Users Reporting Apple Pay Problems After Changes in iPhone Security Status

[kdarling]

You're missing the fact that even though you and I don't have to pay directly when there's a fraud incident, we _all_ pay for that indirectly. Banks and merchants simply pass those costs along to us.

True, they did pass on rising costs to us. Unfortunately, the reverse is not true.

• When the fraud costs go down, banks do not pass their savings (*) onto the merchants, and the merchants do not pass their savings onto us.
  
  
• We already know that the banks are not lowering their merchant fees because of Apple Pay. Instead, they're giving Apple a percentage.
  
  
• Even with the move to EMV chip cards, US credit brands have announced no plans to lower interchange fees.
  
  
• GAO documents studying other nations with lowered fraud costs have shown that merchants failed to pass on any savings.
  
  
• Fraud coverage is a tiny portion of what US merchants pay. According to Federal Reserve documents (such as this 2013 study), out of $2.1 trillion in transactions, $1.6 billion was lost to fraud. That's 8 cents out of every $100. Virtually nothing out of the $2 or so paid for interchange fees.
  

So while the idea sounds great, reality is quite different.

(*) Banks claim that they do raise or lower their rewards programs for their cardholders in proportion to higher profits on their end.

 

[doelcm82]

Again, though, unless they use something like Apple Pay everywhere, they're only as safe as the lowest security used anyplace where they also swiped the same card account. I.e. being secure paying at Walgreen's doesn't mean anything if the same card is swiped at a different merchant that gets hacked.

The ultimate goal is to use it everywhere, but the tipping point will come LONG before we reach 100% saturation.

I don't know about others, but since I started using Apple Pay, I pay more attention when I hand over my credit card to be swiped. As I'm able to use it more and more places, the ones that don't offer NFC payments annoy me.

We're not there yet, but when 90% of the places I go will take Apple Pay, I'm really going to be suspicious of the remaining 10%. I'll think maybe the reason they don't is that they want to steal my credit card number, and I'll look for ways to avoid them.

If I'm not using my credit card anywhere that uses swipe technology, then I'll have effectively closed off that access to my credit card account number.

I'll call Apple Pay a success if it continues to increase the number of places I can use it.

 

[MH01]

Easier perhaps, but far less secure.

So is leaving your house everyday, but somehow people all around the globe battle through the dangerous perils of using a card of some sort on a daily basis

To be honest, use cash if you worried about electronic transactions

----------

The ultimate goal is to use it everywhere, but the tipping point will come LONG before we reach 100% saturation.

I don't know about others, but since I started using Apple Pay, I pay more attention when I hand over my credit card to be swiped. As I'm able to use it more and more places, the ones that don't offer NFC payments annoy me.

We're not there yet, but when 90% of the places I go will take Apple Pay, I'm really going to be suspicious of the remaining 10%. I'll think maybe the reason they don't is that they want to steal my credit card number, and I'll look for ways to avoid them.

If I'm not using my credit card anywhere that uses swipe technology, then I'll have effectively closed off that access to my credit card account number.

I'll call Apple Pay a success if it continues to increase the number of places I can use it.

Hate to tell you, there are many many different ways people can get you credit card number, and Apple pay will not help, it's just a transaction. Do you ever buy things online????

 

[Southern Dad]

I love using Apple Pay. I have no doubt that it isn't used much in my area by the cashiers' response when I pay with my iPhone 6 Plus. Around here I am able to use it at Home Depot, Walgreens, Subway, Apple Store and McDonalds.

 

[jaarso]

I think he just used the card at HD, not ApplePay.

Apple Pay actually does work at Home Depot. At least here in San Antonio, TX a few weeks ago.

 

[seedigit]

Easier perhaps, but far less secure.

Amen! I am so tired of using my card and not having anyone verify that it belongs to me. I want Apple Pay to succeed so that hopefully merchants are more careful with our information.

 

[PopinFRESH]

I was kidding in my first post about how easy it was to deal with identity theft and credit card fraud.

You answered as though I was seriously arguing that all that hassle was better than having a system that makes it harder for people to steal your credit card info.

Believe it or not, people have disputed the need for Apple Pay by saying why bother if you won't lose anything with a credit card, arguing your points but non-sarcastically.

I agree, doelcm82 your original post did not really have an air of sarcasm and definitely seemed like you were seriously implying what you were stating in jest (the /sarcasm would have gone a long way). I think another aspect that other people who seem to have that mindset of "it's as simple as disputing the fraudulent charges" is the reality of identity theft. There is nothing simple or easy trying to dispute a mortgage taken out using your legitimate information that was illicitly obtained through a data breach such as the HomeDepot, Target, or the several others in recent history.

Or in my case I still carry cash because in my early years it was too easy to mount up debt. I've been credit card free for 45 months. It is possible to live off cash and a debit card. And by next year April my motorcycle and truck will be paid off. I will only have my mortgage left. I do all my own vehicle and home repairs so no need to have some emergency credit card on hand; just cash.
I'm 40 and I want to be 100% debt free when I retire. Now I believe that if you can't pay for it in cash you should not by it. Buying these toys on credit cards/loans will give you sleepless nights.

You sound like a Dave Ramsey guy/gal, although Dave would tell you to sell that motorcycle and truck and get a beater until you're debt free. However you at least have the same goal. You are a weird individual with some strange notion of living within your means. I definitely agree with your notion and the only account I have linked in my Passbook for ApplePay is my Debit card and I've been debit free for many years. I wish you well on your journey of getting out of debt.

-PopinFRESH

 

[Kid Red]

I logged out of iCloud for a bluetooth issue I was trouble shooting and found my debit cards were gone from Passbook. I added them back with zero issues.

 

[kdarling]

Amen! I am so tired of using my card and not having anyone verify that it belongs to me.

Ironically, Visa's merchant guide says that asking for id could be "annoying" to customers, and thus they recommend that it not be done, except in extraordinary circumstances.

"It is important that merchants understand that the requesting of a cardholder ID does not change the merchant’s liability for chargebacks.

"However, it can slow down a sale and annoy the customer. In some cases, it may even deter the use of the Visa card and result in the loss of a potential sale.

"Visa believes merchants should not ask for ID as part of their regular card acceptance procedures. "

- Visa Card Acceptance Guidelines

As a side note, I sometimes hear of people putting "See ID" in the signature block.

That does nothing, except make them a fraudulent user of the card, as their signature is required to acknowledge the cardmember agreement and make the card valid. Until it's signed, the card is invalid.

Which is why many places, if they see it's not signed, will not accept the card until it is.

 

[applewhat??]

I'm sooo glad I found this thread. This is the exact problem I am having. Since buying the iPhone 6+ when it first came out, I've had it replaced twice. The first time the screen was malfunctioning (no fault of my own) and the second time I couldn't text, call, and it would frequently open in landscape mode. The Apple Tech at the Store offers me a new phone at no charge and says we should set it up as a new phone to verify whether it is a software problem or a hardware issue.

I get home and try to load a credit card into apple wallet and boom, the above message pops up. I spend two hours on the phone with Apple trying to get it fixed with no luck. They assign me a case number and tell me that it will be flagged as high priority since it involved the wallet. This was Friday, January 15. I thought I would hear something back within 24 hours. Nothing. 48 hours? Not even an email. I let it ride. Keep in mind that at the end of the phone call on Friday, they set me up with a icloud password that will allow Apple Engineers to look at my account. So now someone has access to my account. I refuse to download apps, look at banking info, or do anything that involves passwords when someone is sharing my password. So the 'smartphone' is worthless.

Late Wednesday afternoon, I finally speak to a nice lady who tries her best to help. She resubmits my case and offers me something from the Apple Store as an appeasement for my time spent handling this issue and the inconvenience of it all. I ask for a GoPro Hero 4 Session and they kindly oblige. It should be noted that I was originally offered $150 to spend on anything from the Apple Store. I informed them that I would like the new Apple TV ($149) and they in turn, inform me, that with a appeasement case, they can't really offer any Apple products from the store. This would exclude the new Apple TV, the watch, macbooks, basically anything Apple. So I ask for the GoPro and they say they'll do it. Side note, the woman I was working with was a professional and for a brief moment regained my confidence back in Apple Customer Service. I was told to wait and see if I hear anything by Wednesday, January 27.

Didn't hear back. I called. No answer. Finally the original rep called me today to say that Apple Wallet Engineers were looking at the issue and would need more time. I ask for an estimated time of completion and he says he can only pass on the info the other engineers gave him.

If I have to get another phone, this will have been my FOURTH iPhone 6+. This is out of control. Thanks for the Gopro, but that was to appease (their word, not mine) me for the inconvenience of this whole issue and for not getting in touch with me for almost a week. Now it has been almost two and we are no closer to wrapping it up.