'Unprecedented' Warrant Request Sought to Compel Individuals to Open Fingerprint-Locked Devices

Discussion in 'Politics, Religion, Social Issues' started by MacRumors, Oct 17, 2016.

  1. MacRumors macrumors bot

    MacRumors

    Joined:
    Apr 12, 2001
    #1
    [​IMG]


    In a new case that echoes Apple's past struggle with the FBI, the Department of Justice has been granted a warrant to search a home in Lancaster, California -- and all the smartphones inside of it -- for all "passwords, encryption keys, and other access devices that may be necessary to access" the various handsets and tablets discovered inside the location. Notably, this includes requiring every person inside the home to provide their fingerprints to the cops to bypass the biometric scanners of each device (via Forbes).

    Filed May 9, 2016, a section of the warrant reads:
    An anonymous person located at the home in question avoided providing details of the crime in question, but they did indicate that the warrant has been served. The person claimed that they did not know about the specifics of the warrant's parameters until it was served to them, and they are "trying to let this pass over" in the meantime.

    [​IMG]

    The case has been said to "shock" legal experts because of the legalese workaround used in the warrant. According to one expert, the government filed the warrant "on the assumption that they will learn more after they have a warrant," without providing any particulars as to what they plan to find at the home in question. This practice goes against the confines and scopes of usual warrants, and was seemingly an attempt to quietly include fingerprint data in the seizure of information.
    Lynch noted that "we've never seen anything like this," with the government's court filing revealing the first known attempt by the Department of Justice to acquire fingerprints of individuals in a certain location to unlock their smartphones. Lynch said that the filing cites "outdated cases" as the justification for bypassing self-incrimination laws to ultimately use a person's "body as evidence when it may be material."
    Most recently, it was reported that the FBI was looking into "legal and technical options" for entering another iPhone, this one belonging to the culprit behind the Minnesota mall stabbings in September. The iOS version running on the iPhone is known only to the FBI, so if it's an older model (iOS 8 or prior) the government could potentially access it without the same drama that emerged following its request for Apple to unlock the San Bernardino shooter's iPhone earlier in the year.

    Note: Due to the political nature of the discussion regarding this topic, the discussion thread is located in our Politics, Religion, Social Issues forum. All forum members and site visitors are welcome to read and follow the thread, but posting is limited to forum members with at least 100 posts.

    Article Link: 'Unprecedented' Warrant Request Sought to Compel Individuals to Open Fingerprint-Locked Devices
     
  2. DrewDaHilp1 macrumors 6502a

    DrewDaHilp1

    Joined:
    Mar 29, 2009
    Location:
    All Your Memes Are Belong to US
    #2
    I thought this was already settled. It's similar as a forced(warrant) blood draw, normal fingerprinting.
     
  3. garirry macrumors 68000

    garirry

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2013
    Location:
    Canada is my city
  4. zorinlynx macrumors 601

    zorinlynx

    Joined:
    May 31, 2007
    Location:
    Florida, USA
    #4
    I'm not sure how any of this will help as the TouchID usage window will surely have expired before they can use the prints.
     
  5. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2013
    Location:
    Criminal Mexi Midget
    #5
    only criminals have something to hide................................./S
     
  6. keysofanxiety macrumors 604

    keysofanxiety

    Joined:
    Nov 23, 2011
    #6
    You asked for miracles Theo, I give you the F... B... I.

    Screen Shot 2016-10-17 at 17.57.43.png
     
  7. Mac Fly (film) macrumors 65816

    Mac Fly (film)

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2006
    Location:
    Ireland
  8. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

    Joined:
    May 18, 2008
    Location:
    Hartford, CT
    #8
    What?

    They got a warrant to search a home, and in the warrant asserted they have the right to just find anything and look after the fact for evidence. That is fundamentally counter to how warrants are supposed to work.

    There's no similarity here. This is a general warrant, the exact type of thing that lead to the Revolution in the first place.
     
  9. nt5672 macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Jun 30, 2007
    #9
    This will never end unless people get wise and start standing up now. The first thing to do is to always vote to remove government power. New taxes, vote no, it does not matter how good intentioned they are. Incumbents, vote no, it does not matter what you think of them. The problems now are bigger than any one candidate, its the system and the corruption. Every day that goes by will make it harder to reverse.
     
  10. jkcerda macrumors 6502

    jkcerda

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2013
    Location:
    Criminal Mexi Midget
    #10
    if you don't like being treated like a criminal STOP hanging around them. how DARE you question the GOVT? I am turning your post over to them, if you see something /say something, hope they send me that SS arm band after turning you in..........


    /S.
     
  11. usarioclave macrumors 65816

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2003
    #11
    It shows how lazy law enforcement is getting. In the old days they'd just bug the house. Now they're like "well, let's just grab all the stuff off their phones and we'll find a crime later."
     
  12. jettredmont macrumors 68030

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2002
    #12
    It is not settled. There are conflicting rulings on the matter, but we aren't even dealing with the questionable area of case law in this case: in this case the warrant very explicitly goes against hundreds of years of case law.

    Blood draws and normal fingerprinting are for identification of the individual and correlation with evidence found on the scene. The warrant for these is prima facie narrow and defined. A forced press of a fingerprint on a device - or even more directly forcing the user to unlock their device - is a search of a new locality and must be accompanied by narrow and defined expectations of what can be found: this is the thing that is alarming about this case.

    Now, if the locality in question has a legitimate warrant against it then we get into the gray area about what a person can be specifically compelled to do to unlock it. Passwords are generally oddly considered speech, and can not be compelled, while fingerprints are generally oddly considered keys, which production can be compelled. The problem is that neither end really fits, and the distinction between a passcode and a key is arbitrary.

    Again, though, we aren't there in this case, as reported here. There is no legitimate - by prior case law standards - warrant for the contents of these phones. The presence of a phone at a location does not inveigh suspicion on the contents of the phone. However, if this warrant is allowed to stand suddenly there is a precedent, which allows a warrant to be issued for all phones at any site of criminal activity etc. Not a good precedent to set, hence the EFF being on the case.
     
  13. thatanonymoususer macrumors regular

    thatanonymoususer

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2015
    #13
    And now both major candidates don't care about personal privacy. Clinton with her "Manhattan-like project" to break encryption, and Trump with his boycott Apple until they betray customers. I miss Bernie and his view on personal freedoms.
     
  14. mobilehaathi macrumors G3

    mobilehaathi

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2008
    Location:
    The Anthropocene
    #14
    They're quite fashionable these days. ;)
     
  15. rshrugged macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2015
    #15
    Not quite, if you're referring to the writ of assistance. Those writs didn't specify the location to be searched.
     
  16. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

    Joined:
    May 18, 2008
    Location:
    Hartford, CT
    #16
    From my understanding they are two separate but similar terms.
     
  17. shareef777 macrumors 68020

    shareef777

    Joined:
    Jul 26, 2005
    Location:
    Chicago, IL
    #17
    That's when I just use the wrong finger five times and tell them to F off.
     
  18. Zedcars macrumors 6502

    Zedcars

    Joined:
    Apr 5, 2010
    Location:
    Brighton, UK
    #18
    You missed a trick there...could have said:

    That's when I just use the wrong finger five times and then give them the finger! lol
     
  19. rshrugged macrumors 6502a

    Joined:
    Oct 11, 2015
    #19
    Hmm. Not sure about that.

    BTW, apologies if my post came across as rudely pedantic. It wasn't meant that way. I should've prefaced it with 'As a point of information --" I'm currently reading a book series set during the Revolutionary period.
     
  20. miknos Suspended

    miknos

    Joined:
    Mar 14, 2008
    #20
    Good luck getting my fingerprint. I use my feet to login into my iPhone. Same for my door.

    I just remove my boot and put my big toe in the door to open. It's difficult and embarrassing when I bring dates to my place, specially when I'm drunk. I have a clever move. When I'm falling, I grab both boobs.

    Can't remember the context but I gotta go. My boss is harassing me. That idiot wants me working. Jeez
     
  21. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

    Joined:
    May 18, 2008
    Location:
    Hartford, CT
    #21
    To be honest I don't know if "general warrants" has become the short hand term for what you're describing.

    Either way, the FBI continues to be exposed for the sleazy operation it is more and more each day. Remember, this is the most public pseudo intelligence agency we've got, that was constantly held up as being the "by the book" guys compared to the more unsavory agencies (NSA, CIA, etc.).
     
  22. iamgalt macrumors regular

    iamgalt

    Joined:
    Jul 25, 2012
    #22
    Gary Johnson's views on personal freedoms are pretty good. I'm not feeling the Bern; I'm feeling my Johnson.
     
  23. NT1440 macrumors G4

    NT1440

    Joined:
    May 18, 2008
    Location:
    Hartford, CT
    #23
    Gary Johnson's idea of personal freedoms go as far as your own personal bank account do. Libertarianism, at the end of the day, is a more entrenched version of feudalism than even the corporate capitalism we have today.
     
  24. macduke Suspended

    macduke

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2007
    Location:
    Central U.S.
    #24
    Holy crap!

    I'm known for long-winded posts but I'm at a loss for words.
     
  25. thatanonymoususer macrumors regular

    thatanonymoususer

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2015
    #25
    I'm not really impressed with him though. He's shown a few times that he doesn't have much knowledge about international politics with Aleppo and not being able to name a foreign leader.

    He's good on freedoms - yes, but with no regard to the exploitative nature of unregulated capitalism.
     

Share This Page