To switch or not to switch

[Reticuli]

Hi folks,

I own a Late 2013 Mac Pro with a 512GB SSD, D300 and 64GB (aftermarket) RAM.
I also use it alongside an OWC Thunderbay 4 mini, which has four 512GB SSDs in Raid0.

After researching my options for upgrading the internal SSD, I've become somewhat frustrated at my upgrade options.

I've been considering selling the NMP and possibly also the thunderbay - to finance a cheese grater and some upgrades.

Does this make sense? Or will I just be volunteering for further obsolescence and a machine which won't support the latest OS?

Is it likely I'll need to add much money to the sale of the NMP to finance this?

I don't know much about the UK market for the CMP.

Appreciate any advice you could give.

 

[shaunp]

I had this problem too. Sold the nMP on ebay and with the money I got from it bought a new PC - 6-core (scalable to 22 cores), 128GB RAM, 512GB PCI-e SSD. I already had a decent GPU (GTX 980 Ti) from my old PC and a load of disks and SSD's to put into the new PC. Lightroom and Photoshop work much more smoothly than they did on the PC and there's loads more RAM for my VM lab. The only thing I miss from OS X is messages and the built in calendar app. Have found alternatives (WhatsApp and Outlook).

I considered a CMP before I bought my nMP in 2013, but I thought they were obsolete then. Now, I wouldn't even dream of it. No point buying 2010 technology and paying over the odds for it, when a very powerful PC can be bought for less.

 

[pat500000]

Looking at nmp spec, you should sell it and get higher soec. After reading about mp designer who led Apple, there won't be mp.

 

[mcnallym]

If you have a Cheesegrater already then fair enough, however if you are adamant that don't want to buy a higher spec nMP then basically you should be looking at a move away from Mac period.

Presumably you NEED more performance NOW, as opposed to wanting.

It is pretty unlikely that you are going to see a return to a Tower with Slots, so either make the move now or make it later.

 

[Reticuli]

If the NMP's SSD were m.2 or other readily available slot type, I'd be 100%
Paying damned near a thousand quid for a second hand 1TB SSD which is three year old tech, kinda sucks to me.
I'd have went back to PC long ago were it not for the 500 or so pounds worth of OS X only software I'm running.

 

[Daniel Reed]

The 1TB option was reduced to $600 ($540 on edu site) when buying a nMP,
and the 1TB ssd now has 50% faster upgraded read/write speeds then when the nMP was first released (in early 2014 if we're being honest here Apple) - 1GB/s vs 1.5GB/s

The D300 cards are super gimp/junk, D700s make a huge difference.

There's also the Apple education store which is roughly a 10% discount.
Or the refurb store for 15% off, but they rarely (if ever) offer D700s with quad-cores.

Unless you want to move to Windows,
Sell your nMP(some cases they sell more on ebay then new) and buy a 4-core 12GB 1TB D700 model...
...then upgrade the CPU and RAM yourself!

You'll need to replace the crap thermal paste Apple uses to "Solve the nMP Cooling Problem" on the CPU and GPUs.
No point to pay Tax for a better CPU since you'll need to access the CPU socket anyway to apply Arctic Silver.
And $3500 + Tax for a 3 year old CPU? No Thanks Apple.

The Xeon E5 2697 v2 12-core is a beast of a CPU though
Double the ring buses, memory controllers, and cache then the 4, 6, and 8 core options!
When properly cooled, aka thermal paste "upgraded", it runs all 12 cores at 3Ghz and up to 6 cores at 3.5Ghz

OWC has a great easy-to-follow nMP CPU upgrade how-to video:

Thats what I did.
I managed on eBay to get a more recent serial pristine 2nd-hand 12-core E52697 v2 + new Apple OEM 32GB (4x8GB) ECC "black" RAM for $1,050.
If going 2nd hand be wary of ES/QS versions of Intel E5 v2 Xeons; however,
A colleague claims he got a 12-core 2.4GHz QS sample on ebay for $300 and it runs great in his nMP.

 

[OS6-OSX]

I'd have went back to PC long ago were it not for the 500 or so pounds worth of OS X only software I'm running.

A question not asked, of the Mac only software is any of it legacy? Running any 32bit apps that can't take advantage of all that ram? With "up to 1346MB/s read / 1321MB/s write RAID 0 performance", if you are into video editing the speed is there. Are you playing multiple tracks of 4K?
I'm in the same boat with the EOL'd app Shake and a host of plugins. To switch to Nuke @ $4,274 and Furnace @ $4,900 that would be $9,174. That does not included other plugins that are not made by The Foundry that I have.
All this to say, make sure you itemize your current setup and what it will take to correct the problem. If it is a Mac app that's the problem, a PC equivalent may run better if you install windows. Just boot and run that 1 app on the PC side!

 

[Reticuli]

The 1TB option was reduced to $600 ($540 on edu site) when buying a nMP,
and the 1TB ssd now has 50% faster upgraded read/write speeds then when the nMP was first released (in early 2014 if we're being honest here Apple) - 1GB/s vs 1.5GB/s

The D300 cards are super gimp/junk, D700s make a huge difference.

There's also the Apple education store which is roughly a 10% discount.
Or the refurb store for 15% off, but they rarely (if ever) offer D700s with quad-cores.

Unless you want to move to Windows,
Sell your nMP(some cases they sell more on ebay then new) and buy a 4-core 12GB 1TB D700 model...
...then upgrade the CPU and RAM yourself!

You'll need to replace the crap thermal paste Apple uses to "Solve the nMP Cooling Problem" on the CPU and GPUs.
No point to pay Tax for a better CPU since you'll need to access the CPU socket anyway to apply Arctic Silver.
And $3500 + Tax for a 3 year old CPU? No Thanks Apple.

The Xeon E5 2697 v2 12-core is a beast of a CPU though
Double the ring buses, memory controllers, and cache then the 4, 6, and 8 core options!
When properly cooled, aka thermal paste "upgraded", it runs all 12 cores at 3Ghz and up to 6 cores at 3.5Ghz

OWC has a great easy-to-follow nMP CPU upgrade how-to video:

Thats what I did.
I managed on eBay to get a more recent serial pristine 2nd-hand 12-core E52697 v2 + new Apple OEM 32GB (4x8GB) ECC "black" RAM for $1,050.
If going 2nd hand be wary of ES/QS versions of Intel E5 v2 Xeons; however,
A colleague claims he got a 12-core 2.4GHz QS sample on ebay for $300 and it runs great in his nMP.

Thanks for the advice mate - very detailed.
At the moment storage is the only area in which I'm noticeably lacking. I'll keep an eye out for 1TB SSD blades on ebay. It is rather frustrating this component lock-in - the cost of these SSDs could easily buy 1TB of the latest NVME tech. But it is what it is.

As regards buy-and-upgrade or CPU replacement, I'm not quite there yet. I've a year of AppleCare left and don't wanna screw with my warranty. End of Jan 2018 I'll be considering picking up one of those Xeons on ebay and doing a replacement / thermal paste replacement as you suggest.

 

[Daniel Reed]

Thanks for the advice mate - very detailed.
At the moment storage is the only area in which I'm noticeably lacking. I'll keep an eye out for 1TB SSD blades on ebay.

That's what I tried to do, but couldn't find the newer model 1TB blades for less then $1500 on eBay.

 

[William Payne]

I just recently got a mac pro 4,1 and I must say I checked, checked, and checked again about whether it was a good idea. I determined it was as the upgradability is there. Companies like create pro in england and Other World computing are doing great things. Also Angelbirds with their trim supporting ssd drives.

Example look at the specs options these guys are offering, sure no thunderbolt but hey that is a compromise.

https://create.pro/configure

For me it was a factor of I could not afford a 6,1. The 4,1 came up at a really really good price (Less then I would pay for a cpu and motherboard for a custom xeon pc build) I grabbed it.

I also really like the fact that I will be able to run sierra with the 5,1 firmware update. That's cool as sure PC is always an option but I really wanted to get away from windows.

What really matters though is what is best for you and your needs.

 

[Reticuli]

That's what I tried to do, but couldn't find the newer model 1TB blades for less then $1500 on eBay.

That really is an unforgivable situation. Apple's "appliancification" of the Mac Pro is responsible for this.

 

[William Payne]

Would this help you in any way? I am not hugely familiar with the inner workings of the trash can model.

https://eshop.macsales.com/shop/ssd/owc/mac-pro/2013