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I can tell you one thing
Big Sur is just a BIG BLOATED disaster
Catalina was better
We keep going in reverse on every OS update
12 GB of BLOAT and painfully slow boots
and your updates for all your installed apps fail to show up

Windows 10 has a much better track record for fast boots and reliability.
IME, Big Sur is mostly more reliable and slightly faster than Catalina.

11.0.1 broke Continuity for me (Watch Unlock, Universal Clipboard, basically everything), but 11.1 fixed that. There are still some issues (I'm still seeing occasional weird lag in moving the cursor around, apparently related to Bluetooth?).

But, aside from my gripes with some of the UI changes (I still can't get used to frontmost windows looking like background/disabled windows used to look), it's been fine.
 
Seriously. I hate having to uninstall a bunch of junk every time I setup a fresh windows installation.


I keep an up-to-date installation in a vm and maintain multiple machines for my family, so I’m pretty familiar with it. My biggest gripes have more to do with design than performance.
Yes I agree. Design wise is a pain in the a** to look at.
 
I honestly don't know why Microsoft doesn't work with Apple to make Boot Camp possible with ARM Windows. Perhaps in 1-2 years? Anyway, the first Intel Macs didn't have Boot Camp from day one either, so we might still see something in the future.
I suspect the current windows ARM using hardware OEM’s have some sort of exclusivity deal that is preventing Microsoft from licensing it separately, hopefully (and realistically) this will be time bound, but it may be a year or more before we see licenses
 
I got Virtualbox / Windows specifically to run Altium Circuitmaker, a free but pretty high end PCB design package. Then discovered I needed it for a bunch of Windows-only engineering packages for engineers, to work with demo boards or devices.

A nice spin off of having it was that when really needed MS Excel could buy the Windows-standalone version (don't think that exists on Mac, buying without the rest of office?) which is also a better version of Excel than the mac version.

Later moved from Virtualbox (free) => Parallels (paid) because VB was getting buggier and buggier, like they can't keep up the pace of development with new software versions and over the huge range of CPU out there.
 
Going from 4 to 8 cores showed an insignificant increase in the benchmarks, and here might be the reason why.

Unlike Intel, not all cores are equal in M1. There are 4 high performance cores and 4 low performance (aka high efficiency).

It's better to just keep these cores for macOS at this point.
 
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Was the last time you used an windows machine during Vista or something?

This reads like fanboy garbage.

Yep typical fanboy. What's fascinating to me is that my iphones have done more of that the past couple of years than any of my Windows PC's.
 
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A nice spin off of having it was that when really needed MS Excel could buy the Windows-standalone version (don't think that exists on Mac, buying without the rest of office?)

It does: https://www.microsoft.com/en-bm/microsoft-365/p/excel/cfq7ttc0k7dx?cid=msft_web_collection

(The page is a little weird. Presumably, this is Excel 2019, but there's no real mention of a version whatsoever. However, it does specifically mention macOS.)


which is also a better version of Excel than the mac version.

Yes, though they unified much of the underlying Office architecture a few years ago, and have been working towards filling the gaps. Parity does seem years off, though.
 
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What about boot camp support ??? That’s the real deal.. if M1 can support boot camp, then I will buy M1 Mac, if not... not worth it to me.
 
Errors, freezing, bad performance... sounds like typical windows to me.
So basically, what I’m hearing here is that you don’t actually use Windows. Yes, there are some bugs and issues that you run into while using Windows on a normal PC, but nothing like what was mentioned or shown in this video.
 
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It's a serious win-win for both of them to make running the ARM64 version of Windows 10 run on Apple Silicon Macs.
Yes, and Microsoft and Apple both stand A LOT to gain by collaborating to rectify this.

That was my initial gut reaction too, but thinking about it... what is in that for either Microsoft or Apple, especially if you're talking about direct booting rather than virtualisation?

A lot of people who exclusively use MacOS also buy/subscribe to MS Office and use email services that are ultimately provided by Microsoft... and I suspect that services, rather than OS sales, are increasingly the mainstay of MS's business. As for OS sales, they really don't want to tick off their huge army of OEM PC makers by collaborating with Apple to make Mac the "best Windows system". They are already walking the tightrope with their Surface range (which I'd say, as a consequence, are designed and priced specifically to compete with Apple rather than other PC makers).

What Microsoft really needs is "Microsoft Silicon" (or maybe NVIDIA Silicon, or even 'Intel Silicon') - optimised for Windows/DirectX the way that M1 is optimised for MacOS/Metal - that can be sold to PC OEMs - in which case they'll want it to be competing with Intel Core (which is an easy win) rather than Apple M1.

The reality is, died-in-the-wool Wintel users are not going to be switching en masse to Apple Silicon just because it may be "better" - if the best hardware/software always won the market everybody would be using Apples, Amigas or Acorns today, and the PC would have been laughed off stage on day one.

Meanwhile, Apple, likewise, is increasingly focussed on (a) services and (b) seamless integration between Mac/iPhone/iPad/Watch/Homekit - and the best way to sell people Apple services is to have them either using MacOS exclusively or - if they really have to have Windows compatibility - using virtualisation to run their must-have Windows Apps alongside a mostly MacOS workflow. If people spend significant time booted into Windows then they're going to look to cross-platform services and mobile devices etc. that work well with Windows (Spotify instead of Music, Dropbox/OneDrive/Google instead of iCloud, Steam instead of Arcade etc...)

So while I'm pretty sure that Win10 for ARM virtualisation is going to happen (and it looks like its 90% working already) I'm not sure that anybody has an incentive to work on direct booting.

APFS and dynamic disk partitioning renders your concerns here moot.

Does that even work with NTFS on the Windows side? Does it make re-arranging your partitions as easy as dragging the virtual disk file off onto an external drive? Cut & Paste between Windows and MacOS Apps? Snapshots (of NTFS, not APFS)?

I'm not saying it won't suffice for most, but I wouldn't go so far as saying that it's "the best" solution.
I said best "for a large proportion of users" and stand by that - unless you really need native performance (for serious creative/scientific apps, serious gaming etc.) virtualisation is far more convenient and flexible. Often, it is just one annoying bit of productivity or business/accounting/tax software, or that one obscure tool that runs fine on anything better than a 486, that means people need access to Windows. Legacy software is usually fine with legacy performance - and it's looking like M!-based virtualisation is way better than that.
 
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I dual boot my 13" MacBook Pro primarily for gaming using an eGPU. Currently I plan to upgrade to the last Intel model apple puts out (well, grab one as they phase them out) so I can keep this setup running for another few years until a suitable replacement for this use case works itself out.
The solution I'm hoping for is that with a single chip architecture across all devices game devs start writing more AAA titles for the Mac because it is just another target on top of iOS, tvOS and iPadOS. But I suspect that is pretty far out.
After that, it is hoping that MS pushes out licensable ARM builds, which I think is possible, and Apple puts out GPUs in their SoCs to support AAA titles. And of course boot camp is enabled. Easy enough for MS given their current situation but pretty hard for Apple. A competitive high end GPU is still not easy to make and harder still to add to an SoC. And then apple would need to build ARM based drivers for Windows.
The least likely, eGPU support under Windows for ARM based Macs. Same as above but more complicated. AMD would be loathe to do anything to support ARM and while NVIDIA has no qualms about ARM it is still expensive for the market I suspect. If this were to happen it is many years off when ARM becomes more prevalent as hardware for Windows.
 
Was the last time you used an windows machine during Vista or something?

This reads like fanboy garbage.
My moms PC literally blue screened rebooted and never started again just a week ago. I installed linux now it's working great no issues. Was Windows 10 all updates installed. Because I did it for her.
 
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So basically, what I’m hearing here is that you don’t actually use Windows. Yes, there are some bugs and issues that you run into while using Windows on a normal PC, but nothing like what was mentioned or shown in this video.
I use Windows frequently and manage multiple computers using it. The original comment was a joke. (Hyperbole)
 
My plan is to continue running an Intel Mac with Windows / Linux virtualization for a few more years. In that time ARM will be more powerful to just emulate Intel legacy code and ARM will be widely used for those operating systems.
 
Was the last time you used an windows machine during Vista or something?

This reads like fanboy garbage.

I use Windows 10 on the latest Surface Laptop and I get issues all the time.

It won't wake up the printer if the printer is idle. I have to reboot the laptop.

The mic randomly stops working during meetings.

Just stuff that you never see on a Macbook that eventually drives you nuts.
 
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Can anybody help me understand the use of Windows on ARM with a Mac?? Is there enough app support to justify adding the OS to an M1?
It runs 32-bit Windows programs and universal Windows programs. The beta also can run 64-bit Windows programs, so if Microsoft eventually makes this available for download, it could enable people who still need to use some Windows programs to buy Apple Silicon Macs.
 
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Microsoft will have a good idea of how may mac users are using windows on their intel based macs. It will be these people that will upgrade their mac machines to the new ARM mac's and thus want to have windows running on these machines also. There has to be enough mac window users for Microsoft to justify the cost of ARM developement for the mac. If the figures do not work in Microsoft's favor, they will not develop windows ARM for macs and will leave it for the VM companies to do it.
Parallels claims to have 6 million subscribers. Figure VMWare Fusion and VirtualBox together roughly double that total. So if there are 10-12 million Macs running Windows (out of roughly 120 million installed), at $100/license there’s around $1 billion of potential revenue, which is pretty small, but Microsoft doesn’t have to do much to make it ready since Parallels and VMWare are doing most of the work writing drivers.

The bigger questions are whether Microsoft thinks letting MacBooks run Windows on ARM will raise the profile of Windows on ARM in general, and whether it’s worth releasing when Microsoft’s own Surface Pro X is significantly slower.
 
I use Windows 10 on the latest Surface Laptop and I get issues all the time.

It won't wake up the printer if the printer is idle. I have to reboot the laptop.

The mic randomly stops working during meetings.

Just stuff that you never see on a Macbook that eventually drives you nuts.
Printer and mouse issues are occurring on M1 laptops. Along with random screen going to sleep.

Also wide screen support issues, https://www.macrumors.com/2020/12/23/apple-to-fix-ultrawide-display-m1-mac-issue/
 
I'm not surprised the jump from 4 to 8 cores didn't have as much of a performance boost. Remember the 8 cores uses 4 power cores and 4 low power cores for smaller tasks. Going from 2 to 4 cores added two more powerful cores. Going from 4 to 8 added in the low power weaker cores.

The results completely make sense.
 
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