what features are there for is to give a better experience to people who prefer to do things in different ways.

I'll be happy to actually back myself up here, and make a list of the points where I think the Mac OSX Finder is terrible. I'll post it later today or tomorrow.
"Terrible" is a big word for such a good OS. I agree, OS X (panther, I haven't used Tiger) hasn't some very useful features that I would like to see implemented, like the ability to rename a file in the save dialog.

Or the "cut" and "paste" that windows have when you want to move some files from one location to the other. OS X only has "copy" and "paste", foorcing you to go back after copy and delete the original files.

But doesn't mean that the Finder is terrible. It has some awsome features, like the comlumn view, which is unavailable in windows, and very handy, it has that "services" option, as a menu item that allows you to access various program functions, it has the dock, which imo is far better than the start menu, it has the sidebar (i love this feature).

And lets not forget that marvelous search bar at the top right of the window.
Windows has such a feature, too, but the search is not so fast and accessible. I love the search the Finder has.

Imo, Finder doen't suck. It is stable and fast, but it can be improved, as it happens will all things in the software market. There is always space for big improvements in every aspect of a product. But that doesn't mean it sucks.

I love finder. A lot. And I know many people that love it, too. If you say that finder sucks, then you automatically throw away a great part of apple's operating system, so 50% of the reasons me and many other people buy mac products to do their job are simply nonexistent.

Think about it...
 
Window's explorer

would I rather have windows explorer than finder... That almost sounds like a trick question.

Finder needs some improvments like :

1. immediate preview.
2. working secure webdav
3. improvement in windows networking solutions
4. easily customize icons
5. keyboard access to sidebar. I don't see why this is hard to do. and this is my biggest petpeeve. I can't only use my keyboard and navigate finder
6. trash can in finder (much easier than doc)
7. allow network volumes harddrives and cds to go in the doc
8. gloabal change of default size and view.

I will have to wait and see if any of these improvments are in tiger. If not hopfully i can find a nice third party app to enhance the finder.
 
NaMo4184 said:
would I rather have windows explorer than finder... That almost sounds like a trick question.

Finder needs some improvments like :

1. immediate preview.
Agreed.

NaMo4184 said:
3. improvement in windows networking solutions
Agreed.

NaMo4184 said:
4. easily customize icons
This is already possible. Just right click (or ctrl+click) on a file that has a certain icon you want to use and then click "Get Info" from the contextual menu. Then in the "General" section of the "Get Info" window select the icon so that it is outlined in blue. You can then copy that icon (with the cmd+c command) and paste it on another file by selecting another file's icon in its "Get Info" window and pressing (cmd+v). Pretty cool isn't it? :cool: It sure beats Windows if you ask me.

NaMo4184 said:
5. keyboard access to sidebar. I don't see why this is hard to do. and this is my biggest petpeeve. I can't only use my keyboard and navigate finder
Yeah this is a problem. If it helps (and if you already didn't know) you can switch to it using the shift+tab command in the open/save dialogue boxes.

NaMo4184 said:
6. trash can in finder (much easier than doc)
There is 3rd party software for this, but I personally like it in the dock because it takes up less desktop space.

NaMo4184 said:
8. gloabal change of default size and view.
Boy if there was one improvement that I would like to see in the next generation of Mac OS X I think it would be this one.
 
I don't know, the trash can to me makes a lot more sense being in the dock - the dock is always there, always on top of everything. If it was in the sidebar, you would have to open a new Finder window to delete stuff off of the desktop.
 
TRASH Every Where

chameeeleon said:
I don't know, the trash can to me makes a lot more sense being in the dock - the dock is always there, always on top of everything. If it was in the sidebar, you would have to open a new Finder window to delete stuff off of the desktop.
You miss understand me. I never said anything about moving the trash from the dock. Keep it there. I just want to beablet o drag the trash from the dock put it in the finder sidebar like an alias. So i have on on the doc when i feel like using it that way and one in the finder when i feel like using it that way. Say way you have a desktop but you can view it from the finder.
 
NaMo4184 said:
You miss understand me. I never said anything about moving the trash from the dock. Keep it there. I just want to beablet o drag the trash from the dock put it in the finder sidebar like an alias. So i have on on the doc when i feel like using it that way and one in the finder when i feel like using it that way. Say way you have a desktop but you can view it from the finder.

I just tried and yes I was able to get the Trash in the side bar! Just drag the .Trash file (not to be confused with the .Trashes file) in your home directory to the side bar when your invisible files are made semitransparent (or partially visible). Just use the TinkerTool application (not to be confused with the TinkerTool System application) to make this possible at: http://www.macupdate.com/info.php/id/5721 .
 
GodBless said:
I just tried and yes I was able to get the Trash in the side bar! Just drag the .Trash file (not to be confused with the .Trashes file) in your home directory to the side bar when your invisible files are made semitransparent (or partially visible). Just use the TinkerTool application (not to be confused with the TinkerTool System application) to make this possible at: http://www.macupdate.com/info.php/id/5721 .
Wow that is one sweet application. Now all i have to do is figure out how to get the side bar to use the trash icon and I'm set. wut! :D
 
NaMo4184 said:
Wow that is one sweet application. Now all i have to do is figure out how to get the side bar to use the trash icon and I'm set. wut! :D

If you need help I can give you the steps necessary to do so.
 
Okay, for anybody who cares, I posted some thoughts over in the "Finder improvements" thread that was linked to above.
 
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