Using financing on Apple.com for a Retina MacBook Pro

[beamer8912]

In America the credit card companies have very clever yet misleading commercials on TV. They have a big influence on our youth. Sadly they will do nearly anything, like offering cash back or zero interest to get people to use their cards. The amount of consumer credit card debt in the US, is at an all time high. It's very sad. Before many young people reach age 25, they are in over their head in debt. Usually with no way to pay it off. It's a widespread problem.

As far as buying a house or car, I've always paid cash. No credit is required since you're paying the full amount on the spot. The amount of interest I've saved is simply unbelievable.

It took until I was 30 yrs old to save the money for my house, but I feel it was well worth it. Patience and determination serve one very well.

Either a ridiculously high salaried job or a cruddy house. Either way, not the typical consumer. Most would be lucky to have barely paid off their college debt before 30.

Personally, I'll only be 3 years out of grad school by 30. No possible way that amount of money could be saved in 3 years, even with a PhD from a good university.

 

[Pupator]

Fascinating. We live in a country where the person who actually pays for their stuff gets insulted and criticized and the person who buys stuff they can't afford is "normal."

Either a ridiculously high salaried job or a cruddy house. Either way, not the typical consumer. Most would be lucky to have barely paid off their college debt before 30.

Personally, I'll only be 3 years out of grad school by 30. No possible way that amount of money could be saved in 3 years, even with a PhD from a good university.

 

[gsugolfer]

Fascinating. We live in a country where the person who actually pays for their stuff gets insulted and criticized and the person who buys stuff they can't afford is "normal."

Borrowing money on a house is "buying something you can't afford"?

 

[beamer8912]

Fascinating. We live in a country where the person who actually pays for their stuff gets insulted and criticized and the person who buys stuff they can't afford is "normal."

See below

Borrowing money on a house is "buying something you can't afford"?

Pupator: You pay for the house. It's called a mortgage. And yes, it is very normal. Buying a $300k house with cold hard cash...that is not so normal.

 

[gsugolfer]

Long story short, if the OP is RESPONSIBLE, it might not be a bad idea.You do need to establish some sort of credit history, despite what others may think.

If you already have the money, open a savings account online at ING or something. They'll pay you roughly 1% interest, then you're being paid to borrow money from Apple.

If this is not an interest free situation, you absolutely shouldn't do it.

Paying interest on a computer is ridiculous.

 

[Pupator]

See below



Pupator: You pay for the house. It's called a mortgage. And yes, it is very normal. Buying a $300k house with cold hard cash...that is not so normal.

First, we aren't talking about buying a house. We are talking about someone putting a laptop they don't need on a credit card. People in this thread are suggesting that this is a reasonable decision because it will help him buy a house one day! (Absurd)

Second, I was objecting to the insults and ridicule directed at the guy who did pay cash for his house ("cruddy house.") What a bunch of drivel that is. Do you know what the best house is? The one that you, and not the bank, actually owns.

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Long story short, if the OP is RESPONSIBLE, it might not be a bad idea.You do need to establish some sort of credit history, despite what others may think.

Despite what other think. Not with any evidence of course. Just that what you think is obviously more correct than what other think.

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If you already have the money, open a savings account online at ING or something. They'll pay you roughly 1% interest, then you're being paid to borrow money from Apple.

I'm speechless at someone actually making this suggestion. This is why everyone's debt level in this country is so high.

 

[gsugolfer]

I'm speechless at someone actually making this suggestion. This is why everyone's debt level in this country is so high.

I'm a CPA. I know a thing or two about finances.

Personally, my wife and I have zero debt (other than our mortgage). I don't open "finance" accounts because I already HAVE an established credit history through a credit card account I had in college (which I subsequently closed when an annual fee was instituted - doesn't make sense to pay an annual fee when you're using a card as a credit building tool).

Explain to me why that strategy would make you "speechless" if responsibly applied.

 

[RAWphenom]

Before many young people reach age 25, they are in over their head in debt. Usually with no way to pay it off.

Oh, I will be! Prof/grad school is expensive, though. And I will have a way to pay it off. I'm going to challenge myself when I graduate to see how quickly I can pay it off.

 

[unibility]

I was thinking about using Apple's offer to use financing on an upcoming MacBook purchase, and was wondering if anyone has used it before. I would like some experiences that you all have had with it.

BestBuy offers 18 months + 0% if paid in full and triple rewards points.

 

[Pupator]

Explain to me why that strategy would make you "speechless" if responsibly applied.

1) Because, as a CPA, I'm sure you understand that people are flesh and blood, not spreadsheets. People have a very hard time making rational decisions about money. You can say "responsibly applied," but if you work with people at all you know this is playing with fire.

2) Let's do the math. Since he's putting it on credit, he'll spring for the 3k model instead of the $2200. Nevermind the money the credit just cost him, let's say he takes your suggestion and puts it in the savings account. (My HSBC online savings doesn't pay 1% but we can use that number. $3000 at 1% interest for 11 months. That's what? $27.50? Minus the time spent opening the account and any postage involved.

Yeah. That's worth opening a credit account.


For the folks talking about getting a mortgage, I wonder how many of you have one? Also, have you ever talked to someone who needed a mortgage and didn't have any credit history? Did they have any trouble? I didn't. I got a great rate. I agree that there aren't very many folks who can pay cash for a house. I put 20% down, bought a house that gave me very reasonable payments on a 15 year mortgage, and the bank didn't blink and eye about making the loan. And that was in 2008. That's just one story, of course, but I don't think it's unusual. I've never seen any evidence that, if you're putting reasonable money down on a house, you need a great credit score.

 

[terraphantm]

1) Because, as a CPA, I'm sure you understand that people are flesh and blood, not spreadsheets. People have a very hard time making rational decisions about money. You can say "responsibly applied," but if you work with people at all you know this is playing with fire.

2) Let's do the math. Since he's putting it on credit, he'll spring for the 3k model instead of the $2200. Nevermind the money the credit just cost him, let's say he takes your suggestion and puts it in the savings account. (My HSBC online savings doesn't pay 1% but we can use that number. $3000 at 1% interest for 11 months. That's what? $27.50? Minus the time spent opening the account and any postage involved.

Yeah. That's worth opening a credit account.


For the folks talking about getting a mortgage, I wonder how many of you have one? Also, have you ever talked to someone who needed a mortgage and didn't have any credit history? Did they have any trouble? I didn't. I got a great rate. I agree that there aren't very many folks who can pay cash for a house. I put 20% down, bought a house that gave me very reasonable payments on a 15 year mortgage, and the bank didn't blink and eye about making the loan. And that was in 2008. That's just one story, of course, but I don't think it's unusual. I've never seen any evidence that, if you're putting reasonable money down on a house, you need a great credit score.

It is unusual to get a mortgage with no credit.. unless you're taking a hit somewhere or have a very high salary (or a very cheap house)

And as long as someone is responsible, what's the big deal about opening a CC account? I took the 0% offer from Apple precisely because I would like to build up my history a bit. I have more than enough cash on hand to pay for the laptop several times over right now. But as long as I'm not paying interest, I don't mind paying over 12 month. I just set up a recurring payment that will allow it to be completely paid off before the interest kicks in. I also have a CC that I use for gas and pay in full every month - mostly because I actually do save a pretty significant sum if I take the reward points into account.

And anyone who's going to graduate or professional schooling probably will not be able to afford a house by 30, even mortgaged. By the time I'm done with medical school, I'll be 27. Residency will be 3 years with a ridiculously low pay. So I won't be earning a real income until I'm 30, and at that point, paying off my student loans will be a priority. I will also hopefully be starting a family around then, so a lot of money will be prioritized for them. I suspect I won't be able to buy a house until I'm at least 35. Ideally I'd like to buy it in cash since having a >$1000/month recurring payment is not appealing to me

 

[gsugolfer]

1) Because, as a CPA, I'm sure you understand that people are flesh and blood, not spreadsheets. People have a very hard time making rational decisions about money. You can say "responsibly applied," but if you work with people at all you know this is playing with fire.

2) Let's do the math. Since he's putting it on credit, he'll spring for the 3k model instead of the $2200. Nevermind the money the credit just cost him, let's say he takes your suggestion and puts it in the savings account. (My HSBC online savings doesn't pay 1% but we can use that number. $3000 at 1% interest for 11 months. That's what? $27.50? Minus the time spent opening the account and any postage involved.

Yeah. That's worth opening a credit account.

For the folks talking about getting a mortgage, I wonder how many of you have one? Also, have you ever talked to someone who needed a mortgage and didn't have any credit history? Did they have any trouble? I didn't. I got a great rate. I agree that there aren't very many folks who can pay cash for a house. I put 20% down, bought a house that gave me very reasonable payments on a 15 year mortgage, and the bank didn't blink and eye about making the loan. And that was in 2008. That's just one story, of course, but I don't think it's unusual. I've never seen any evidence that, if you're putting reasonable money down on a house, you need a great credit score.

I know how I operate, I can't speak for others. If someone opts to spend 36% more just because they're using credit, then yes, there is a problem.

I have a mortgage, and I work with banks daily. I see a good number of applications, and one of the services I perform involves analyzing interest rates extended to various groups of borrowers. It definitely makes a difference. Then again, that all depends on your definition of a "good rate" (and there's no sense in getting into that here, as that is a MUCH more lengthy discussion than this).

Here's a real life example for you. My mom and stepdad have natural gas appliances. As a result, they rely on a gas company to come by regularly and refill the tank (or whatever you call it, I have no idea). Friday afternoon, my stepdad calls the gas company because they need it. They tell him they can come by Saturday. Problem is, he won't be there. No big deal, right? Just put it on an account and he'll pay Monday. This guy has ALWAYS paid cash for everything he owns (including the houses they've lived in). As a result, a credit report showed zero history.

The gas company would not make the delivery.

As for the two examples we've painted (mine of a reasonably responsible person and yours of an idiot [which, yes, is more common the United States, I am not disputing that]), both have their own merits.

With all of that said, borrowing money on a consumer item is NOT an automatic bad idea. If you're a responsible individual who will not spend extra money just because you're on credit, using credit for consumer items that you are going to buy anyway can be helpful.

 

[Pupator]

I appreciate the discussion and we can agree to disagree. I would, however, categorize your approach as "the triumph of hope over experience." Most people simply aren't responsible, don't make wise choices with money, and shouldn't play with fire by opening these accounts.

 

[gsugolfer]

I appreciate the discussion and we can agree to disagree. I would, however, categorize your approach as "the triumph of hope over experience." Most people simply aren't responsible, don't make wise choices with money, and shouldn't play with fire by opening these accounts.

You're right. I typically expect too much from people. I was brought up with the understanding of how to treat money and not be be wasteful and make bad purchasing decisions. It has treated me well and put me in a MUCH better position at my age (24, 18 months out of college) than most of my peers.

It escapes me at times that others didn't have this benefit.

 

[terraphantm]

I appreciate the discussion and we can agree to disagree. I would, however, categorize your approach as "the triumph of hope over experience." Most people simply aren't responsible, don't make wise choices with money, and shouldn't play with fire by opening these accounts.

Just because the average person is easily tempted or otherwise just unable to manage his money doesn't mean everyone is. I know I'm more than capable of managing my own finances. If I don't have enough money to buy it in cash today, I don't buy it, period. Regardless of whether or not I'm financing the item.

And financial management is a learned behavior. Rather than just simply chastising anyone's decision to use credit cards, you should encourage people to pay their balances off in full before the interest kicks in.

IMO credit cards didn't directly lead to the financial collapse of this country. Rather it is the tendency to spend their entire paycheck without putting anything into savings that creates problems. Then as soon as some catastrophic event occurs (which will eventually happen at least once to everyone), they no longer have enough money to make ends meet. So they dip into credit, let it incur interest, etc..

 

[doh123]

if you can get a good deal... why not? I bought a bunch of furniture last time I moved on credit completely... why? they gave me 5 years of 0%. I had enough cash to buy it all, but why should I when it costs me not a single penny more to pay for it over 5 years, so I get to keep the cash and make interest on it. Some people act like this is a horrid idea and I should have just paid for it all...

 

[terraphantm]

if you can get a good deal... why not? I bought a bunch of furniture last time I moved on credit completely... why? they gave me 5 years of 0%. I had enough cash to buy it all, but why should I when it costs me not a single penny more to pay for it over 5 years, so I get to keep the cash and make interest on it. Some people act like this is a horrid idea and I should have just paid for it all...

Agreed. The key point is to still refrain from purchasing items that you can't completely pay off, even if you can afford the monthly payment. If you have the money, then there's no harm in paying it off over 5 years w/ no interest. As you said, you can collect the interest (however small the %age is these days) over those 5 years.

 

[doh123]

Agreed. The key point is to still refrain from purchasing items that you can't completely pay off, even if you can afford the monthly payment. If you have the money, then there's no harm in paying it off over 5 years w/ no interest. As you said, you can collect the interest (however small the %age is these days) over those 5 years.

not just that I have the money and can get interest (basically nothing), but in case of emergency, I have the cash on hand still.

 

[beamer8912]

First, we aren't talking about buying a house. We are talking about someone putting a laptop they don't need on a credit card. People in this thread are suggesting that this is a reasonable decision because it will help him buy a house one day! (Absurd)

I know what the thread topic is. You quoted and responded to my house comment. Now you call me on being off topic?

Way to skip 75% of the conversation. I believe the thread went more like:

1. Finance a laptop?
2. No, it's a poor idea to finance such an unessential luxury item
3. (In response to 2), some financing is good, it helps build credit.
4. Yes, you do need to build credit. One reason you need to build credit is to get low interest loans. An example of this is when you buy a house.

You see? We're NOT saying financing a rMBP will lead to the OP buying a house. You're taking it way out of context.

Second, I was objecting to the insults and ridicule directed at the guy who did pay cash for his house ("cruddy house.") What a bunch of drivel that is. Do you know what the best house is? The one that you, and not the bank, actually owns.

Now look who's talking about houses!

There are a number of good reasons why I made my comment. If you look back at it, my comment simply pointed out that either he bought a very inexpensive (*cheap*) house, or has a very large income. Neither of which fit into your standard American consumers profile. I never condemned him, only pointed out that his situation does not fit the standard mold.

 

[Pupator]

I know what the thread topic is....

I'm sorry you didn't understand my post. I'll try to be more clear in future posts involving interaction with you.

 

[doh123]

no matter the good points of having a good credit rating... financing (credit card or not) a computer with 0% interest is not a bad deal, just read the fine print... don't miss any payments or they often will not only cut off your 0%, but they'll do it retroactive for the full amount, and its usually some absurdly high 29.99% or more junk.

 

[vpro]

good credit is good life

Really? You need credit? You need a good credit score?

Only if you want to spend the rest of your life borrowing money.

If you don't want to be in debt you don't need a credit score.

i have a credit score over 898

this is because i have had my credit card since age 15 and only used it once every other month for new shoes.

having a credit card doesn't mean loaning money, it means being responsible with money - if you don't have a income and if you KNOW you wont afford it, don't buy it, definitely don't swipe it - that simple.

with accumulated high credit score you can rent cars, buy a home and do a TON of things because businesses will RESPECT you more because you can actually stay out of debt.

of course though having said that, banks and credit card companies however LOVE those of you out there who struggle to pay off your debts because you are the ones keeping banks and credit card companies alive. those like me are considered their worst customers because we never own them anything, but we carry double platinum cards.

be smart with your money!

as for apple financing though, it is a little bit confusing right? can you pay the full purchase amount at the end of the 3 months when the final bill is issue and not be charged a cent in interest (even if you did not make minimum payments until then)? That part is a little fuzzy.

 

[thermodynamic]

Eh, I think if you can't pay cash, you shouldn't be buying it. Better to not have a credit card, or anything like that at all (there are some obvious exceptions, like home loans etc).

With wages having remained flatlined (or dropped, never mind jobs themselves disappearing, turning responsible people into apparently something different) while costs keep going up and that's a pattern that has gone on for decades, if people did what you say, many wouldn't even be able to eat, much less get a home, car, education to earn more money to buy these updated tools*, et cetera... never mind the economy crashing because nobody has money to spend... the working class will get blamed either way**... even in 2010, articles saying we were saving too much and thus risking the economy (uh, most of us didn't see raises so the people who wrote those articles must be inhaling something rather nice...)

* if it's bought as bling, then you don't need it

** sorry, but there was context that had to be added into this conversation; what you say would make more sense... in 1950.

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i have a credit score over 898

this is because i have had my credit card since age 15 and only used it once every other month for new shoes.

having a credit card doesn't mean loaning money, it means being responsible with money - if you don't have a income and if you KNOW you wont afford it, don't buy it, definitely don't swipe it - that simple.

So how old are you now, and are you feeling sufficiently secure in your job that nothing will ever happen to you, you won't need further education (at which point student loans are pretty much inevitable, and for a process that is increasingly not affordable and if we are to "compete" then we need those degrees*... the whole of the system transcends your cozy point, unfortunately... best of luck to you, and to all, in this country... whichever it may be...)

* p.s. before anyone gets political, politicians from both major political parties have made the same statements. So they're all telling the truth or they're all not.

 

[vpro]

So how old are you now, and are you feeling sufficiently secure in your job that nothing will ever happen to you, you won't need further education (at which point student loans are pretty much inevitable, and for a process that is increasingly not affordable and if we are to "compete" then we need those degrees*... the whole of the system transcends your cozy point, unfortunately... best of luck to you, and to all, in this country... whichever it may be...)

* p.s. before anyone gets political, politicians from both major political parties have made the same statements. So they're all telling the truth or they're all not.[/QUOTE]



well security is an illusion or a frame of mind at least
you can't trust anyone in power especially those pageant contestants known as politicians who parade around with fake smiles knowing one who really loves them so they only love power.

 

[gentlefury]

you need credit though, so you'd want to maintain a credit card just to keep your credit score up. It's better to spend responsibly, and then you don't have to worry about having a credit card (NOTE: not implying the OP is irresponsible here...this is totally unrelated)

This is the biggest myth ever!!! I have never had a credit card. I have great credit because I have paid off a car and am paying off another now. I also have student loan debt. Credit cards are traps and scams! Credit is built on large revolving credit. Not capital one.