Carrier Understanding ESN & "Bad ESN" on iPhone

Discussion in 'iPhone' started by kell1831, Oct 27, 2014.

  1. kell1831 macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2012
    #1
    I'm wanting to buy an iPhone 6 or 5s from EB or CL for use abroad, and need help understanding the technical side of "Bad ESN".

    • Is "Bad ESN" only where the ESN (or IMEI) is black-listed as stolen/lost/account not paid with the provider, or does it include something more?
    • If so, does this mean that using the phone outside of the US would have no problem?
    • Is there any difference between a "Bad ESN" Sprint iPhone, Verizon iPhone, or T-Mobile iPhone??

    I live in the Middle East and will be only using this phone outside of the US, so I'm thinking this may be a ticket to a cheaper phone. (Also, I'm aware that the phone cannot be associated with an iCloud account.)

    Any advice appreciated. :)
    Any personal testimonies also appreciated! :D
     
  2. imnjs macrumors member

    imnjs

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2014
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    #2
    Bad ESN basically means the phone is a paperweight, no matter the carrier. And now that carriers are sharing lists, even with international carriers, the phone wouldn't be able to be used anywhere.
     
  3. Applejuiced macrumors Westmere

    Applejuiced

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2008
    Location:
    At the iPhone hacks section.
    #3
    That is false.
    It would be useless only inside the U.S.
    The rest of your assumptions are inaccurate.
     
  4. 617aircav Suspended

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2012
    #4

    This. I've used a bad Esn iphone 5 in the UK.
     
  5. imnjs macrumors member

    imnjs

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2014
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    #5

    My apologies, I was thinking of IMEI not ESN.
     
  6. Applejuiced macrumors Westmere

    Applejuiced

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2008
    Location:
    At the iPhone hacks section.
    #6
    Same thing.
    U.S. carriers don't share imei lists with every international carrier. They only have a U.S. agreement between domestic US providers.
    Amazed how people come up with no clue and post things with certainty that are completely false.
     
  7. imnjs macrumors member

    imnjs

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2014
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    #7

    http://www.gsma.com/technicalprojects/fraud-security/imei-database

    Quit being ignorant.
     
  8. Learylvr. macrumors regular

    Learylvr.

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2011
    #8
    Applejuiced, I was wondering the same thing.

    ----------


    If you had been a member of Macrumors for any length of time, you'd know Applejuiced is one of the most knowledgable people on this forum when it comes to IPhones . Maybe it's better if you sit back and learn.
     
  9. Applejuiced macrumors Westmere

    Applejuiced

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2008
    Location:
    At the iPhone hacks section.
    #9
    Link to whatever site you want.
    What you're posting is false and yes blacklisted US imei iPhones work fine on every international gsm carrier out there including Canadian carriers.
    Me and many others know first hand that what you claim is wrong.
     
  10. imnjs macrumors member

    imnjs

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2014
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    #10
    This doesn't pertain to just iPhones. But I'm sure he appreciates you keeping his bum clean.

    The international black list is real. Whether companies decide to utilize it is up to them. All they would have to do is one search to find that the number is bad and block it. This information is not wrong. To say openly that a device with a bad IMEI can be easily used overseas when the GSMA is clearly trying to encourage the usage of the global list ultimately makes that device able to be cut at any time.

    It doesn't take 5,000,000 forum posts to not understand that.
     
  11. Applejuiced macrumors Westmere

    Applejuiced

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2008
    Location:
    At the iPhone hacks section.
    #11
    U.S. carriers do not utilize it and many international ones don't either. US carriers just recently started utilizing one that is only between US domestic boundaries only.
    What you were suggesting that a blacklisted US Phone is paperweight is completely false no matter how much you try to back peddle or search on Google for something that backs up your false guess earlier.
     
  12. imnjs macrumors member

    imnjs

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2014
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    #12
    Understanding ESN & "Bad ESN" on iPhone

    I'm not going to argue with someone too stubborn to get off his high horse.

    I'll admit that telling the OP it won't work was presumptuous, as it will work in the meantime.

    It is already fact that US carriers as well as European carriers (among other countries) under the GSMA have collaborated in support of global blacklists. While it may be weak and under-utilized at this point, it's bound to happen. The facts are there, and the system is in place.

    EDIT: http://www.digitaltrends.com/mobile/stolen-phone-database-running-says-ctia/
     
  13. Applejuiced macrumors Westmere

    Applejuiced

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2008
    Location:
    At the iPhone hacks section.
    #13
    It's not being stubborn is about being false or correct about our statements and telling someone what your guess or what you would like it to be a certain way doesn't make it right.
    It's a good idea but that's where it ends and far from being reality for now.
    Know your facts before you claim something in a public forum with thousands of views.
    Or just admit you were mistaken and end it there without trying to keep arguing over it.
     
  14. imnjs macrumors member

    imnjs

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2014
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    #14

    I understand, but from a moral standpoint shouldn't we also be telling people that there is potential risk in doing this instead of saying it will be completely fine? It's like a ticking time bomb, and the "far from being a reality" is purely an assumption.
     
  15. Learylvr. macrumors regular

    Learylvr.

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2011
    #15
    Understanding ESN & "Bad ESN" on iPhone


    You know that's real mature... Bum clean, lol. I've been a member since 2011 or so and I've never once been such a tool to someone in this forum. You sir win the
    Jack### prize of the day. I understand what you read... But you are still incorrect .

    The phones as of today.. Still work in countries out of the U.S. before you reply with another snarky remark. I have 2 people that I know of in my work circle , that have bad ESN phones, one traveled to Ireland the other to London... In the last week... And both of their phones are working.

    Get over yourself
     
  16. Applejuiced macrumors Westmere

    Applejuiced

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2008
    Location:
    At the iPhone hacks section.
    #16
    Moral standpoint yes but lying to them or making things up is not moral either.
    I agree that there should be more done but I feel somewhat comfortable with iCloud lock.
    This way nobody can ship my phone out of the U.S. and use it.
     
  17. imnjs macrumors member

    imnjs

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2014
    Location:
    Dallas, TX
    #17

    You came into a thread and minded me that a user here has good knowledge of an iPhone and provided no input to the topic.

    I do appreciate the name calling though. Feel better?

    ----------


    Yeah, the iCloud lock is nice. I also fully support a global blacklist, but even then it all comes down to politics and foreign relations. Even if it did go into effect countries like Russia and China would probably want nothing to do with it. But that's for another topic.

    OP, I apologize for stating wrong info. Just know that these things are a work in progress, and your phone might not work forever.
     
  18. Applejuiced macrumors Westmere

    Applejuiced

    Joined:
    Apr 16, 2008
    Location:
    At the iPhone hacks section.
    #18
    I hear you.
    I too like the idea and hope it takes off more in the future.
    But instead of depending on carriers to do all this added work to chase and verify devices at least governments are making the device manufacturer from now on to provide a kill switch to the customer directly.
    I think that would end up being more effective with androids and iPhones having that added security built in and available to the user.
     
  19. Learylvr. macrumors regular

    Learylvr.

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2011
    #19
    Interesting, hmmm.. I believe you were the one that started name calling.. Keeping his bum clean ??? No, that's not name calling.., maybe it's past your bed time . I'm done feeding you... Sleep well, nighty night.
     
  20. kell1831 thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2012
    #20
    Thanks for all this info. It's helpful to read.

    AppleJuiced -- can you clarify what the difference between "unlocked" and "bad ESN" is? How can I know that a iPhone I'm buying merely has a bad ESN, but is successfully unlocked for another carrier?
     
  21. CEmajr macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2012
    Location:
    Charlotte, NC
    #21
    Just to chime in and agree that Applejuiced is correct on this matter. Currently a bad ESN or IMEI smartphone from the U.S. is still usable in other countries. OP is fine buying one if he intends to use it in another country. It will work fine as long as it's unlocked.
     
  22. 617aircav Suspended

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2012
    #22
    I will never support a global blacklist just by looking how T-Mobile is abusing it.
     
  23. kell1831 thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2012
    #23
    Thanks for your help! :D


    Wouldn't it be impossible to unlock a phone from the carrier when it has a Bad ESN because to call the carrier to unlock it, they would immediately notice the Bad ESN and refuse?

    Also, I've heard T-Mobile started locking their iPhone 6 phones to their carrier, so buying a Bad ESN T-Mobile would also be fruitless for international use...

    Am I understanding this right?
     
  24. CEmajr macrumors 601

    Joined:
    Dec 18, 2012
    Location:
    Charlotte, NC
    #24
    Yes the carrier won't unlock a bad ESN or IMEI phone. You would have to find a third party unlock online to get it unlocked.
     
  25. kell1831 thread starter macrumors newbie

    Joined:
    Mar 12, 2012
    #25
    Thanks CEmajr. Would a third party unlock site generally be able to unlock a phone even with a bad esn?? I couldn't find anything regarding this on their site. It's the first time I've tried a third party site, and I'm a bit nervous. Is this pretty risky?




    (I'm looking at cellunlocker.net and stock unlocks.com - for example)
     

Share This Page