[Video] It looks like the 14" with M1 Max is not limited at all, and has the same raw power of the 16" model!

[macpot]

Even though the chassis is smaller, and the fans are also smaller on the 14", it appears the 14" with M1 Max is still as powerful as the 16" with M1 Max.

I'm still confused, if this is the case, then why the 16" needed to be thicker and also have a 140W charger...

Maybe they are just planning for the years ahead, when they will include maybe a M2 Max with 64 cores on the 16 inch?

 

[Sanpete]

For sustained work that gets the processors hot, the 16" will have an advantage. That's true now, it's not about future processors. Though I haven't read yet about heat leading to throttling for the 14", I'm sure it will happen sooner than with the 16".

The 16" has larger batteries (and a larger screen to power), so it takes a larger charger to charge it as quickly.

 

[macpot]

For sustained work that gets the processors hot, the 16" will have an advantage. That's true now, it's not about future processors. Though I haven't read yet about heat leading to throttling for the 14", I'm sure it will happen sooner than with the 16".

The 16" has larger batteries (and a larger screen to power), so it takes a larger charger to charge it as quickly.

Based on youtube videos, the 16" (32-core variant) fans barely even hit 30% max rpm under sustained load.

I think it might be possible that these are actually over engineered for future MX chips.

Maybe I'm wrong!

 

[Dovahkiing]

Agree I think it will only have an impact in sustained loads that draw at max power. I can say that I got the 16” model with M1P and while I have yet to throw something at it that demands more than a couple of minutes at full power, I have not heard the fans kick on at all. For these cases I don’t think it will matter whether you have 14” or 16”.

 

[Dovahkiing]

Based on youtube videos, the 16" (32-core variant) fans barely even hit 30% max rpm under sustained load.

I think it might be possible that these are actually over engineered for future MX chips.

Maybe I'm wrong!

That is interesting! I do wonder though why Apple would ship the 140W brick if there’s no scenario where the machine can use that extra power.

I guess as Sanpete said, it may just be for fast charging the larger battery.

 

[ponzicoinbro]

Everyone knows its the same chip ?

The price is so close with the same internal specs for that reason. The extra dollars are for extra screen only.

 

[ponzicoinbro]

Based on youtube videos, the 16" (32-core variant) fans barely even hit 30% max rpm under sustained load.

I think it might be possible that these are actually over engineered for future MX chips.

Maybe I'm wrong!

Yes makes sense but M2 Pro/Max will probably be use about the same energy if the improve efficiency. If they stay the same efficiency but add two more cores then this fan system can handle it.

 

[827538]

That is interesting! I do wonder though why Apple would ship the 140W brick if there’s no scenario where the machine can use that extra power.

For fast charging. Just like how iPhones never use 20W, yet can be fast charged at 20W.

I'm using my 14" MacBook Pro that, through my dock is getting 15W and yet is slowly being charged while using.


These MacBooks are an almost scarcely believable blend of extreme performance and efficiency. I've yet to hear my fans turn on with my 14", granted I haven't really tried to push it yet.

 

[Dovahkiing]

For fast charging. Just like how iPhones never use 20W, yet can be fast charged at 20W.

I'm using my 14" MacBook Pro that, through my dock is getting 15W and yet is slowly being charged while using.


These MacBooks are an almost scarcely believable blend of extreme performance and efficiency. I've yet to here my fans turn on with my 14", granted I haven't really tried to push it yet.

I’ve been using MacBooks for 20 years and just always had the 15‘ - maybe now is finally the time to go to the smaller form factor! Maybe an exchange is in my future…

 

[827538]

I’ve been using MacBooks for 20 years and just always had the 15‘ - maybe now is finally the time to go to the smaller form factor! Maybe an exchange is in my future…

The 14" feels massive to me, I don't know what it is about this display that makes it feel so huge, I think the tiny bezels really help. I understand people might want the 16" but from my perspective the 14" is the perfect blend of huge screen and portability. Pushing the menu bar up and leaving the 16:10 fully open I think really makes this thing feel expansive.

I would go try one out and I think you'll be trading in the 15". This very much feels like my old 15" MacBook Pro in terms of display real estate.

 

[JPack]

The video shows him running quick benchmarks. We don’t know how it performs under sustained loads.

For the 140W adapter, the battery size hasn’t increased from the 2019 model. So fast charging isn’t likely the reason. Apple deliberately chose to go for 140W instead of applying GaN to 96W.

 

[macpot]

Everyone knows its the same chip ?

The price is so close with the same internal specs for that reason. The extra dollars are for extra screen only.

Yes, but the fans are actually a lot smaller on the 14" model, the chassis is also obviously smaller too, but beside that, the Power Adapter on the 16" is providing 45W+ more power! which is too much for the difference in battery/screen size.

I personally thought the 14" with M1 Max will be limited compared to the 16" model.

 

[Saturnine]

I haven’t watched the video so I don’t know their testing methodology. I suspect that to draw the maximum amount of power, the test would need to put maximum strain on all of the CPU cores and GPU cores simultaneously. This is actually pretty difficult to do, since one will usually bottleneck the other. It would require an almost perfect storm of a workload.

You’d then, of course, need to draw the maximum amount of power from each USB-C port, have the display brightness set to maximum and probably even need to be using the SD-card reader and speakers.

Whether all of that would draw 140W or not, I have no idea.

What I do know is that I have the 14” Max and I’ve tried stressing it as best I can. It still flies. If it turns out that it’s slower than the 16” under certain circumstances, I’m sure we’re talking low-single percentage points - and that’s absolutely fine. I’m happy to trade that for the added portability.

 

[JPack]

That is interesting! I do wonder though why Apple would ship the 140W brick if there’s no scenario where the machine can use that extra power.

I guess as Sanpete said, it may just be for fast charging the larger battery.

There are many scenarios in which the 16-inch can use that power.

Test show the M1 Max chip can consume 92W alone. That doesn’t include the monitor or other stuff attached to the TB4 ports.

 

[827538]

The video shows him running quick benchmarks. We don’t know how it performs under sustained loads.

For the 140W adapter, the battery size hasn’t increased from the 2019 model. So fast charging isn’t likely the reason. Apple deliberately chose to go for 140W instead of applying GaN to 96W.

140W is precisely for fast charging. What else would it be for?

The battery is 100Wh which is the maximum size allowed on a commercial flight. You will rarely see laptops and power banks with more. Apple won't ever include a bigger battery unless the FAA changes the rules which I highly doubt they would.

 

[827538]

I haven’t watched the video so I don’t know their testing methodology. I suspect that to draw the maximum amount of power, the test would need to put maximum strain on all of the CPU cores and GPU cores simultaneously. This is actually pretty difficult to do, since one will usually bottleneck the other. It would require an almost perfect storm of a workload.

You’d then, of course, need to draw the maximum amount of power from each USB-C port, have the display brightness set to maximum and probably even need to be using the SD-card reader and speakers.

Whether all of that would draw 140W or not, I have no idea.

What I do know is that I have the 14” Max and I’ve tried stressing it as best I can. It still flies. If it turns out that it’s slower than the 16” under certain circumstances, I’m sure we’re talking low-single percentage points - and that’s absolutely fine. I’m happy to trade that for the added portability.

At least for me I doubt I'll ever demand 100% from my 14", this thing is just so dam fast.

 

[JPack]

140W is precisely for fast charging. What else would it be for?

The battery is 100Wh which is the maximum size allowed on a commercial flight. You will rarely see laptops and power banks with more. Apple won't ever include a bigger battery unless the FAA changes the rules which I highly doubt they would.

I already said the M1 Max chip consumes 92W alone under heavy loads.

That does not include the massive 16-inch monitor nor power hungry peripherals attached to the TB4 ports.

BTW, it’s not the FAA that determines the rules, it’s an international organization called the IATA. Devices up to 160Whr can be brought onboard with carrier approval.

 

[Saturnine]

I already said the M1 Max chip consumes 92W alone under heavy loads.

That does not include the massive 16-inch monitor nor power hungry peripherals attached to the TB4 ports.

BTW, it’s not the FAA that determines the rules, it’s an international organization called the IATA. Devices up to 160Whr can be brought onboard with carrier approval.

I hasn’t thought of that. Just because a charger can charge the battery with 140W doesn’t mean the draw on the battery is 140W I suppose. It would just charge the battery more quickly.

I think the rest of my post above is still accurate though.

 

[Sanpete]

I doubt Apple would overbuild on purpose for future reasons. I'd think it would be more efficient to revise builds as needed. I've never heard of a serious laptop that can't be throttled, so I doubt we're there.

Larger chassis and fan system also affects user comfort from heat.

For the 140W adapter, the battery size hasn’t increased from the 2019 model. So fast charging isn’t likely the reason. Apple deliberately chose to go for 140W instead of applying GaN to 96W.

Charging, fast or at all, while in heavy use requires extra power. The larger brick will handle that better.

 

[JPack]

Charging, fast or at all, while in heavy use requires extra power. The larger brick will handle that better.

I agree with that. There are certainly other benefits of including a more powerful adapter. My take is, the main reason for bundling a 140W adapter is due to actual requirements from the M1 Max CPU and display. Apple is not in the habit of bundling free stuff, e.g. base 14-inch model comes with 67W.

 

[Pressure]

It’s the first charger to use the USB PD 3.1 standard that allows for fast charging at more than 100 Watt at 28V.

It’s great you can charge to 50% in 30 minutes.

 

[christof]

His thermals video is helpful to watch, too.

 

[miamialley]

I mean, Apple said this was the case when they announced them.

 

[macpot]

His thermals video is helpful to watch, too.

So it gets hotter, but performs the same!

I'll take that

 

[3Rock]

I mean, Apple said this was the case when they announced them.

Agreed, so why is there a threat on this? Of course you’re going to have a bigger battery for the screen. Larger chassis for better airflow And longer on screen time. This is a no brainer and so there’s no mystery about this