TimeCapsule and internet company router

MrFusion

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Jun 8, 2005
601
0
West-Europe
The phone company installed a router(?) which provides wireless and wired internet.
In another room I have a time capsule (TC) and a mac.

The Mac is now connected via the ISP wifi. If I connect the TC with a ethernet cable, I see neither the TC or the internet.

I have to use the TC HD and prefer to use it as the internet access point for all my devices (rather than the ISP router).

So what are my options for the time capsule (TC)? What can it (not) do?
Can (or should) I connect the TC to the internet via the ISP wifi and use the TC wifi for my other devices?
 

satcomer

macrumors 604
Feb 19, 2008
6,925
1,172
The Finger Lakes Region
You have to look for approved modem only devices on your ISP Support site and buy one. Make sure the modem is Dosis 3 modem! Then after the switch reset the Time Capsule to NAT (Network Address Translation).
 

techwarrior

macrumors 65816
Jul 30, 2009
1,204
458
Colorado
The phone company installed a router(?) which provides wireless and wired internet.
In another room I have a time capsule (TC) and a mac.

The Mac is now connected via the ISP wifi. If I connect the TC with a ethernet cable, I see neither the TC or the internet.

I have to use the TC HD and prefer to use it as the internet access point for all my devices (rather than the ISP router).

So what are my options for the time capsule (TC)? What can it (not) do?
Can (or should) I connect the TC to the internet via the ISP wifi and use the TC wifi for my other devices?
First, if it is possible to disable wi-fi on the ISP router, do so.

If you connect the TC to the network with default settings, it will create a routing loop and kill internet access completely.

You may need to connect to the Wi-Fi on the TC from your iOS or Mac, even though it won't offer internet access, but this will allow you to config the TC. So, power up the TC with no ethernet connection to the router. With Airport Utility, set TC up with Network > Router Mode set to Off (Bridge Mode). Configure Wi-Fi SSID and security as needed. Then, connect it to the router via Ethernet and it will get an address from the router.

Now, the TC can provide Wi-Fi signals for all of your devices without interference from the router's Wi-Fi, and it will simply act as a bridge to put Wi-Fi clients on the wired network.

The reason to disable Wi-Fi on the router is that it will tend to use the same channels as the TC and that interference may cause slowdowns and weak signal strength. If you cannot disable wireless on the router, you will need to carefully set the channels on the TC so they don't overlap with the router. Also, if the TC Wi-Fi SSID is different than the router Wi-Fi SSID, clients can choose which to connect to, ad\or "forget" the credentials for the router's Wi-Fi so they never connect to it.
 

MrFusion

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Jun 8, 2005
601
0
West-Europe
First, if it is possible to disable wi-fi on the ISP router, do so.

If you connect the TC to the network with default settings, it will create a routing loop and kill internet access completely.

You may need to connect to the Wi-Fi on the TC from your iOS or Mac, even though it won't offer internet access, but this will allow you to config the TC. So, power up the TC with no ethernet connection to the router. With Airport Utility, set TC up with Network > Router Mode set to Off (Bridge Mode). Configure Wi-Fi SSID and security as needed. Then, connect it to the router via Ethernet and it will get an address from the router.

Now, the TC can provide Wi-Fi signals for all of your devices without interference from the router's Wi-Fi, and it will simply act as a bridge to put Wi-Fi clients on the wired network.

The reason to disable Wi-Fi on the router is that it will tend to use the same channels as the TC and that interference may cause slowdowns and weak signal strength. If you cannot disable wireless on the router, you will need to carefully set the channels on the TC so they don't overlap with the router. Also, if the TC Wi-Fi SSID is different than the router Wi-Fi SSID, clients can choose which to connect to, ad\or "forget" the credentials for the router's Wi-Fi so they never connect to it.
Would this not require connecting the TC to the router by cable? Due to space limitations, they are in different rooms. A cable is not an option.
[doublepost=1490904208][/doublepost]
You have to look for approved modem only devices on your ISP Support site and buy one. Make sure the modem is Dosis 3 modem! Then after the switch reset the Time Capsule to NAT (Network Address Translation).
Yeah, the device is included in the monthly fee. Not really an option to use something else.
 

satcomer

macrumors 604
Feb 19, 2008
6,925
1,172
The Finger Lakes Region
Would this not require connecting the TC to the router by cable? Due to space limitations, they are in different rooms. A cable is not an option.
[doublepost=1490904208][/doublepost]

Yeah, the device is included in the monthly fee. Not really an option to use something else.
Did you check usable modems on your ISP's web site account? All ISP settings accounts on the ISP site support site had approved modems listed that one could buy. Then once buying your own account just call your ISP with the modem's MAC Address and once they put the Address in their servers the modem started working!
 

MrFusion

macrumors 6502a
Original poster
Jun 8, 2005
601
0
West-Europe
Did you check usable modems on your ISP's web site account? All ISP settings accounts on the ISP site support site had approved modems listed that one could buy. Then once buying your own account just call your ISP with the modem's MAC Address and once they put the Address in their servers the modem started working!
My ISP in my country (not the USA) does not provide such a list (that I could find).
 

belvdr

macrumors 603
Aug 15, 2005
5,657
1,023
No longer logging into MR
If you connect the TC to the network with default settings, it will create a routing loop and kill internet access completely.
It is not a routing loop technically speaking.

Then find a forum in your country to see if anyone used their own modem at your ISP or another and how they added it!
Sounds a bit harsh. Call the ISP to see what modems are supported.
 
Last edited:

adam9c1

macrumors 68000
May 2, 2012
1,781
287
Chicagoland
Option one: disable wifi on isp. Set in bridge mode.

Option two: use existing wifi, on time capsule disable wifi and dhcp, connect to existing network
 

techwarrior

macrumors 65816
Jul 30, 2009
1,204
458
Colorado
Would this not require connecting the TC to the router by cable? Due to space limitations, they are in different rooms. A cable is not an option.
If you can't run a cable directly, then use an Ethernet over Power or MOCA solution. Existing power lines or CATV coax can be used to run Ethernet to remote locations in the home.

Better solution is to replace the ISP provided gear with a compatible modem and only use TC as router. But, many ISP (in the US at least) are promoting their own gear for extra revenue and\or for sharing public Wi-Fi such as Comcast. So, they don't make it easy to discover the supported modems you can buy and use in lieu of paying them a rental fee for their gear.

It is not a routing loop technically speaking.
Right, but two NAT routers on the same network will try to discover each other's routes and get confused, they generally reset after so long and it continues. it can be overcome with static routes, but most consumers are not going to find that very fun to mess with.
 

belvdr

macrumors 603
Aug 15, 2005
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No longer logging into MR
Right, but two NAT routers on the same network will try to discover each other's routes and get confused, they generally reset after so long and it continues. it can be overcome with static routes, but most consumers are not going to find that very fun to mess with.
What protocol is this? I've had some misconfigured clients previously with double-NAT and it only impacted VPN connections.

I'm not aware of any router that implements dynamic routing by default.
 

satcomer

macrumors 604
Feb 19, 2008
6,925
1,172
The Finger Lakes Region
What protocol is this? I've had some misconfigured clients previously with double-NAT and it only impacted VPN connections.

I'm not aware of any router that implements dynamic routing by default.
All home routers come with DHCP already setup! Cheap routers offer no easy to turn off NAT! In my years have all kinds of routers have seen routers become dumber and dumber over the years! On Cheap router to turn of NAT is to stop the DHCP server. Most routers don't even allow users to Static routing at all!
 
Last edited:

belvdr

macrumors 603
Aug 15, 2005
5,657
1,023
No longer logging into MR
All home routers come with DHCP already setup! Cheap routers offer no eas to turn off NAT! In my yoears have all kinds of routers have seen routers become dumber and dumber over the years! On. Heap router to turn of NAT is to stop the DHCP server. Most routers don't even allow users to Static routing at all!
DHCP does not share routes between routers. It serves no purpose with dynamic routing.

If you connect a router with no WAN connection and it also serves DHCP, the worst that can happen is a dead gateway (i.e. unable to access the Internet), not a routing loop. This is the same thing that happens if your Internet connection fails. Your router is a dead gateway (cannot forward to the next hop).
 
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