Tim Cook vs Steve Jobs

[Galacticos]

I want to start a thread discussing the direction Tim Cook is taking Apple beginning with the disappointing launch of iphone 7 and their high prices.
This discussion could reach all corners of Apple from software to tims focus on 'social issues' but I thought we might start with the flagship product

 

[Armen]

I want to start a thread discussing the direction Tim Cook is taking Apple beginning with the disappointing launch of iphone 7 and their high prices.
This discussion could reach all corners of Apple from software to tims focus on 'social issues' but I thought we might start with the flagship product

What disappointing launch of the iPhone 7?
disappointing that all the people who preordered the jet black model won't get it on launch day?

 

[Irock619]

I want to start a thread discussing the direction Tim Cook is taking Apple beginning with the disappointing launch of iphone 7 and their high prices.
This discussion could reach all corners of Apple from software to tims focus on 'social issues' but I thought we might start with the flagship product

I'd rather enjoy my new iPhone and iWatch

 

[Steve686]

How would you even know that Jobs didn't design and outline the next ten years after he stepped down before handing the keys to Tim Cook?

What we are seeing year after year very well could have been in development under Jobs and merely completed by Cook.

 

[machtv]

OMG here we go again. let the best man win ready FIGHT!!!

 

[Irock619]

How would you even know that Jobs didn't design and outline the next ten years after he stepped down before handing the keys to Tim Cook?

What we are seeing year after year very well could have been in development under Jobs and merely completed by Cook.

Has nothing to do with the product launch.

 

[Galacticos]

Disappointing in that the iPhone 7 basically is an iPhone 6ss. For the first time in the line up the new features aren't new features they merely bring it close to par with Samsung etc

Enjoy away. This thread was started to discuss the direction of Apple under Tim Cook. Prices are rising, innovation is dropping, mediocre apps like maps are now acceptable to the company. Tim cooks biggest concerns are share buybacks and what his stock options are worth along with 'social issues'.
Steve jobs always put the product first, made the products affordable and often fought with the board to keep the prices low. And he innovated.

I am fairly devoted to Apple. I don't think the company is upholding the values that made it great

 

[born2runak]

Seems like troll thread, but Ill bite...
Do I think the company would be better under Jobs , absolutely . But I think the jury may still be out for Cook. My biggest issue is that Apple seems to have gotten away from improving product design - i.e. the plus phones. I really don't see Jobs releasing the plus models in their current form factor. the design is too unwieldy and, quite frankly, lazy design. The phone has too much excess, just a blown up iPhone. The form factor works fine for the 4.7 model, but if you have held a Note phone and held a Plus you know the difference. Don't get me wrong, I have a Plus model as I really wanter larger screen real estate. but the form factor is too clunky. With Jobs , it may have taken longer to get a plus size model, but I can bet it would have been a better experience. And take a look at the watch OS - the original, while functional, was no master piece. I get that it was a first get product, but with the release of OS3, Its clear apple knew the first go was wrong. Take a look at the first gen iPhone OS- have more features been added, sure, but the basic design never has really changed. It is still as simple to use now as it was then. I have spent my fair share of time with android and I still have a hard time navigating to things .

 

[Galacticos]

How would you even know that Jobs didn't design and outline the next ten years after he stepped down before handing the keys to Tim Cook?

What we are seeing year after year very well could have been in development under Jobs and merely completed by Cook.

There's a chance this is true but it's slim. Unless Steve thought the best thing for the company was to do the opposite of what he always did as its leader

 

[Gathomblipoob]

I want to start a thread discussing the direction Tim Cook is taking Apple beginning with the disappointing launch of iphone 7 and their high prices.
This discussion could reach all corners of Apple from software to tims focus on 'social issues' but I thought we might start with the flagship product

The price of the original iPhone got cut a couple months after the launch, so it ain't all Tim Cook.

 

[Steve686]

Has nothing to do with the product launch.

He is generalizing the 'direction' of the company whatever the hell that pertains to.
[doublepost=1473572678][/doublepost]

There's a chance this is true but it's slim. Unless Steve thought the best thing for the company was to do the opposite of what he always did as its leader

These aimless discussions do much better when you can really give detailed examples of real changes in execution and company culture.

 

[machtv]

Don't get me wrong, I have a Plus model as I really wanter larger screen real estate. but the form factor is too clunky. With Jobs , it may have taken longer to get a plus size model, .

i totally agree with this statement. the note vs plus is a no brainer atleast as far as all the external features/size. you would have to be totally blind to think different.

 

[aconnell11]

Disappointing in that the iPhone 7 basically is an iPhone 6ss. For the first time in the line up the new features aren't new features they merely bring it close to par with Samsung etc

Enjoy away. This thread was started to discuss the direction of Apple under Tim Cook. Prices are rising, innovation is dropping, mediocre apps like maps are now acceptable to the company. Tim cooks biggest concerns are share buybacks and what his stock options are worth along with 'social issues'.
Steve jobs always put the product first, made the products affordable and often fought with the board to keep the prices low. And he innovated.

I am fairly devoted to Apple. I don't think the company is upholding the values that made it great

"Fought with the board to keep the prices low"

The hell are you talking about?

 

[Galacticos]

Seems like troll thread, but Ill bite...
Do I think the company would be better under Jobs , absolutely . But I think the jury may still be out for Cook. My biggest issue is that Apple seems to have gotten away from improving product design - i.e. the plus phones. I really don't see Jobs releasing the plus models in their current form factor. the design is too unwieldy and, quite frankly, lazy design. The phone has too much excess, just a blown up iPhone. The form factor works fine for the 4.7 model, but if you have held a Note phone and held a Plus you know the difference. Don't get me wrong, I have a Plus model as I really wanter larger screen real estate. but the form factor is too clunky. With Jobs , it may have taken longer to get a plus size model, but I can bet it would have been a better experience. And take a look at the watch OS - the original, while functional, was no master piece. I get that it was a first get product, but with the release of OS3, Its clear apple knew the first go was wrong. Take a look at the first gen iPhone OS- have more features been added, sure, but the basic design never has really changed. It is still as simple to use now as it was then. I have spent my fair share of time with android and I still have a hard time navigating to things .

Not trolling. I love Steve jobs. He's irreplaceable. I think it's sad that Apple is becoming more like a multinational with an attitude of nearly on lots of their new things (software and hardware). Abuse is a strong word, but I think Apple is bordering on abusing a customer base it built with true innovation and affordability of world changing products, with the staggering of technology, lack of innovation, increasing prices, and general toleration of mediocre product releases.

I think Tim Cook is far more concerned with share price, debt financed buybacks and stock option values. Steve NEVER would have done a debt leveraged share buyback. It was always product and user experience first. I think Tim is a corporate fat cat and is happy to let the company drift into mediocrity

 

[born2runak]

Disappointing in that the iPhone 7 basically is an iPhone 6ss. For the first time in the line up the new features aren't new features they merely bring it close to par with Samsung etc

Enjoy away. This thread was started to discuss the direction of Apple under Tim Cook. Prices are rising, innovation is dropping, mediocre apps like maps are now acceptable to the company. Tim cooks biggest concerns are share buybacks and what his stock options are worth along with 'social issues'.
Steve jobs always put the product first, made the products affordable and often fought with the board to keep the prices low. And he innovated.

I am fairly devoted to Apple. I don't think the company is upholding the values that made it great

While I agree with your assessment of the iPhone 7, I think it is fair to also consider that it is true that innovation is far slower now then it was with gen 1. Gen 1 launched a new frontier for smartphones. At this point, what else is there besides the usual spec improvements? Also , with the extinction of 2 year contract subsidies, rumors of Apple moving in a 3 year refresh makes smart business sense coupled with my previous point. Most people will be less inclined to upgrade as frequently now that the are basically paying for a 700-1000 dollar device out of pocket. I will be very curious to see what Apple has in store next year, and I will consider next year a far greater measure than this year

 

[Galacticos]

"Fought with the board to keep the prices low"

The hell are you talking about?

Early days with the Mac computers. iPhone got a healthy price drop in the early models - Steve said Apple found 'more people would buy it if it were more affordable'. He also said Apple was a company focused on 'volume side of revenue' not price side

 

[Calipad]

Tim Cook was and is a mistake. It should have been Jony Ives or someone like him that replaced Jobs. What Apples needs is a creative type that drives the team and company to strive for the unobtainable much like Jobs did. The products that are coming out of Apple now are good just not exceptional and that will only carry them so far. I am sure the board is aware of this.

 

[born2runak]

I think Tim Cook is far more concerned with share price, debt financed buybacks and stock option values. Steve NEVER would have done a debt leveraged share buyback. It was always product and user experience first. I think Tim is a corporate fat cat and is happy to let the company drift into mediocrity

If true, then Cook will have quite a bit of worrying to do in upcoming years. I always fear in the back of my mind the return of the apple from the "Job-less years"

 

[ajones92]

Disappointing in that the iPhone 7 basically is an iPhone 6ss. For the first time in the line up the new features aren't new features they merely bring it close to par with Samsung etc

Enjoy away. This thread was started to discuss the direction of Apple under Tim Cook. Prices are rising, innovation is dropping, mediocre apps like maps are now acceptable to the company. Tim cooks biggest concerns are share buybacks and what his stock options are worth along with 'social issues'.
Steve jobs always put the product first, made the products affordable and often fought with the board to keep the prices low. And he innovated.

I am fairly devoted to Apple. I don't think the company is upholding the values that made it great

Maps? Clearly you don't have the ios10 beta because it's the nicest map application i've ever used. Granted the original was a turd but they fixed it. I won't get into the iPhone 7 with you because we just flat disagree because I think it is a massive update.

I'll just say this....while Steve Jobs was no doubt a fantastic CEO and a world class visionary, if Steve was still CEO we certainly wouldn't have the current plus iphones and possibly not even the 4.7" screens and would most likely still use
Skeuomorphism(not sure i spelled that correctly), as steve seemed dead set on that design style. I could be wrong but my main point is while Tim Cook has made some mistakes, overall it seems like Apple is a bit more transparent and IMO does a bit better at listening to what customers want vs telling us what we want. Some people don't like that, some do. Also, please don't hang me as some sort of Steve Jobs hater because that's simply not true.

 

[aconnell11]

Early days with the Mac computers. iPhone got a healthy price drop in the early models - Steve said Apple found 'more people would buy it if it were more affordable'. He also said Apple was a company focused on 'volume side of revenue' not price side

iPhone got a healthy price drop because people didn't want to spend $600 for the phone at once. (Obviously back when the wireless industry used subsidies exclusively).

Apple is a business, and while people can fawn over Jobs for innovation or changing the world or whatever, it was still his job to make money. If he priced items to sell in volume, then it was still a way for his company to make the most money. And don't for a second tell me the company that sells adaptors for $50 is worried about affordability.

Jobs is dead. I don't get the mythical fascination he still gets.

 

[bnahms123]

tim cook was HAND PICKED by jobs. we all give him credit with creating this company in his garage and creating the iphone, ipod, itunes, macbook, etc... dont you think he knew who he was choosing to be the new CEO? he also told tim "don't ever question yourself with 'what would steve do?'

point being, tim is doing the best he can. he's no steve jobs but who else is?

 

[Galacticos]

While I agree with your assessment of the iPhone 7, I think it is fair to also consider that it is true that innovation is far slower now then it was with gen 1. Gen 1 launched a new frontier for smartphones. At this point, what else is there besides the usual spec improvements? Also , with the extinction of 2 year contract subsidies, rumors of Apple moving in a 3 year refresh makes smart business sense coupled with my previous point. Most people will be less inclined to upgrade as frequently now that the are basically paying for a 700-1000 dollar device out of pocket. I will be very curious to see what Apple has in store next year, and I will consider next year a far greater measure than this year

Agreed. But prices shouldn't be so high. That's the thing, I'm not arguing Tim cooks business sense. He's making Apple a lot of money. I'm noting the changing direction of the company.

if iPhone prices halved overnight, there'd be a much greater than 2x adoption of iPhone. That's essentially what jobs did years ago. Making iPhones now would be cheaper than ever, yet prices are higher than ever. Which is fine if you are Tim Cook and stock price is all that matters. If you're Steve jobs product (and innovation) is what matters, and more people having those products

 

[Calipad]

tim cook was HAND PICKED by jobs. we all give him credit with creating this company in his garage and creating the iphone, ipod, itunes, macbook, etc... dont you think he knew who he was choosing to be the new CEO? he also told tim "don't ever question yourself with 'what would steve do?'

point being, tim is doing the best he can. he's no steve jobs but who else is?

He was hand picked by a very sick dying man.

 

[ajones92]

Agreed. But prices shouldn't be so high. That's the thing, I'm not arguing Tim cooks business sense. He's making Apple a lot of money. I'm noting the changing direction of the company.

if iPhone prices halved overnight, there'd be a much greater than 2x adoption of iPhone. That's essentially what jobs did years ago. Making iPhones now would be cheaper than ever, yet prices are higher than ever. Which is fine if you are Tim Cook and stock price is all that matters. If you're Steve jobs product (and innovation) is what matters, and more people having those products

From someone who has owned every single iPhone. The price has held come down and then held every single year. You are just comparing a carrier subsidy price to a now retail price. The retail price has always existed. Blame the carriers for that not Tim Cook

 

[aconnell11]

From someone who has owned every single iPhone. The price has held come down and then held every single year. You are just comparing a carrier subsidy price to a now retail price. The retail price has always existed. Blame the carriers for that not Tim Cook

Exactly. They've made one price change 3 months after releasing the first phone 10 years ago when they were learning the market. After that it's always gone with how the carriers price/matching the general range of the competition