USB 2.0 card not working on QuickSilver?

[dandeco]

That's actually strange. It should still detect a PCI card and at least read the vendor ID and Device ID even if it doesn't load any drivers. Do you have any other PCI cards you could slot in? I am wondering if your logic board has issues.

Not sure if I have any other Mac-compatible PCI cards... And regarding the logic board, yes, it does seem one of the three RAM slots doesn't work. But when I checked the diagnostics in the System Profiler, it only mentioned the failed RAM slot, nothing regarding PCI. Hmm...
And it does feel like it's in all the way, too.

 

[weckart]

Not sure if I have any other Mac-compatible PCI cards... And regarding the logic board, yes, it does seem one of the three RAM slots doesn't work. But when I checked the diagnostics in the System Profiler, it only mentioned the failed RAM slot, nothing regarding PCI. Hmm...
And it does feel like it's in all the way, too.

A network card or something like that would be a good test even if it doesn't have Mac drivers. If OSX picks up the VID and PID then we can cross off faulty PCI slots.

 

[dandeco]

Hmm, if I find a network card I'll try that. If not, I might try wiping my main boot drive and re-installing Mac OS X 10.4 Tiger to see what that does. Should I leave the USB 2.0 card in when I do that, or remove it before the re-installation?

 

[eyoungren]

Hmm, if I find a network card I'll try that. If not, I might try wiping my main boot drive and re-installing Mac OS X 10.4 Tiger to see what that does. Should I leave the USB 2.0 card in when I do that, or remove it before the re-installation?

If you are looking for network cards, I might suggest Netgear branded ones. I have three Gigabit NICs of this brand and all three work without drivers.

 

[weckart]

Hmm, if I find a network card I'll try that. If not, I might try wiping my main boot drive and re-installing Mac OS X 10.4 Tiger to see what that does. Should I leave the USB 2.0 card in when I do that, or remove it before the re-installation?

No need to wipe and reinstall. Just boot up the Install Disc with a flash drive or hard drive formatted to HFS+ (or invoke Disk Utility) and see if either is recognised. If not, then you have a hardware issue somewhere. A Leopard install disc would be a better test as full USB 2.0 support only came partway through Tiger IIRR.

 

[dandeco]

No need to wipe and reinstall. Just boot up the Install Disc with a flash drive or hard drive formatted to HFS+ (or invoke Disk Utility) and see if either is recognised. If not, then you have a hardware issue somewhere. A Leopard install disc would be a better test as full USB 2.0 support only came partway through Tiger IIRR.

I just tried that, and in the System Profiler under PCI Cards it said "This computer does not appear to have any PCI cards installed." And I didn't see anything relating to the card under "USB" either. It probably is a hardware issue, either a faulty card or maybe the PCI slots don't work (but the Diagnostics don't mention any PCI slot issues, just that one failed memory slot.)

 

[dandeco]

OK, I think I may have finally found the problem! My USB 2.0 card has a smaller NEC chipset...

But I have seen on Operation Headgap that a similar Mac-compatible USB 2.0 PCI card is being sold there, but with a FULL-SIZE NEC chipset, compared to the small one on mine. Maybe that's the issue? I would imagine so, seeing as my USB card was most likely made during the 2010s with a smaller chipset as it was cheaper than the full-size version and primarily made with Windows users in mind.

 

[TheShortTimer]

@dandeco I've got exactly the same card as yours working 100% in OS 9 and OS X on my G4. This points towards the problem laying elsewhere.

 

[weckart]

Ditto. The smaller NEC chipset was found on later revisions of the USB cards, typically those with L-shaped PCBs. Try other PCI cards and see if they register in your QS.

 

[dandeco]

Ditto. The smaller NEC chipset was found on later revisions of the USB cards, typically those with L-shaped PCBs. Try other PCI cards and see if they register in your QS.

Yeah, I might try that. I did run Apple Hardware Test on my QuickSilver, and aside from that one problematic RAM slot, everything else registered as OK. Plus as I mentioned, when I plug my Apple Mouse into the card when booted into OS X, the laser light illuminates on the bottom of the mouse, so I know the PCI slot is working in some way; it's obviously my card having issues.

 

[TheShortTimer]

I had a USB card with the VIA chipset and used it on a 6500 under OS9. It requires the USB driver update, but if you've already installed 9.1 it should come with it. Anything under that requires the update.

Take a look here: http://www.virtualinformation.com/drivers/USBCardSupport.htm

I tried to install that driver - just in case it was missing and received this notification:

The driver is already installed so it appears that my particular VIA card isn't supported under OS 9, hence why devices connected to it during a 9.2.2 session fail to activate. I'll replace it with an NEC chipset based card at some point.

Here's the details for the card in System Profiler in case there might be a glimmer of hope.

 

[weckart]

Tbh, it doesn't appear so. Your card is recognised as the VID and PID are returned, so there is no hardware issue with your Mac. What System Profiler is showing under OS9 is that no drivers are loaded.

Looking at the PIDs, they are picking up EHCI (3104), which is not supported under OS9 in any case and UHCI (3038). IIRR, Apple supported the OHCI protocol for USB under OS9, which is why you are not seeing any USB activity from that card. NEC cards have EHCI and OHCI. Some VIA cards may as well but by and large VIA USB 2.0 cards tended to support EHCI (USB 2.0) and UHCI (USB 1.1), neither of which will work in your Mac without specific vendor extensions and those do not exist.

If you are looking for USB 1.1 cards because you do not intend to run OSX on your Mac, keep an eye out for cards with OPTI chipsets. Those are OHCI unless I am very much mistaken and your Mac should still sleep with the card in.

 

[TheShortTimer]

Tbh, it doesn't appear so. Your card is recognised as the VID and PID are returned, so there is no hardware issue with your Mac. What System Profiler is showing under OS9 is that no drivers are loaded.

Looking at the PIDs, they are picking up EHCI (3104), which is not supported under OS9 in any case and UHCI (3038). IIRR, Apple supported the OHCI protocol for USB under OS9, which is why you are not seeing any USB activity from that card. NEC cards have EHCI and OHCI.

Thanks for this in-depth info. This reaffirms why the consensus favours NEC cards.

Some VIA cards may as well but by and large VIA USB 2.0 cards tended to support EHCI (USB 2.0) and UHCI (USB 1.1), neither of which will work in your Mac without specific vendor extensions and those do not exist.

I just tried a spare VIA card and witnessed exactly what you've detailed. It wasn't recognised in OS 9 either and what's more, Tiger issued a warning that the card was drawing too much power and that one of the hubs would need to be deactivated. The only device connected was a standard USB stick! I'll keep those cards for Win box usage.

If you are looking for USB 1.1 cards because you do not intend to run OSX on your Mac, keep an eye out for cards with OPTI chipsets. Those are OHCI unless I am very much mistaken and your Mac should still sleep with the card in.

The QS is running OS X too so I'll look for an NEC card. Thanks for the suggestion though.

 

[eyoungren]

I must have been lucky to get that particular card that day then. But it was some time around 2002-2003 when I got it (brand new).