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TRIM support?
- Thread starter Geirm92
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It looks like OS X supports TRIM, but still says that my SSD doesn't support it. How stupid is that?
Anyone else noticed this?
apple: MacBookPro5,3)
OSX does not support TRIM.
Since I don't read/write that language I can't see what it says, but OSX doesn't have TRIM support AFAIK yet, however OCZ's Vertex I and II series do support it.
Obviously. However in his original post he said his SSD does not support it, I was correcting him. From what I found on several Apple support forums there are no Snow Leopard updates for TRIM support planned, maybe it'll be there for Lion though.
The listing you see comes from the firmware in the device, not OSX. Negotiated bus speeds are listed, but those come from the device as well. So yes, to all you TRIM believers, most of the SSD's on the market support the Windows 7 needed TRIM --- your Mac just doesn't need it.
All the Windows peecees out there also have the little "window" key on their keyboards, do you want that too?
When you read the relevant discussions on MacRumors, you will see many recommendations for SSD drives with the "Sandforce" controller. SSD drives work differently than normal hard disk drives and that causes performance problems when writing small blocks of data. One way to get round this is TRIM support in the drive and the OS (basically, the OS can tell the drive when data has been deleted, so the drive knows that the data is not needed anymore). Another way is to have a really, really clever controller, like the Sandforce controller. And it seems to do fine with an OS that doesn't support TRIM.
So there is an order in speed: Not so clever controller without TRIM is slowest, not so clever controller with TRIM is better, and the Sandforce controller with or without TRIM seems to be best.
Myself I think that for the near future we will see hybrid drives with maybe 16 GB SSD plus 1 TB rotating disk, so you get the size and almost the price of hard disk drive with almost the speed of SSD, and for such a combination TRIM is completely irrelevant.
It looks like OS X supports TRIM, but still says that my SSD doesn't support it. How stupid is that?
Anyone else noticed this?
Here is a much more stupid fact: That same system-profiler screen says on the new MacBook Airs (which come ONLY with SSD's) that the storage item used is "Harddrive" not a "SSD" (which it shows if you have a third-party ssd)
Empirical evidence (i.e. me with a 160GB Intel 34nm SSD) on a MBP shows that after a year my system is significantly slower. A quick benchmark corroborates this. Yes, OS X needs TRIM :-s
Truly empiracal evidence with MY OSC Vertex 250GB: (from XBench)
Day I bought it: 228.53
1 Month Later: 232.74
6 Month Later: 253.23
14 Months Later: 238.42
Trim is an algorithm developed specifically to give Microsoft a common API call to the hard drive to support cleaning. Your Intel (like my OCZ) should be doing it's own garbage collection, achieving the same result.
Since when has TRIM been Microsoft specific?
I thought one of TRIM's main purposes was to help wear-levelling and to work in conjunction with garbage collection.
Without it, doesn't the SSD run the risk of having some cells written to a massive amount of times, and others barely used?
I thought one of TRIM's main purposes was to help wear-levelling and to work in conjunction with garbage collection.
Without it, doesn't the SSD run the risk of having some cells written to a massive amount of times, and others barely used?
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Mostly Garbage collection is Sand Force specific however this thread was made last year invade you guys didn't notice ...
mac8867 said:
Mostly Garbage collection is Sand Force specific however this thread was made last year invade you guys didn't notice ...
Yes, I did notice... di you notice I was one of the original participants? Do you not believe the forum allows for threads, especially ones that discuss long term performance, to be posted and discussed over time?
I don't know if you've seen this or not.... but there have been people who've gotten trim supported in snow leopard.
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1125400/
It works great!
I've got TRIM supported on a 64gb samsung ssd in a 2007 macbook pro, as well as a 40gb in a 2006 mac mini.
https://forums.macrumors.com/threads/1125400/
It works great!
I've got TRIM supported on a 64gb samsung ssd in a 2007 macbook pro, as well as a 40gb in a 2006 mac mini.