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To buy the new remote, or upgrade the entire ATV 4K?

M

Mellofello808

macrumors 65816
Original poster
Mar 18, 2010
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I definitely want the new remote immediately, however I am torn on buying the new box or not. I wouldn't mind some more speed, but frustratingly they havent added many compelling reasons to upgrade.

I guess HDMI 2.1 could potentially do 4k at 4.4.4 chroma, and potentially be ready for 8k down the road, but not sure if it is worth the $100.

Anyone else debating whether to do a full upgrade, or just the remote?
 
Mellofello808 said:
I definitely want the new remote immediately, however I am torn on buying the new box or not. I wouldn't mind some more speed, but frustratingly they havent added many compelling reasons to upgrade.
Click to expand...
It’s tough because this AppleTV feels more like a long delayed 2019 product than something new and improved 2021. (A12 chip, No Spatial Audio, No Arcade focus, No U1, No remote that doubles as a game controller, No updated design Etc). So it feels like something that’s already due for an update.

For me, I’ve been waiting for an AppleTV upgrade but after 4 years of waiting then I’m just going to buy this and keep hoping that one day a real MODERN AppleTV Pro comes out.
 
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I’ll just buy the remote now, and if a better ”pro” ATV comes out i’ll move this one to the bedroom.
 
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I have the HD Apple TV and it does everything I want it to since I don't have a 4K TV. But the remote has always been a pain. So I'm definitely buying just the new remote ASAP.

If I go 4K in the next couple years, I'll just accept having an "extra" remote.
 
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Don't know what you're expecting from the new remote, but my Apple TV 3 remotes work fine with my two Apple TV HD's. I don't use the remotes that came with the ATV HD. The new remote looked cool to me and I immediately thought the same thing, until I realized how huge it is. I don't use Siri, so I'll just stick with what I have. You can still get the ATV3 remotes for $19

Apple Remote - Apple

Apple Store Search Results
www.apple.com

I might upgrade one of my ATV HD's to the new ATV after it's been on the market for awhile, just to get something faster that has (I assume) gigabit ethernet. I find the ATV HD feels even slower than my old ATV3's because of the "improved" user interface.
 
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Just for fun, I measured my old remote and photoshopped the new one next to it using images from the Apple Store, hopefully I got the scale right. It's actually not quite as large as I expected, although it appears to be much thicker.

remotes.jpg
 
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Mellofello808 said:
I definitely want the new remote immediately, however I am torn on buying the new box or not. I wouldn't mind some more speed, but frustratingly they havent added many compelling reasons to upgrade.

I guess HDMI 2.1 could potentially do 4k at 4.4.4 chroma, and potentially be ready for 8k down the road, but not sure if it is worth the $100.

Anyone else debating whether to do a full upgrade, or just the remote?
Click to expand...
Sounds like you should just get the remote.
 
Mellofello808 said:
I definitely want the new remote immediately, however I am torn on buying the new box or not. I wouldn't mind some more speed, but frustratingly they havent added many compelling reasons to upgrade.

I guess HDMI 2.1 could potentially do 4k at 4.4.4 chroma, and potentially be ready for 8k down the road, but not sure if it is worth the $100.

Anyone else debating whether to do a full upgrade, or just the remote?
Click to expand...
I'd wait a bit until people report back. The A12 could potentially enable some things that the existing ATV4k can't do (e.g. playing VP9-encoded 4K videos on Youtube), but we don't know yet if that has actually been implemented.

4K without chroma subsampling is irrelevant for video streaming, since all common consumer video formats today use 4:2:0 subsampling.
 
For me, I'm just buying the new remote. Our current ATV 4K works completely fine as we just use it to stream.

If we had other 4K TV's in the house, I'd probably buy the new ATV 4K, but the HD ATV's we have connected to our other TV's suffice as well.
 
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Would the new HDMI 2.1 port justify the upgrade? I’m already using HDMI 2.1 cables.
 
purdnost said:
Would the new HDMI 2.1 port justify the upgrade? I’m already using HDMI 2.1 cables.
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Handshaking won't change, Apple is not offering any feature that is new AFAIK yet. The A12 was likely subbed in for the A10X because of declining availability. About the same performance. Only thing teased was 4K@120 Hz but not ready.
 
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purdnost said:
Would the new HDMI 2.1 port justify the upgrade? I’m already using HDMI 2.1 cables.
Click to expand...
For a streaming box there aren't many compelling reasons to have HDMI 2.1 right now in 2021.

You can pass Atmos over HDMI 2.0, and not many things you can stream require more bandwidth than HDMI 2.0 can provide.

That being said there are things coming down the pipe like 8k, and 4k 120hz that may one day be available to stream that requires a HDMI 2.1 connection.

Those are still a bit far on the horizon, and youtube will probably be the first to enable them. Considering apple doesn't even allow youtube to do 4k HDR, and only recently even allowed 4k SDR, it will probably be a bit of a wait.
 
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Mellofello808 said:
For a streaming box there aren't many compelling reasons to have HDMI 2.1 right now in 2021.
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Yep.
Mellofello808 said:
That being said there are things coming down the pipe like 8k, and 4k 120hz that may one day be available to stream that requires a HDMI 2.1 connection.
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Just because a device has a HDMI 2.1 port doesn't mean it has to support all the maximum specs. If you go to Apple's tech specs for the new ATV, there is a footnote that says "Support for up to 4K 60-fps HDR video output". And I doubt very much that the hardware is capable of 8K output.

4K output without chroma subsampling is something that requires HDMI 2.1 bandwidth, but that would only be useful for gamers since video streams always use subsampling anyway.

One neat little feature of HDMI 2.1 is quick media switching, which (together with a compatible display) would potentially eliminate the display blanking e.g. when switching between 60 and 24 Hz. But it's not clear if Apple has implemented that.
 
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Rigby said:
Yep.

Just because a device has a HDMI 2.1 port doesn't mean it has to support all the maximum specs. If you go to Apple's tech specs for the new ATV, there is a footnote that says "Support for up to 4K 60-fps HDR video output". And I doubt very much that the hardware is capable of 8K output.

4K output without chroma subsampling is something that requires HDMI 2.1 bandwidth, but that would only be useful for gamers since video streams always use subsampling anyway.

One neat little feature of HDMI 2.1 is quick media switching, which (together with a compatible display) would potentially eliminate the display blanking e.g. when switching between 60 and 24 Hz. But it's not clear if Apple has implemented that.
Click to expand...
The chroma subsampling would be good for the UI as well. I run my ATV in SDR 4.4.4 for the cripsyness. If I had HDMI 2.1 it would be ever so slightly nicer in HDR 4.4.4.

I would be pretty surprised if the hardware couldn't playback 8k30. Snapdragon chips have been capable for a few years now, and the apple a series chips tend to have more horsepower.

It has mostly been the slow rollout of HDMI 2.1 that has been holding back the ability to play 8k, not necessarily the processing.
 
By the end of the year, I’ll have three HDMI 2.1 equipped TVs in my home. The goal will be to pick up a ATV4K-2 for each of them, starting with the first next Friday. This will allow me to move the 2 current ATV4K I have to existing 4K TVs in the house and retire a couple of ATV4HD I still have hooked up them.

We’ll see how well I like the new remote to see if it warrants upgrading any other remotes in the home. I only use the Siri Remote with three TVs right now, the other two I use Harmony remotes (RIP)
 
I have one Apple TV 4K. I want another one for second TV, which is currently using Apple TV app and AirPlay.

For now, I will be keeping the older Apple TV 4K, but I am tempted by:
  • New Apple TV 4K will be able to play 60 fps 4K and HDR (VP9 Profile 2). YouTube on older Apple TV 4K is limited to 24-30 fps 4K and SDR.
  • Thread. I have a handful of Eve HomeKit products with Thread.
  • Better frame rate and judder-free gaming (HDMI 2.1) with Apple Arcade.
 
I have decided I am just going to go ahead and buy the new ATV4k.

It will bother me I don't have the best, and will eventually cave in and buy it anyway, so might as well get it day one.
 
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austen0316 said:
With the new ATV and remote will I be able to switch inputs on my tv?
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it will work just like the old one in that regard

If your TV doesn't support HDMI-CEC, then the aTV remote will send out an IR signal to turn on the TV, but you might have to change inputs using the TV remote.

If your TV supports HDMI-CEC, then turning on the aTV will turn on the TV, and set the TV to the correct input.

Using CEC might require adjusting settings in the TV, as this feature can typically be disabled, and might have a couple options about how it responds to power commands.
CEC is available from most manufacturers, and has been around a while, so you don't necessarily need a high end TV. Most manufacturers have their own names for CEC, most of the time with "link" or "net" in the name. (list of names here)
 
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austen0316 said:
With the new ATV and remote will I be able to switch inputs on my tv?
Click to expand...
I’m planning on making the Power button learn to toggle Input. For me, thats far more useful than TV power (since TV powers off when I sleep the TV.
 
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