Verizon to Open Wireless Network to Any App or Device

[sigamy]

Seems to me to be a press release about nothing. Verizon just wanted to get their name associated with the word "Open".

I don't understand all the complexities involved but how is this announcment any diffferent than what happens today? Verizon has a network. Others can build devices and/or apps to run on that network. Verizon tests these and then releases.

Seems like the current world to me...

Do we really believe they will allow *anyone* in their basement to hop on their network? I looked into to developing apps for Verizon BREW phones. It was a massive headache. Thousand dollars for an SDK, big learning curve, complex testing and certification process. Typical big telco crap.

 

[Spades]

Cheap unlimited wireless internet access with no restrictions on devices or applications is the beginning of a technological revolution, and the first company to deliver that will be the big winner. If Verizon really is opening their network to everything, that means it'll be them.

 

[MarlboroLite]

I think there is little question that Verizon has the best service and coverage in the US--that's why I keep them despite their ridiculous customer service and crippled phones--at the end of the day one is buying a phone to above all else talk in it and I would not drop VZW for ATT just because of a cool new phone like the iPhone if I can't get good reception.

If Apple does come out with a cdma version for Asia, I might import it or find a way to use it here with VZW, but I'm not switching.

 

[MacNut]

I still don't understand Apple's reasoning for not making the phone open to every carrier. Are they really going to make that much more off of ATT when they could of sold millions more phones if they opened it up to everyone world wide at once. Apple should of made 2 phones, GSM and CDMA and launched them simultaneously world wide with no exclusive deals.

 

[shamino]

https://www.macrumors.com/2007/05/22/iphone-details-5-years-on-atandt-verizons-answer/

Noting that USA Today is only confirming the 5-year timespan. The prohibition against developing any CDMA-based device is listed as "is said to" - or in other words "unconfirmed rumor".

I wouldn't bet any money on the accuracy of rumors like this, even ones confirmed by prestigious news agencies like USA Today. I'm sure that they haven't seen the contract either and are just quoting their own rumor/leak sources, which are not necessarily correct.

All we know for sure is that there is a five-year exclusive contract for AT&T to sell iPhones in the US. Any statements about restricting other products, especially for sale in other countries, is pure speculation.

 

[ZrSiO4-Zircon]

Do I see a typo?
"...no affect..."
Shouldn't it be "...no effect..."?

 

[dannychang]

Wait...CDMA?

who cares about CDMA this day?

oh wait....some verizon cellphone don't even have a SIM card.

oh shoot...whut a product with 90's technology.

They just try to get people to use their so call "special" CDMA network with EVDO expensive useless wireless connection.

on the other hand. Is AT&T and Tmobile gonna upgrade their system to 3G? when lots of counties in Asia starting to use 3.5G network. why are we still getting 2.5G here?

 

[lseven]

I still don't understand Apple's reasoning for not making the phone open to every carrier. Are they really going to make that much more off of ATT when they could of sold millions more phones if they opened it up to everyone world wide at once. Apple should of made 2 phones, GSM and CDMA and launched them simultaneously world wide with no exclusive deals.

Rumor is that Apple gets a good chunk of the monthly fees from AT&T also. Companies love recurring revenue. And the phone would be more expensive if it was open (like the unlocked phones for Germany).

 

[Ted13]

I still don't understand Apple's reasoning for not making the phone open to every carrier. Are they really going to make that much more off of ATT when they could of sold millions more phones if they opened it up to everyone world wide at once. Apple should of made 2 phones, GSM and CDMA and launched them simultaneously world wide with no exclusive deals.

Because many companies (like the pre iPhone Verizon) wouldn't let the iPhone on their networks. Verizon up till now has crippled Blue Tooth, etc. on various phones so they could charge users, instead of permitting them to freely transfer data. Most phone companies want to sell their users songs at $3 a pop, rather than allowing to be loaded for free via iTunes from someone's CD collection. Remember -- Apple approached Verizon before AT&T -- Verizon said no.

Now, post iPhone (and Google Android), the carriers are being scared into opening their networks up.

 

[Papajohn56]

CDMA has better voice quality but GSM is more prevalent. CDMA is mostly north america only.

Don't bother taking your CDMA phone to Europe to use more than a door stop.

-

This Verizon initiative sounds like a great idea...

CDMA is also better at getting through walls and buildings, and has a higher standard data rate. CDMA is supported in the following countries:

Canada
Guam
Northern Mariana
Islands
Puerto Rico
Saipan
St. Croix
St John
St Thomas
Virgin Islands, US
Mexico
Aruba
Bahamas
Barbados
Belize
Bermuda
Bonaire
Brazil
Cayman Islands
China
Curaçao
Dominican Republic
India
Israel
Jamaica
Jost Van Dyke
Macau
Netherland Antilles
New Zealand
Peru
South Korea
St Maarten

who cares about CDMA this day?

oh wait....some verizon cellphone don't even have a SIM card.

oh shoot...whut a product with 90's technology.

They just try to get people to use their so call "special" CDMA network with EVDO expensive useless wireless connection.

on the other hand. Is AT&T and Tmobile gonna upgrade their system to 3G? when lots of counties in Asia starting to use 3.5G network. why are we still getting 2.5G here?

If I'm staying in the USA, I'd MUCH rather use CDMA. Call quality is the most important thing for me. I know you're trying to troll, but some of us pick function over form. I've never needed a SIM card, because I don't buy a phone to be a toy, I use it for its intended purpose and I want the best quality from it.

 

[savar]

What about an iPod Touch with EVDO?

VERY interesting....

I'll buy it if I can use it as a bluetooth modem

 

[EagerDragon]

yummy! Verizon iPhone!

That is a big leap, the iphone TODAY does not to my knowledge has a radio that is compatible with Verizon. It would require a new phone and probably re-certification by FCC but can't be sure.

 

[takao]

CDMA is also better at getting through walls and buildings, and has a higher standard data rate. CDMA is supported in the following countries:

GSM is used in 212 countries (which means around 75-80% of the mobile market in terms of population)
in fact 48 countries used GSM already in 1993

 

[EagerDragon]

I was wondering which cell company would "get it" first.

10 years from now no one will be paying for cellular phone service. You'll be paying someone for wired internet in your home and someone else for wireless access everywhere else. (Maybe the same company, but maybe not.) From those connections you will get TV, home phone, web sites, media purching, media rentals, and outdoor phone service.

The difference is that you'll only be paying AT&T or T-Mobile for the connection, and everything else willl be done through the web. Sure, the cell companies can offer phone service and phone numbers, but that will be a distinct business from offering the connection, unlike now where the 2 are linked.

The cellular companies that survive will be the ones that make this transition first and best. Looks like Verizon is trying to get a head start.

That maybe the case in highly populated areas. In the suburbs and other less populated areas TODAY is hard to find a single wireless location other than a fool or two that don't know how to lock it down.

I believe it when I see a lot more wireless places.

 

[Consultant]

incompatible

They don't have the international standard GSM, probably never will.

 

[EagerDragon]

This is all fine and good but can I get non-crippled bluetooth on a phone from them? I want it now not sometime next year. I'm calling Verizon and if I can't get one then I'm off to AT&T!

Typically Verizon turns off a lot of the phone native capabilities and offers an equivalent service (sometimes) at a charge, for example VCast. They also disable the modem capabilities and a lot of bluetooth capabilities in other than the BlackBerry.

They are talking OPEN, which is against their culture. I left them long ago and have zero plan to comeback

 

[FakeWozniak]

VZ = Vacation Zone?

Canada
Guam
Northern Mariana
Islands
Puerto Rico
Saipan
St. Croix
St John
St Thomas
Virgin Islands, US
Mexico
Aruba
Bahamas
Barbados
Belize
Bermuda
Bonaire
Brazil
Cayman Islands
China
Curaçao
Dominican Republic
India
Israel
Jamaica
Jost Van Dyke
Macau
Netherland Antilles
New Zealand
Peru
South Korea
St Maarten

Sure, CDMA, go after the warm island destinations! But what have you done for Greenland, Iceland, Siberia, and Antarctica! (I did see Canada listed! )

 

[sixth]

Some very good points posted here, but I have been doing A LOT of reading on this announcement, and I really agree with a lot posts here. This means very little to me, and I really believe it is just to get media coverage, they are trying anything right now since the iPhone came out. I don't care if you are a Verizon customer or not, its just the facts, they STILL control what phones will be on their network, they still are going to get you in a contract that you wont be able to get out of unless you die and they are still going to be a crappy phone company (along with all the rest, because to me they all suck).

So...regardless of 'how big' the media is making this whole announcement out to be, it still doesnt mean crap. We wont see an iPhone on Verizon, it just won't work like that.

Just my .02 cents...

 

[sjo]

CDMA is also better at getting through walls and buildings, and has a higher standard data rate. CDMA is supported in the following countries:

Canada
Guam
Northern Mariana
Islands
Puerto Rico
Saipan
St. Croix
St John
St Thomas
Virgin Islands, US
Mexico
Aruba
Bahamas
Barbados
Belize
Bermuda
Bonaire
Brazil
Cayman Islands
China
Curaçao
Dominican Republic
India
Israel
Jamaica
Jost Van Dyke
Macau
Netherland Antilles
New Zealand
Peru
South Korea
St Maarten

nice list. now let's take a look from the point of view of numbers.

cdma phones sold 2007: <200m
gsm phones sold 2007: 1B

implementing a cdma version of a phone comes as very distant 3rd after implementing gsm version and 3g version of a phone for any manufacturer. most actually don't even bother.

If I'm staying in the USA, I'd MUCH rather use CDMA. Call quality is the most important thing for me. I know you're trying to troll, but some of us pick function over form. I've never needed a SIM card, because I don't buy a phone to be a toy, I use it for its intended purpose and I want the best quality from it.

i'm sure somewhat got those results in some tests. however, the performance of the mobile phone network depends on a lot more variables than lab results. most importantly the implementation of the network. i'd suggest that there are better tools and knowledge available to implement a network based on standard with 3b subscribers than standard that has 100m+ subscribers...

further, sim is functionality, not form.

 

[maokh]

Doesn't CDMA suck compared to GSM? I remember hearing this somewhere but perhaps it's not true?

Okay, i dont want to start any sort of GSM vs. CDMA flame war, but you actually have it backwards.

CDMA has always been lightyears ahead of GSM as far as speed, capacity, reliability, etc. Almost a full generation gap in terms of actual technology and deployment.

CDMA CSD: 14.4k (vs GSM's 9.6k)
CDMA 1xRTT: 100Kbps-144Kbps symetrical (deployed during GPRS popularity)
CDMA EVDO: 600Kbps-1Mbps, 144Kbps up (deployed during EDGE popularity)
CDMA EVDO Rev A: 1Mbps-3Mbps, 600-1MBps up (deployed currently during EDGE/UMTS)
CDMA EVDO Rev B: 8-10Mbps down, 1-3Mbps up (deployed 2008)

There are a ton of different GSM technologies out there that were being developed to keep up with CDMA, but you will find that most of that stuff was either in the lab or deployed in 2-3 cities tops. at&t's UMTS deployment has been a big let down in terms of performance and actual UMTS cards actually installed at the towers.

CDMA also has about 3-5x more voice capacity, nearly all hand offs are soft -- mainly because multiple towers are able to pick up pieces of your signal and put it back togther as a whole...vice versa on the handset. no handoff mishaps like all the TDMA voice services i have ever used. All the systems are backwards compatible. higher call quality .... its actually rated better than GSM in technical journals, its not subjective.

CDMA is a great technology, but only niche in the americas and some of asia. European carriers actually wanted to deploy EVDO at one time (mainly because UMTS hardware didnt exist when EVDO was deployed), but the laws mandate GSM systems.

Of all the features, i like the simple fact that CDMA doesnt buzz the hell out of every speaker within a mile radius. I love my iPhone, and am "putting up" with EDGE..but man, it gets annoying sometimes.


CDMA is not good because:

1) not a truly global system
2) Its version of the SIM is almost never implemented..which:
3) the system very closed
4) requires usage of special chipsets with heavy royalties (qualcomm locked up a lot of UMTS IP the same way, so a moot point)

who cares about CDMA this day?

oh wait....some verizon cellphone don't even have a SIM card.

oh shoot...whut a product with 90's technology.

They just try to get people to use their so call "special" CDMA network with EVDO expensive useless wireless connection.

EVDO is a hell of a lot cheaper than even other GSM systems in the united states. It completely blows away europe and the rest of the world. $10-$15 Unlimited EVDO vs. metered EDGE/UMTS...hmmm...

EVDO is also lightyears ahead of even the "best" UMTS technologies. EVDO actually works in the real world...meanwhile...UMTS, due to CDMA patent dodging mainly, is not able to hold up to any claims in the real world. This is mainly because the most important thing is very high rate/resolution power control, a patent that GSM decided to dodge, and thus, creates an inferior system.

Yeah, your right, CDMA is from 1992...and boy does it kick UMTS's ass.

anyway..enough of that....im just happy Verizon is going to own up their network. There are some very interesting OEM modules id like to connect to their EVDO network with.

 

[retroneo]

Verizon is transitioning their CDMA-EVDO network to GSM-LTE in the 2009-2010 timeframe.

Several CDMA-EVDO carries have done a similar upgrade (CDMA-EVDO to GSM-HSDPA) already - (Two carriers in South Korea and Telstra in Australia)

HSDPA offers 14.4Mbit (Live today) and LTE offers 40Mbit and up.

The Telstra HSDPA transition took 10 months for concept to completion and created the worlds largest wireless network by area.

 

[Papajohn56]

Verizon iPhone would be nice, EV-DO instead of EDGE, especially if unlimited

Verizon is transitioning their CDMA-EVDO network to GSM-LTE in the 2009-2010 timeframe.

Several CDMA-EVDO carries have done a similar upgrade (CDMA-EVDO to GSM-HSDPA) already - (Two carriers in South Korea and Telstra in Australia)

HSDPA offers 14.4Mbit (Live today) and LTE offers 40Mbit and up.

The Telstra HSDPA transition took 10 months for concept to completion and created the worlds largest wireless network by area.

Got a source? How would they handle backwards compatibility?

 

[AtHomeBoy_2000]

Got a source? How would they handle backwards compatibility?

http://www.engadget.com/2007/09/21/verizon-dumps-cdma-for-gsm-based-lte-in-4g-networks/

Endorsed by the 3GPP as the official way to burn wireless rubber in the next few years, LTE is a progression of GSM's UMTS platform, making it an ironic choice for CDMA stalwart Verizon and a huge blow for the CDMA Development Group's competing UMB standard.

 

[retroneo]

Got a source? How would they handle backwards compatibility?

"In a conference this week, Vodafone Chairman Arun Sarin revealed that Verizon as well as Vodafone will use LTE for their 4G networks"

http://www.reuters.com/article/technology-media-telco-SP/idUSN1930400520070920

Backward compatibility is achieved by running both networks at the same time in the same spectrum for a period of 12-18 months and offering all customers new handsets. (This is how Telstra did it)

 

[ccwilli3]

good post by maokh, lots of mis-information being passed around on this forum about mobile carriers, mobile technology schemes, etc, glad to see someone is out there getting it right.

The only reason GSM is the 'standard' (which is isn't) is because it came out before CDMA and was implemented before CDMA was even available for carriers in europe. CDMA is so much better than GSM in a multitude of ways; capacity, quality, spectrum management (which is vital), handoffs, etc... Every handoff in the GSM world is a 'hard' handoff... UMTS/HSDPA is not a progression of GSM, it's also known as WCDMA (wideband CDMA) but they skirted the name and called it UMTS instead. The ATT (and others) UMTS/HSDPA network is an overlay network over it's existing GSM voice network, which is why 3g data is not available everywhere voice is... Just like when (if) sprint rolls out wimax as it's 4G network, it'll still be a CDMA voice network, but 4G devices will have wimax radios to utilize this other overlaid network. Similarly, if VZW goes LTE for it's 4G network, the voice network will still be CDMA.