Video Editing Question

MattG

macrumors 68040
Original poster
May 27, 2003
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Asheville, NC
I need some advice from some Macrumors video people :)

At the new campus we're building, there's (hopefully) going to be a room with advanced lighting and green screen technology. What software do I need in order to utilize this? Can I use the copy of Final Cut Express 2 that I already have, or do I need to advance to Final Cut Pro? Or do I need to get something different altogether?

Thanks!
 

jackieonasses

macrumors 6502a
Mar 3, 2004
929
0
the great OKLAHOMA....
MattG said:
I need some advice from some Macrumors video people :)

At the new campus we're building, there's (hopefully) going to be a room with advanced lighting and green screen technology. What software do I need in order to utilize this? Can I use the copy of Final Cut Express 2 that I already have, or do I need to advance to Final Cut Pro? Or do I need to get something different altogether?

Thanks!
I am sure that Express has Chroma Keying abilities.. If you have money to spare i would suggest Final Cut Pro. I have never used Express and jumped on the bandwagon with the birthday money i received. But i think it is done with Express.... If you need to save money.

(if the class doesn't teach you how ask me - i have had alot of experience with keying...)

kyle
 

MattG

macrumors 68040
Original poster
May 27, 2003
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Asheville, NC
jackieonasses said:
I am sure that Express has Chroma Keying abilities.. If you have money to spare i would suggest Final Cut Pro. I have never used Express and jumped on the bandwagon with the birthday money i received. But i think it is done with Express.... If you need to save money.

(if the class doesn't teach you how ask me - i have had alot of experience with keying...)

kyle
Thanks!

I should have explained better...it's not a class, I work at the college. This will be my room to use, but as of yet, I haven't had any real training. I know how to do really basic editing using FCE, but haven't ventured into anything advanced yet.
 

jackieonasses

macrumors 6502a
Mar 3, 2004
929
0
the great OKLAHOMA....
MattG said:
Thanks!

I should have explained better...it's not a class, I work at the college. This will be my room to use, but as of yet, I haven't had any real training. I know how to do really basic editing using FCE, but haven't ventured into anything advanced yet.
I have gone to this site numerous times for information. and instead of me (a semi-medium-professional) this site is it. here If you need anything Ask!

kyle
 

Jedbeck

macrumors newbie
Apr 19, 2005
6
0
Naples Fl
If you can not find the ability in final Cut Express you may want to check out Adobe After Effects or Motion. You add a ton of different effects with these 2 programs. It all depends what you are intending to do with the chroma-keying.

As an aside, Naples Florida is a beautiful place to live isn't it?

Good luck to you.

Jason
 

revenuee

macrumors 68020
Sep 13, 2003
2,251
1
MattG said:
I need some advice from some Macrumors video people :)

At the new campus we're building, there's (hopefully) going to be a room with advanced lighting and green screen technology. What software do I need in order to utilize this? Can I use the copy of Final Cut Express 2 that I already have, or do I need to advance to Final Cut Pro? Or do I need to get something different altogether?

Thanks!
good lighting is half the battle with chroma keying on green screen ... filter> chroma key> green -- then play with the toggles ... thats all you'll need
 

jackieonasses

macrumors 6502a
Mar 3, 2004
929
0
the great OKLAHOMA....
You have he technology that is the easy part... And you have the lighting which is the hard part. I remember me 5 years ago trying to do a green screen with inferior lighting. Needless to say it looked horrible.

kyle
 

MattG

macrumors 68040
Original poster
May 27, 2003
3,789
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Asheville, NC
Jedbeck said:
If you can not find the ability in final Cut Express you may want to check out Adobe After Effects or Motion. You add a ton of different effects with these 2 programs. It all depends what you are intending to do with the chroma-keying.
FCE does appear to have these effects...just wasn't sure where to look before!

As an aside, Naples Florida is a beautiful place to live isn't it?
Yes, especially after all the snowbirds have gone home :)
 

Laslo Panaflex

macrumors 65816
May 1, 2003
1,291
0
Tokyo
Here's my 2 cents:

If you are planning on doing chroma key with DV, not matter how perfect your lighting is, you are going to have trouble pulling a key with the built in keyer in FCP, I don't know if there is one in FCE I've never used it, but some here say that there is. So if you are going to try to key out DV footage get dvMatte Pro, from DV garage here.

DV is Poo Poo for chroma key becuase of its limited color space, and it's relatively low resolution. dvMatte has MANY more controls to tweak to pull a good key, plus it has the ability to blur the edges of your key, a must when working with DV since it tends to create blocky edges on your subject.

Same goes with using motion, even using the very nice primatte built into motion, you may get a good key, but the edges will be very blocky due to the low resolution of DV.

So, if you are going to use DV for keying, you MUST get dvMatte if you want any kind of decent results. If you are not using DV, but rather film or HD, then you probably won't have trouble and you can disregard my whole spiel.

Again, that is just my personal experience with keying out DV, some people might have better results other ways, and might have more to add, good luck.
 

MattG

macrumors 68040
Original poster
May 27, 2003
3,789
265
Asheville, NC
Thanks for the suggestions everyone...now I need to find some help with lighting. Very confusing...I've looked at several web sites and I can't seem to make heads or tails of what to use. The room is setup so I can use rail-lighting hanging from the ceiling if I want to, but I don't even know if that's the best thing to use.

:confused:
 

revenuee

macrumors 68020
Sep 13, 2003
2,251
1
MattG said:
Thanks for the suggestions everyone...now I need to find some help with lighting. Very confusing...I've looked at several web sites and I can't seem to make heads or tails of what to use. The room is setup so I can use rail-lighting hanging from the ceiling if I want to, but I don't even know if that's the best thing to use.

:confused:
3 point lighting with

lots of fill lighting so that you don't get shadowing

experiment with a static subject -- with lighting the best way is trial and error if you have the time ... a good theory will help ... but once you've set up the three points, then add or subtract as needed ... record several configurations and then play around with all of them and the chroma key ... that will give you an idea of what kinda lighting will work best
 

evil_santa

macrumors 6502a
Sep 23, 2003
893
0
London, England
As said above, good lighting is essential to a good croma key, and as said Dv isn't the best thing for croma key.

What you could do to help is get hold of a Lighting Cameraman with croma key experience to come round and help you plan your studio & do a basic set up of the lights. Use google to find one or a crewing agency. An find out what they have worked on / ask to see their show reel.
You will probably have to pay him/her for their time but it will be worth it in the long run.
 

MattG

macrumors 68040
Original poster
May 27, 2003
3,789
265
Asheville, NC
Laslo Panaflex said:
Here's my 2 cents:

If you are planning on doing chroma key with DV, not matter how perfect your lighting is, you are going to have trouble pulling a key with the built in keyer in FCP, I don't know if there is one in FCE I've never used it, but some here say that there is. So if you are going to try to key out DV footage get dvMatte Pro, from DV garage here.

DV is Poo Poo for chroma key becuase of its limited color space, and it's relatively low resolution. dvMatte has MANY more controls to tweak to pull a good key, plus it has the ability to blur the edges of your key, a must when working with DV since it tends to create blocky edges on your subject.

Same goes with using motion, even using the very nice primatte built into motion, you may get a good key, but the edges will be very blocky due to the low resolution of DV.

So, if you are going to use DV for keying, you MUST get dvMatte if you want any kind of decent results. If you are not using DV, but rather film or HD, then you probably won't have trouble and you can disregard my whole spiel.

Again, that is just my personal experience with keying out DV, some people might have better results other ways, and might have more to add, good luck.
Well then let me ask you guys something else. I'm looking at buying two Canon GL-2 Video cameras for use in this production room, as well as for portable use. Is there something else I can get in the same price range, that will do chroma-key well, plus is portable for remote events?
 

DSign

macrumors newbie
Nov 3, 2005
24
0
Utrecht - The Netherlands
If you want to key with DV material dont shoot on EP/LP, and for the keying part use Adobe Aftereffects, and install the additional plugin LightKey which is superior to the standard keyer on your copy of Aftereffects.

Otherwise try to shoot on DVCam or DVCpro50 where DVcam has less compression and DVCPro50 a higher Chroma subsampling 4:2:2 comparded to 4:1:1 ntsc and 4:2:0 PAL.

Discreet Combustion also must have a superior keyer.
 

MattG

macrumors 68040
Original poster
May 27, 2003
3,789
265
Asheville, NC
Wow another old thread of mine coming back from the dead -- two in one week!!

Thanks for the advice. I actually still haven't even gotten around to setting up the area where I'll be filming. Hopefully early next year...
 
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