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Updating to Tiger versus Updating to XP

I've done a windows ME (verry verry horribe OS) to windows Xp.. and it worked fine.. the first time i had to do it..it did take prob close to 2.5 hrs.. but everything worked fine (no wireless stuff or anything)

i wil be reinstalling mac osx this summer..lol, i am going to ask tho..do you need to repair permissions or w.e. b4 reinstalling? or can i just install the disk that came with my pb.. and will it give me an option just to erase and install?
 
the only difficulty i had was converting it from like a FAT to a NFSC file or something..and it wasn't that user friendly.. if i was a 60 years old having very little experiance with comps..i woulda been lost! :p
 
i4k20c said:
i wil be reinstalling mac osx this summer..lol, i am going to ask tho..do you need to repair permissions or w.e. b4 reinstalling? or can i just install the disk that came with my pb.. and will it give me an option just to erase and install?
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Yes, it will give you that option -- when you first start the process after booting the disc, one of the first screens has an options button in the lower left, I think. That leads to options like Erase and Install. If that's what you want to do, there is no need to repair permissions beforehand.

The toughest thing with OS X installs is getting the computer to boot off a DVD ... on some models this is a little tricky, because not all of the options to do this seem to work in all cases. The most reliable method, as far as I have seen, is to put the DVD in the drive while the computer is booted, and go to Sys Prefs -> Startup Disc, and enable it as the startup disc / reboot from there. This pretty much always works.

But the OS X install is very easy; unless you have special non-Apple hardware, everything is pretty much automatic. :)
 
i4k20c said:
the only difficulty i had was converting it from like a FAT to a NFSC file or something..and it wasn't that user friendly.. if i was a 60 years old having very little experiance with comps..i woulda been lost! :p
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NTFS. :rolleyes: It's the name of the file system used. The FAT file system is very old (circa 1977) It stands for File Allocation Table, and you can find out about it here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File_Allocation_Table. NTFS is slightly newer then that. It's stands for Newer Technology File System, you can learn way more then you ever wanted to about it here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTFS. The Mac uses a filesystem called HFS, which stands for Hierarchical File System (This is obviously the best one, because it's a Mac). You can find info on it here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hierarchical_File_System. And just so that you're inhead of the game, Windows Vista will ship with a new file system called WinFS, which stands for Windows Future System. And you can find more information on it here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winfs.
 
Randall said:
NTFS. :rolleyes: It's the name of the file system used. The FAT file system is very old (circa 1977) It stands for File Allocation Table, and you can find out about it here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File_Allocation_Table. NTFS is slightly newer then that. It's stands for Newer Technology File System, you can learn way more then you ever wanted to about it here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NTFS. The Mac uses a filesystem called HFS, which stands for Hierarchical File System (This is obviously the best one, because it's a Mac). You can find info on it here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hierarchical_File_System. And just so that you're inhead of the game, Windows Vista will ship with a new file system called WinFS, which stands for Windows Future System. And you can find more information on it here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winfs.
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thank u, i didn't need to or want to read all that, but thanks newais.. i was just making a point that it really isnt as hard as stated.. n jus saying that was the only hard part...ggeeez didnt mean to offend ne1.
 
Most people who work with Windows regularly will tell you that upgrading is usually a disaster in the making. A clean install is the best option. I've installed 98, 2000, and XP countless times without any issues. I've never performed an upgrade and never would.

When I got my Mac (dual 2.5GHz G5) in September, it came with Panther pre-installed. I did a clean installation of Tiger, and it was definitely the smoothest OS install I've ever done. However, when you're dealing with a much smaller amount of supported hardware and software, that's to be expected.

Overall, I have a positive opinion of OS X, but I'd classify it as merely different rather than superior when compared to XP from a UI perspective. Some things it does better, some things it does worse. The interface isn't consistent from app to app (some stay open when their window is closed, some close completely), Finder is a dumbed-down version of Windows Explorer (no folder tree?), and the application list under the apple menu has been replaced by the Dock, which is just about the dumbest interface element in the whole OS. Not much different than a Windows toolbar really. A folder placed on the Dock with aliases to every app brought the lost apple menu functionality back though.

I do like the application management in OS X. Drag and drop to install, drag and drop to uninstall. But even that's not consistent from app to app (packages anyone?). I've also found that non-package based apps sometimes leave files and folders here and there also. To me, that's not uninstalled. This is minor compared to Windows' registry and DLL nightmares, so the win definitely goes to OS X on this point.

And just what is repairing permissions all about? I see it all over the place and it seems to be one of those quick fix suggestions as soon as something goes wrong. Doesn't seem to be a very user friendly requirement to me.

I'll probably get death threats for this one, but I also find OS X's window management inferior to Windows. I much prefer the taskbar in XP; I know exactly what applications I have open and how many windows of each. In OS X, the Dock tells me what apps are running, but I need to rely on Exposé to determine what windows are open and how many. I've also found that clicking within an application's window and typing isn't always enough to change focus to that app. I'll go to the window menu and find that it's still focused on the previous app.

The most surprising thing to me is that a dual 2.5GHz G5 feels sluggish and unresponsive when compared to my 3-year-old 2.6GHz P4 PC with less RAM and a much less powerful graphics card (9600XT in the PC vs a 6800 Ultra in the G5). Mouse movement is slow and clumsy on my Mac, alleviated to a great extent thanks to USB Overdrive, but not completely. Window resizing is clumsy (bottom right corner only) and it trails behind the mouse cursor. Don't even get me started on the beachball and the revving case fans that sound like a 747 getting ready for takeoff. Sometimes all it takes is a Flash intro on a web site to get them going.

The G5 is a nice machine, but it's up on ebay right now. I would've posted it in the marketplace but I'm nowhere near 100 posts.
 
i4k20c said:
thank u, i didn't need to or want to read all that, but thanks newais.. i was just making a point that it really isnt as hard as stated.. n jus saying that was the only hard part...ggeeez didnt mean to offend ne1.
Click to expand...
Naw you didn't offend anyone, I hope I didn't offend you with my response (wasn't intending to). You're right that converting the filesystem isn't exactly user friendly. BTW you should always use NTFS at the moment for Windows, as you can fit more files on your hard disc that way. One of the saddest things I see out there in Windows XP land is the new computer with a large hard disk formatted as a single FAT32 partition. FAT32 was available with Windows 95/98 and is an unreliable file system that just doesn't have the features and robust stability of the NT File System (NTFS). For those of us in the know, if you are currently using a FAT partition and would like to reformat it to NTFS, then you can try this command from the Command Prompt.

1. Click Start and then click the Run command.
2. In the Run dialog box, type cmd in the Open text box. Click OK.
3. At the command prompt type
Code: 
convert C: /FS:NTFS /V /X
(replace the 'C:' with the letter of the drive you want to convert to NTFS. After typing in the command press [ENTER].
4. You'll be asked for the Volume Label. Most drives don't have volume labels, but you can find the label by right clicking on your drive letter in the Windows Explorer and clicking the Properties command. On the General Tab you'll see a text box at the top. If there's nothing in there, you have no volume label. If there is something in there, that's your volume label. It might take awhile if you have a lot of files on the drive, so be patient. You’ll be informed when the process is done.

After the drive is converted to NTFS, you can compress files. Your system will end up being a lot more stable and you're less likely to lose your work.
 
thirdkind said:
Overall, I have a positive opinion of OS X, but I'd classify it as merely different rather than superior when compared to XP from a UI perspective. Some things it does better, some things it does worse. The interface isn't consistent from app to app (some stay open when their window is closed, some close completely), Finder is a dumbed-down version of Windows Explorer (no folder tree?), and the application list under the apple menu has been replaced by the Dock, which is just about the dumbest interface element in the whole OS. Not much different than a Windows toolbar really. A folder placed on the Dock with aliases to every app brought the lost apple menu functionality back though.
Click to expand...
This is a good point. I consider OS X to be superior because of the eye candy, but more importantly the UNIX core. Also, while we're talking about inconsistencies in the Operating System, I've got an annoying one. And that is the different user interface when using Aqua vs. Brushed Metal (or is it 'Solid' Metal now via iTunes 6?). Case and point, you can move a Metal window by clicking anywhere and dragging, but with Aqua, you have to click on the window title to move it. It's the little inconsistencies like this that prevent OS X from being a perfect OS. It's darn close to prefect though, don't get me wrong. ;)
 
thirdkind said:
When I got my Mac (dual 2.5GHz G5) in September, it came with Panther pre-installed. I did a clean installation of Tiger, and it was definitely the smoothest OS install I've ever done. However, when you're dealing with a much smaller amount of supported hardware and software, that's to be expected.
Click to expand...

And the really great thing about this clean install is that it was totally unnecessary.
 
mkrishnan said:
I so didn't see this part of the conversation coming. :eek: :eek: :D
Click to expand...

I did.

We all carry baggage from previous experience. As a Windows user, I know a clean install is the best course of action. As a new Mac user, I didn't know for sure, so I took the safe route. My G5 was fresh out of the box, so a clean install cost me nothing but a little bit of time; no backups necessary. Besides, I'd hung out here for a little while before purchasing my Mac, and with some users having problems after simple updates (or, as we call them without euphemism in the Windows world, patches ;)), I figured the same trouble could befall a complete OS upgrade.

I've seen just as many posts from Mac users that revolve entirely around Windows misconceptions as I have posts from Windows users who bash Macs. There are completely clueless people on both sides of the fence. I'm sure the people who frequent this forum also frequent places where the general public, being largely composed of Windows users, post totally off-base information about Macs. I joined this forum as a new Mac user to get advice and information, and some of the stuff I read here about Windows borders on mildly retarded.

Unfortunately, most Mac users' encounters with Windows involve corporate machines that are overburdened with garbage installed by the IT staff or pre-built home machines overburdened with garbage installed by the vendor. If the vendors built their machines like enthusiasts do--quality parts, clean Windows installations, and resource-friendly antivirus solutions (sadly, a necessity in the Windows world)--Windows wouldn't have the horrible reputation it does. My installation of XP on a 3-year-old 2.6GHz P4, with constant patching and software installations/removals, is as fast as it was the day I installed it and has locked up maybe three times total (which is as many times as OS X has required a hard restart in the last three months, incidentally).

People who've used Windows all their lives shouldn't criticize Macs. People who've used Macs all their lives shouldn't criticize Windows. Neither group knows much about the other OS.
 
thirdkind said:
I did.
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Was your tirade directed at me? First, I did expect it...sorry my sarcasm was unclear. We've had this discussion at MR at least a dozen times in the two years I've been here. And I think that what can be said about it has been said about it. I'm not sure why I deserve your lecture.

And for that matter, I don't belong to either of your categories...I bought my first Mac two years ago, and before that used Windows in various incarnations, and Amigas and Commodore hardware before that.... I still use Windows now at work.
 
Okay, okay, I take responsibility for this. I'll admit I'm a bit of an obsessed opponent of clean installs of OSX. I'm sure a some people are getting tired of hearing about it, but whenever a new Mac user comes along talking about reinstalling OSX on a brand new Mac, then I'm sorry, I just can't help myself.

I know, I should try harder. In the new year, I promise I will. So I have just one more week to exercise my obsession, and I hope to make the best of it. ;)
 
IJ Reilly said:
I know, I should try harder. In the new year, I promise I will. So I have just one more week to exercise my obsession, and I hope to make the best of it. ;)
Click to expand...

As my Christmas present to you, I'll back off and let you enjoy it. :) And maybe even encourage it inappropriately every now and then. ;)
 
mkrishnan said:
Was your tirade directed at me? First, I did expect it...sorry my sarcasm was unclear. We've had this discussion at MR at least a dozen times in the two years I've been here. And I think that what can be said about it has been said about it. I'm not sure why I deserve your lecture.
Click to expand...

I don't recall writing a tirade or a lecture. Seems pretty even-handed to me.

I did get your sarcasm.
 
Whenever you upgrade Windows or Mac to the next version, you are bound to run into problems - especially Windows, since the Mac updates (almost yearly) are pretty much the same whereas Windows (two, three, FIVE years) have major differences. Its best to do a clean install unless you are really good with Windows/Mac.
 
dotdotdot said:
Whenever you upgrade Windows or Mac to the next version, you are bound to run into problems - especially Windows, since the Mac updates (almost yearly) are pretty much the same whereas Windows (two, three, FIVE years) have major differences. Its best to do a clean install unless you are really good with Windows/Mac.
Click to expand...

More red meat. ;)

No, it's not best to do a clean install on a Mac, ever -- especially if you're unfamiliar. The less you know, the more likely it becomes that you'll lose something important. On the Mac at least, clean installing is a cure looking for a disease.
 
Well lets say that i had purchased a mac this fall... and due to my stupidity i downloaded some stupid programs not legally :rolleyes: , and it didn't work and or what not, but now i have random folders laying around which i don't think are there from tiger.. they kinda piss me off, and i also heard u can save about 5gigs of space or w.e. from uninstalling all the language packs.. so if i wanted to do this... start fresh.. it's not wise for me to completly erase and install tiger again? :(
 
IJ Reilly said:
I don't really understand. Are you saying that something isn't working right? If so, what?
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no everything works fine, its just it looks dirty..there are weird folders like idk.. i333k or something that do not show up if i clicked on applications.. but lets say im downloading from the internet..and i do a right click or w.e. and it asks me where to save too.. i see weird folders..

i don't know.. i just want the feeling of having a good clean, start fresh.. since all id have to back up would my music..
 
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