Viruses and hijacked home page

[csubear]

The hell....of course I could, lol.

you may be one heck of a pc builder, but no you can't..

from pricewatch..(and these are the lowest bidders)

3.2 ghz Xeon x2 1590
or
3.0 ghz Xeon x2 1160

how about a p4

3.4 $475

okay thats not bad and maybe you could pull that in under 1500k
but... in ever test i have seen the dual g5 kills a 3.2 ghz p4 by 100%

how about the p4 extreme, $1038!

well anyways. from what i have seen that only thing that comes close to the g5 is dual xeons, and those are going to cost you.

That G4 1.33 couldn't even handle UT2004.....come on

yes it can handle ut2k, just not at maxed out settings. my ibook g3 could do alot of the indoor maps.

 

[dopefiend]

you may be one heck of a pc builder, but no you can't..

Ebay bro, ebay

 

[csubear]

Ebay bro, ebay

just check ebay, most new inbox ones went for 800 each, i did see a few used pairs that went for 1000, but again this is just for the procs.

you still need motherboard,case,hd,ram,sound,nic,ect... and if you are using quality stuff there is no way that i could see it happing for less than 2k. and still in most benchs that matter the g5 is faster.

and i'm talking about g5s that are due for a refresh in a month. where is intels cpus going? in the trash last time i checked. they have come to grip with the "mhz myth", and relized that overheating, long pipeplined processors are not the future. They are now moving (or moving back) to the p3 (p-pro) core. I guess we will see where that goes from here. but i think we are going to contiune to see ibm and the power/powerpc series as the performance leaders. 3 out of 3 major next gen game systems will be using them.

 

[dopefiend]

and i'm talking about g5s that are due for a refresh in a month. where is intels cpus going? in the trash last time i checked. they have come to grip with the "mhz myth", and relized that overheating, long pipeplined processors are not the future. They are now moving (or moving back) to the p3 (p-pro) core. I guess we will see where that goes from here. but i think we are going to contiune to see ibm and the power/powerpc series as the performance leaders. 3 out of 3 major next gen game systems will be using them.

I keep an eye on athlon a bit more than I really ever do Intel. Nada clue whats going on with them right now really

Jut an fyi, 1 FX-51 will take on a dual g5 pretty well and even a single opteron@2ghz(think its model 246?, not for sure on that)

you still need motherboard,case,hd,ram,sound,nic,ect... and if you are using quality stuff there is no way that i could see it happing for less than 2k. and still in most benchs that matter the g5 is faster.

Chip for 600 (just gotta be patient when shopping on ebay )
board for 2-300
case $30
hd $50
ram $200
sound $50
graphics card (whatever is left in budget)
rest of stuff <$50

edit again: Then you overclock that sucker

 

[Mav451]

Haha i dunno how this became PC vs. Dual G5 (like last summer haha).

The only thing that even comes close are the Athlon 64 940's aka "FX series" (FX-51, 53; 2.2 and 2.4Ghz, respectively). The amazing thing is that these are competitive (either ahead/behind slightly overall vs. Dual G5). Remember, these are single processors taking on a MP system from Apple!

And even better is that the Opterons (2-way and 4-way) server chips have gotten a hefty price cut! Mobos, however, are still a long ways to go before becoming cheap enough for the <$700 home built system. This area still solely belongs to the 754's, but until the 939's come, they cannot overcome the single channel memory support they have vs. the dual channel of the FX series.

Tyan Thunder K8W S2885ANRF AGP 8X AGP PRO IEEE AMD Opteron = $425
(many DO NOT have AGP...but this one does, but with a hefty price tag)


2 x Opteron 246 (2.0ghz) = $440 * 2 = $880.
These used to be ~$670+ EACH just last week until the price cut...and these prices are from a reputable dealers like Newegg. Can't say no to a juicy $230 price cut

Gigabit Lan, soundcard, etc. is onboard. This leaves:

Memory? Registered Corsair XMS can do...we'll only get 512MB to match the $2999 config for Dual 2.0's @ Apple.com

1 x 512MB Corsair XMS Registered PC3200 @ $172

DDR400 also lets the Opteron stretch its legs...I've seen far too many reviewers (both PC and Apple) who limit it by putting only DDR333 memory in there.

Vid card? Again, match Apple.com's config, that'd be only a ATi 9600 Pro.

Sapphire - ATi Radeon 9600 Pro (128MB) @ $128.
[ATi themselves no longer sell the 9600 Pro]

All PC users can sit back and laugh at the ludicrous " +$300" that Apple demands when upgrading from a 9600pro to a 9800pro. The Mac version of the 9800 Pro only seems to have 128MB RAM as well

Sapphire ATi Radeon 9800 Pro (128MB) @ $243
ATi Radeon 9800 Pro (128MB) @ $225
Maybe a $100-110 price difference...max. Apple, however, charges three times that difference

A 160GB SATA HD drive from Seagate @ $122

Want a beautiful case (Coolermaster or Lian Li)? It'll cost $150+, but its worth it.

1472 (mobo/cpu/memory) + 130 (vid) + 122 + 150 = $1874

This was a lil closer to 2500 last year, but the recent price cuts in the CPU/HD/vid card area have significantly reduced the pricing. The 2P-Opteron boards, specifically those that support AGP (and not integrated video) are much fewer...hence the $400 price tag on the Tyan.

I can guarantee you, that this will be more than competitive with the G5. If the FX-51's (single CPUs) was successful @ 2.2Ghz by itself, two CPUs @ 2.0ghz will be more than capable.

 

[dopefiend]

**bows to MAV451**

 

[thatwendigo]

And even better is that the Opterons (2-way and 4-way) server chips have gotten a hefty price cut! Mobos, however, are still a long ways to go before becoming cheap enough for the <$700 home built system. This area still solely belongs to the 754's, but until the 939's come, they cannot overcome the single channel memory support they have vs. the dual channel of the FX series.

This is what I've been trying to tell peopel for a while, though I'm glad to see someone from the PC side getting it out there. The dual Opterons are a force to be reckoned with, especially while we're sitting at 2.0ghz. Now, were the new chips to make an appearance in a month at WWDC and clock at 3.0ghz with a commensurate boost in performance... Well, the story would be a bit different.

Interesting to note that you used almost the same setup I did, though. Here's my runthrough the parts, and how I would build it. Going from the ground up, as you would have to with buying a machine from Apple:

AMD Opteron 246 x2
-2.0ghz, 1MB L2, 64bit, HyperTransport FSB
$461 x 2 = $922

Tyan Thunder K8W
-8x Single-Channel PC3200/2700/2100 RAM (maximum of 12GB)
-2x ATA133 (4 devices max)
-AGP 8x, 2x PCI-X, 2x PCI-X B, 1x PCI
-2x PS/2, 5x USB 1.1 (3 rear), 2x Firewire (1 rear) SPDIF Out, 1x COM, !x VGA, 1x LAN
-GigE onboard
-4x SATA 150 RAID 0/1/0+1
-EATX format
$436

ATI Radeon 9800 Pro 128MB 8x AGP (same model as the one in the G5)
$225

Soundblaster Audigy2 ZS Platinum Pro $206
6.1 Digital SPDIF In/Out, among other things. Admittedly better than the Apple internal sound, but the only Audigy card with digital in.
$206

Corsair XMS Twin Pack 1GB (2x DIMMs)
$289

Maxtor 250GB SATA 7200RPM
$205

Pioneer DVR-A07 DVD+rw/-RW (same model as the one in the G5)
$153

The case is difficult. There are no Lian Li or Cooler Master cases at NewEgg that can handle the 12'x13" EATX motherboard that we've chosen. As such, I chose the ThermalTake Xaser III SuperTower.
-4x 5.25", 2x 3.5" external, 6x 3.5" internal
-7 expansion slots
-USB x2, Firewire x1, audio in/out - all on front
-7 80mm fans
-Active fan controls
$120

Thermaltake Silent PurePower 560w PSU - The case doesn't have a supply.
$99

Total cost: $2655 on parts.


PowerMac dual 2.0 G5
1GB PC 3200
250GB SATA
ATI Radeon 9800 Pro 128 MB
Pioneer DVR-A07

Cost: $3645

 

[Mav451]

Haha I can't believe I forgot the DVD+/-RW drive! I guess I forget this b/c whenever i upgrade, my optical drive/sound cards almost always translate over...at the moment, I think my Nec 2500A DVD/RW and my SB Live! still have 2-3 years left. My SB Live! has seen the 800mhz TBird B (Socket A), the 1400mhz "1600+" Palomino (first gen Athlon XP), and finally my 2200mhz "2100+ overclocked" Thoroughbred (2nd gen Athlon XP)...talk about a long shelf life (a little bit over 5 years now).

I'd like a Audigy 2...but I still run my old AV300 2.1's...no reason to use a REAL card until i have a 5.1 for it support

I wish the ThermalTake case had an option with coming with Panaflos L1A's...that would be perfect

 

[thatwendigo]

Haha I can't believe I forgot the DVD+/-RW drive! I guess I forget this b/c whenever i upgrade, my optical drive/sound cards almost always translate over...at the moment, I think my Nec 2500A DVD/RW and my SB Live! still have 2-3 years left. My SB Live! has seen the 800mhz TBird B (Socket A), the 1400mhz "1600+" Palomino (first gen Athlon XP), and finally my 2200mhz "2100+ overclocked" Thoroughbred (2nd gen Athlon XP)...talk about a long shelf life (a little bit over 5 years now).

I've got a Sawtooth G4 tower with increasingly fewer stock components in it. It's got a Sonnet 1.4ghz upgrade card, a SeriTek SATA controller with a Seagate Barracuda 120GB driv, and a GeForce 3 under the hood, with a PCI dual-channel 10/100 card, too. The poor thing's about as old as your SB Live! card, and still kicking. I figure when it dies or if I make it out of debt in the next year, I'll just jump to a G5 (or G6/e600/700/whatever) and buy near top of the line to hold me another few years.

Like many mac users, I tend to use the same machine for about four years.

Oh, and you probably forgot because you don't buy whole systems. That's a simple enough reason.

I'd like a Audigy 2...but I still run my old AV300 2.1's...no reason to use a REAL card until i have a 5.1 for it support

I've got Logitech Z-540s, bought on clearance. They're nice, but not top of the line.

I wish the ThermalTake case had an option with coming with Panaflos L1A's...that would be perfect

Yeah, if I were to build a PC, the 7-8 fan option is how I'd go. Drop in the quietest fans I could get ahold of, turn them all on low, and see if I couldnt find a solution to control them directly and make them reactive to ambient case temperature.

You know... Like Apple.

 

[gekko513]

i allowed java virtual machine to install today.theres a big security issue with that .im sure that was the problem.It wasnt an offical wrestling website it was a link to read more rumors.Hear anything about a g5 imac?

I don't know where you heard that. The java virtual machine from Sun and the security mechanisms in Java are much much better than Active X, and based on security of programming languages Java is much better than any C or Basic-family language. Of course it is possible to make mistakes with Java as well, but usually the risks are higher with the alternatives.

 

[gekko513]

Nice PC Total cost: $2655 on parts.
PowerMac dual 2.0 G5 Cost: $3645

Dell Precision Workstation 450 dual 3.06 Xeon
1GB PC 3200
250GB SATA
128 MB Graphics solution
8x DVD+RW
Now from $4032

It doesn't make sense to compare a complete system with warranty and customer support with a total cost on parts from diverse internet shops.

 

[Horrortaxi]

i guess if i tried to play a far cry or metal of honor id have a bit of trouble but i really dont play those games.

I've played MOH on a 400mhz G4 and didn't have any problems. So if you did decide to play it, you'd be fine.

 

[Mav451]

You've been reading this thread and you think we've been quoting all of this from pricewatch?

All of these are available from Newegg. All of them.

CPU (2 x Opteron 246)
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=19-103-412&depa=0

Mobo - "Tiger K8W (S2875ANRF)"
(I found a 2P Opteron board from Tyan, AGP and all--and its ATX size too! Only $236, compared to the $420--the latter can hold 2 Ultra 320 SCSIs...and has 6 DIMMs vs. 4DIMMs with the $236 version, both have 4 USB 2.0 ports//2 Firewire ports)
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=13-151-125&depa=0

Memory
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=20-145-462&depa=0

HD
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=22-148-018&depa=0

DVD+/-RW
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=27-129-126&depa=0

Video card
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=14-102-291&depa=0

Dedicated sound card (no AC'97 lol)
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=29-102-164&depa=0

Case (since this is an ATX, you can use most cases out there).
http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProductDesc.asp?description=11-119-029&depa=0
(love this case, if i was building now i would use it--only $115 too)

If you didn't notice already, all are available from Newegg. Hence the reason people talk about Newegg so much. There really isn't a substitute or competitor when it comes to a better H/W distributor for home builders.

 

[nyprospect]

I had a cd from verizon which wont start if i dont use virtual machine (microsofts) i removed the j m from microsoft and installed sun anyone hear about a g5 imac?

 

[csubear]

if you can wait, then wait for the wwdc in june. we will see (well most likly see) a powermac rev, and an imac rev

btw the imac is real nice. you have to see it in person

 

[windowsblowsass]

don't worry if you do get a mac, it can do everything your pc can do, not get viri,worms,millions of pop ups, ect..., and give you an very nive user experince. plus you get a soild unix back end, if your in to that kind of stuff.

no actually your mac cant do one ting which is crash constantly
switch and say goodbye to bluescreens

 

[nyprospect]

Man this thread got scarey lol I just wanted know if going from this pcto a mac is worth it.uh it think

 

[Mav451]

Well, list your reasons for switching/notswitching; 10 reasons for each side. If the whole virus/spyware thing is a major reason there for you, then you already have quite a few reasons to switch. If those are your SOLE reasons to switch, ask what else you can benefit from switching.

If all you ask for is a "simple" experience, then the Mac is for you. If you are even slightly considering the latest games on the horizon (Doom, Half life 2) or are even consider yourself a gamer, this decision may be slightly harder.

If you don't game at all? Again, Mac is for you then. You haven't really specified software you NEED to use, so i don't think crossing over will be an issue at all.

 

[FuzzyBallz]

You don't have to restore system, nor spend $1800 on a new system just to fix the spyware/virus problem. Since you're running WinXP Pro, turn on the built-in firewall. That will cut down on 99% of virus and hack attacks. If you want more security, get ZoneAlarm personal. It's free. Next, if you're running Internet Explorer, stop. Get FireFox from mozilla.org and turn on the built-in pop-up blocker. And finally, to get rid of the spyware and adware, get Spybot and Ad-Aware. Both free, and will help you take out virtually all the common spyware on your PC.

no actually your mac cant do one ting which is crash constantly
switch and say goodbye to bluescreens

And say hello to the black screen of death, the kernel panic? When's the last time you've owned or used a PC? There's no BSOD anymore, not when you're running WinXP and don't act like a noob and go around installing all sorts of crap on your system. I actually don't remember the last time WinXP crashed on me, or flipped me off w/ the BSOD. And I use my PC just as much as my Mac... Mmm... makes you wonder why some people are prone to problems.

 

[nyprospect]

I wanted to switch because i like macs os x.Viruses annoy me and the constant windows updates.I dont use much softwear.I listen to music and surf.I also would like a power pc that is stable.Even if i dont game id like a pretty fast machine just in case i want to play.Normally i just use my ps2 although vice city was better on pc.Is the mac os user friendly?.Will mac one day be obsolete.Ive seen the g5 g4 and imacs upclose an they all feel very nice..It may seem stupid to some regulars but im being extra careful.I want to make sure switching wont be a big fiasco

 

[nyprospect]

Ive used windows xp for 2 years now and have nver seen the blue screen.on win98 only.I do have spybot.allso my connection is firewalled.I also use the msn premium with pop up blocker.the problem was that i installed the old ms java machine.

 

[thatwendigo]

Dell Precision Workstation 450 dual 3.06 Xeon
1GB PC 3200
250GB SATA
128 MB Graphics solution
8x DVD+RW
Now from $4032

It doesn't make sense to compare a complete system with warranty and customer support with a total cost on parts from diverse internet shops.

Pssssst... READ MY OLD POSTS!

The specific discussion that MAV and were having was one of particular parts for building machines that aren't exactly in the mainstream yet. When I do a retail comparison, it's almost universally with Dell, because they're the only other OEM to be turning a profit right now. So, how about we stick with the basic thrust of of what the conversation was, and allow that the discussion was on a parts-only basis (which I specified, if you bother to look) that was gathered from a single site and not "diverse internet shops."

Oi.

 

[gekko513]

So, how about we stick with the basic thrust of of what the conversation was, and allow that the discussion was on a parts-only basis (which I specified, if you bother to look) that was gathered from a single site and not "diverse internet shops."

So then the G5s from Apple are out of the comparison because they are not at all parts only Oi!

And to the nyprospect: You can be sure that the Apple/OSX platform will not be obsolete any time soon. The platform is more alive and kicking than it's been since the early 90's. (Sorry if I use the expression in a wrong setting, but you all get the point, I suppose )

 

[csubear]

and mac os x is easy to use, easier that win (insert version here).

 

[thatwendigo]

So then the G5s from Apple are out of the comparison because they are not at all parts only Oi!

I'm just going to assume that you understood my point, since I'm one of the staunchest hardware defenders on the board. That being said, I'm also a realist. The dual Opteron system I priced out is just about the best comparison to what a G5 might cost in parts alone, though it probably needs a 20-30% markup to more accurately resemble the higher prices Apple pays for processors, designing boards and interfaces, and for the modified graphics cards.

$2,500 * 1.33 = $3,325

If Apple is selling these machines at $2,999, then that's pretty impressive.