Watch OS7 loss of hardware feature on AW3, AW4 and AW5

[earthdog]

Yes I have read Apple is deprecating Force Touch (aka Long Press). In my case I have always since inception of the AW0 used this feature to clear notifications. I just don’t understand the logic of removing access to HARDWARE functionality. I realize I could NOT upgrade to IOS14 but its not right to deprecate hardware features for which you have paid. I could understand hardware going forward will no longer have the functionality. But this is just plain wrong.

Here is my argument: I own a Tesla and I bought it with the Hardware and Software support for Cruise Control. Tesla says well if you want to run our new software with added functionality for whatever (improved battery range) then you have to give up the Cruise Control you previously paid for.

It’s like Apple saying your Touch ID won’t work on your iPhone 8 with IOS14. But, you can install IOS14 on the iPhone 8. I believe they are obligated to support the hardware they sold you if the device is supported in the current OS or just don’t support the device.


Just my opinion.

 

[mnsportsgeek]

Is "clear all" notifications gone entirely? If so, that's sad.

 

[earthdog]

Is "clear all" notifications gone entirely? If so, that's sad.

On BETA 1 yes. I am hoping if there is enough of a fuss they will bring it back.

 

[TheSkywalker77]

I am hoping if there is enough of a fuss they will bring it back.

Use the Feedback app! I know people like to say it doesn't do anything, but it can't hurt to try.

 

[mnsportsgeek]

On BETA 1 yes. I am hoping if there is enough of a fuss they will bring it back.

Ya they really should bring a Haptic Touch to it like on the iPhones that lost 3D Touch. Losing the ability to clear all notification would be really annoying.

 

[Nimbus134]

Is "clear all" notifications gone entirely? If so, that's sad.

It’s still there but at the top.

 

[nickdalzell1]

On a recent update to the Gear S3 watch I still have, to clear all notifications you simply swipe up from the bottom. I wish they'd bring that to Apple Watch.

 

[Futhark]

Clear all is at the top but unfortunately if like myself you get lots of notifications it can be a long scroll to the top. I loved the force tap to clear all

 

[Dulcimer]

That they’ve removed this feature suggests to me that AW6 might feature some interesting display changes. Thinner display to aid with thinning device or new display technology? Ultimately it could just be a cost reduction after seeing his little it’s used by most people.

 

[Monkswhiskers]

That they’ve removed this feature suggests to me that AW6 might feature some interesting display changes. Thinner display to aid with thinning device or new display technology? Ultimately it could just be a cost reduction after seeing his little it’s used by most people.

Yep, it says new display tech coming I reckon, and to be uniform across the range.
I don't care about native sleep tracking or improved dancing metrics (wtf! how can you laud that as a standout feature?) I'll stick with watchOS6 ta.

 

[matrix07]

Clear all is at the top but unfortunately if like myself you get lots of notifications it can be a long scroll to the top. I loved the force tap to clear all

Can you long press?

 

[dsdevries]

Apple removed 3d touch or force touch because they realized it was a huge mistake to create it in the first place.

In order to distinguish between a regular tap and a long press you can evaluate the duration really quick right after the finger releases. Users will have to hold their finger for a specific amount of time in order to perform a long press, but after that this doesn’t cause a noticeable delay for any of the two inputs. For 3D touch however, you always need to hardcode a set delay to allow people to actually press through. This created a noticeable delay for both inputs. So in theory, 3d touch basically makes your primary input much slower in order to make the secondary just marginally faster.

But this principle is bad anyways, because on iOS, people open their apps from their homescreen multiple times a day, but they hardly ever delete them or move them around. You don't want to give up the speed of a primary input. They can generally perform a single press in just a few mu seconds. A delay of just a single millisecond is very annoying during day to day activities.

And that is just the theory. Because in reality, the problems with 3D Touch are even worse. Apple thought the trade off would be worth it. But it turns out that for most people the time it takes from the moment the finger touches the screen to the point where they apply enough force to activate the 3D Touch, takes even longer than the set delay you would need to activate a long press. So in reality, 3D Touch makes both your primary AND your secondary input slower.

Besides that, people are also generally not so comfortable with applying more force than usual to a glass screen of a € 1400,- phone. On top of this, the 3d touch screens are also slightly thicker and heavier.

 

[Mr.Blacky]

Apple removed 3d touch or force touch because they realized it was a huge mistake to create it in the first place.

In order to distinguish between a regular tap and a long press you can evaluate the duration really quick right after the finger releases. Users will have to hold their finger for a specific amount of time in order to perform a long press, but after that this doesn’t cause a noticeable delay for any of the two inputs. For 3D touch however, you always need to hardcode a set delay to allow people to actually press through. This created a noticeable delay for both inputs. So in theory, 3d touch basically makes your primary input much slower in order to make the secondary just marginally faster.

But this principle is bad anyways, because on iOS, people open their apps from their homescreen multiple times a day, but they hardly ever delete them or move them around. You don't want to give up the speed of a primary input. They can generally perform a single press in just a few mu seconds. A delay of just a single millisecond is very annoying during day to day activities.

And that is just the theory. Because in reality, the problems with 3D Touch are even worse. Apple thought the trade off would be worth it. But it turns out that for most people the time it takes from the moment the finger touches the screen to the point where they apply enough force to activate the 3D Touch, takes even longer than the set delay you would need to activate a long press. So in reality, 3D Touch makes both your primary AND your secondary input slower.

Besides that, people are also generally not so comfortable with applying more force than usual to a glass screen of a € 1400,- phone. On top of this, the 3d touch screens are also slightly thicker and heavier.

3D touch is way faster than a long press. And it also doesn't make a regular tap slower. Don't know where you got this from.

 

[Futhark]

Can you long press?

Unfortunately not. Long press just takes you into the App your finger happens to be covering when trying a long press to clear all

 

[oeagleo]

Honestly, the "new" watch OS is really disappointing. I mean, come on, a "Hand washing timer"???? Other than that "breakthrough" technology, what else is there, really? Oh, yeah, everyone out there that codes for the watch has to figure out how to reach the sub-menus without using force touch. And the "sleep tracking"? Sorry, but just about every other watch that offers sleep tracking (and there's a genuine plethora of them) is able to tell the difference between light, deep, and REM sleep, why is Apple incapable of determining this?

Come on Apple, you're better than this; prove it.

 

[Futhark]

Honestly, the "new" watch OS is really disappointing. I mean, come on, a "Hand washing timer"???? Other than that "breakthrough" technology, what else is there, really? Oh, yeah, everyone out there that codes for the watch has to figure out how to reach the sub-menus without using force touch. And the "sleep tracking"? Sorry, but just about every other watch that offers sleep tracking (and there's a genuine plethora of them) is able to tell the difference between light, deep, and REM sleep, why is Apple incapable of determining this?

Come on Apple, you're better than this; prove it.

I’m hoping for the Awake, Light Sleep, REM & Deep Sleep like the third party apps like Pillow provide.

 

[parseckadet]

Honestly, the "new" watch OS is really disappointing. I mean, come on, a "Hand washing timer"???? Other than that "breakthrough" technology, what else is there, really? Oh, yeah, everyone out there that codes for the watch has to figure out how to reach the sub-menus without using force touch. And the "sleep tracking"? Sorry, but just about every other watch that offers sleep tracking (and there's a genuine plethora of them) is able to tell the difference between light, deep, and REM sleep, why is Apple incapable of determining this?

Come on Apple, you're better than this; prove it.

You do understand that the pandemic has likely affected what Apple is able to accomplish this year right? I'm guessing they've had to cut things.

 

[oeagleo]

You do understand that the pandemic has likely affected what Apple is able to accomplish this year right? I'm guessing they've had to cut things.

They had time/personnel to implement the "Hand washing timer" technology, complete with the audio ability to determine if water is running.... (Yeah, that's a good one for me, so many other things they could have directed their energy toward) Don't get me wrong, I love my Apple watch, I'm just truly disappointed in their "implementation of tecchnology" this time around. Rather than time hand washing why not work on SpO2 detection/monitoring, something that would actually DO something toward identifying the Covid-19 virus, by watching the oxygen in your bloodstream, and noticing when the O2 levels drop precipitously, indicating a lessening of lung function???? The technology is out there, ask Fitbit, Garmin, and I believe a few others.

 

[parseckadet]

They had time/personnel to implement the "Hand washing timer" technology, complete with the audio ability to determine if water is running.... (Yeah, that's a good one for me, so many other things they could have directed their energy toward) Don't get me wrong, I love my Apple watch, I'm just truly disappointed in their "implementation of tecchnology" this time around. Rather than time hand washing why not work on SpO2 detection/monitoring, something that would actually DO something toward identifying the Covid-19 virus, by watching the oxygen in your bloodstream, and noticing when the O2 levels drop precipitously, indicating a lessening of lung function???? The technology is out there, ask Fitbit, Garmin, and I believe a few others.

Likely because the hand washing thing was something that they could do relatively quickly. SpO2 has a ton of challenges, one of which is likely FDA approval, especially using it to diagnose anything. Hell, just the IDEA of being able use it to detect COVID-19 was only proposed a few months ago. Are you seriously suggesting Apple should be able to take an idea on medical testing from theory to widely available beta in less than 6 months, especially when that would likely require new hardware?

My guess is sleep tracking got scaled back, other features got scrubbed all together. Timelines had to give somewhere, and given everything we saw with the other platforms, I suspect watchOS was the most heavily impacted. And I can't say I would disagree with such a decision.

 

[matrix07]

but just about every other watch that offers sleep tracking (and there's a genuine plethora of them) is able to tell the difference between light, deep, and REM sleep, why is Apple incapable of determining this?

I don’t disagree with you on your main point but this, you have to be fair to Apple. It’s like saying, 7 years ago, that premium Android phones can have face unlocking why can’t Apple do one. For all we know the data we’re seeing in today sleep-tracking apps might not be as accurate as Apple would have like, or Apple think it needs some hardware to help it being more accurate and up to the standard of Apple.
You have to remember this is the company that was/is sued right and left. No one will sue some independent devs because his/her apps is not accurate or up to the standard but they will sue Apple if they find that.

 

[Futhark]

I don’t disagree with you on your main point but this, you have to be fair to Apple. It’s like saying, 7 years ago, that premium Android phones can have face unlocking why can’t Apple do one. For all we know the data we’re seeing in today sleep-tracking apps might not be as accurate as Apple would have like, or Apple think it needs some hardware to help it being more accurate and up to the standard of Apple.
You have to remember this is the company that was/is sued right and left. No one will sue some independent devs because his/her apps is not accurate or up to the standard but they will sue Apple if they find that.

It’s funny you say this as my partner gave a third party app another go last night which should register the different sleep levels etc. She got up middle of the night a few time to use the toilet and see to a crying child and these were not logged as being away she was showing as being in deep sleep

 

[oeagleo]

It’s funny you say this as my partner gave a third party app another go last night which should register the different sleep levels etc. She got up middle of the night a few time to use the toilet and see to a crying child and these were not logged as being away she was showing as being in deep sleep

Granted not all sleep apps are perfect, in fact, I've learned that for any of them to be fairly accurate, they have to "learn" your sleep patterns, which takes a week or two of use. Given that, the one's I've used, including hardware, (Garmin, and Samsung) have proven pretty accurate after using them for a week or two. I can tell when I get up at night for a restroom break, if I'm in that "Sleeping stupor", I was probably in deep sleep mode, but if I wake up, fairly coherent, it's probable that I was in light sleep. REM is but momentary, and fleeting, but my point is, how can virtually every other device maker be able to track these, consistently among themselves, (Garmin aligns with Samsung, aligns with Sleepwatch, etc) and Apple can't figure out how to do that?

 

[nickdalzell1]

Samsung used to suck at sleep tracking a couple of years ago, only fixed by recent watch updates. My issue then was if you woke up to pee, the watch interpreted that as 'you woke up' and even if you go back to sleep, it resets the total time you slept and it only counted the hours since I woke up to pee as 'your total sleep time.' So, if I had to do a bio-break at 3AM, and woke up for real at 7AM, it showed my sleep record as 'slept for 4 hours at 56% efficiency'.

I recently started using my Galaxy Watch and Motorola phone since my iPhone has had serious SMS issues lately, so they apparently have fixed that in updates. Watch got an update pretty fast that added 'Bixby' and a few other things, such as 'swipe up to clear all notifications' which beats the Apple implentation, and am enjoying the accurate sleep tracking, which correctly shows one sleep record, no breaks or resets in between. Before, however, it got annoying when S-Health complained that I wasn't getting enough sleep and do x,y,z to improve it.

 

[oeagleo]

Samsung used to suck at sleep tracking a couple of years ago, only fixed by recent watch updates. My issue then was if you woke up to pee, the watch interpreted that as 'you woke up' and even if you go back to sleep, it resets the total time you slept and it only counted the hours since I woke up to pee as 'your total sleep time.' So, if I had to do a bio-break at 3AM, and woke up for real at 7AM, it showed my sleep record as 'slept for 4 hours at 56% efficiency'.

I recently started using my Galaxy Watch and Motorola phone since my iPhone has had serious SMS issues lately, so they apparently have fixed that in updates. Watch got an update pretty fast that added 'Bixby' and a few other things, such as 'swipe up to clear all notifications' which beats the Apple implentation, and am enjoying the accurate sleep tracking, which correctly shows one sleep record, no breaks or resets in between. Before, however, it got annoying when S-Health complained that I wasn't getting enough sleep and do x,y,z to improve it.

Samsung will still do that occasionally, and I've found that the only way I can consistently stop it from breaking up in the middle of the night is to enable "Sleep mode" on the watch (Galaxy Active 2). Otherwise, if I have my hand on a pillow, or on the bed long enough to trigger the screen, or move it, the watch thinks I'm awake, and re-starts the sleep cycle. The "sleep mode" disables touches, and swipes on the Active 2, so that isn't a problem any longer. Although it will think that I've woken up if I'm longer than it thinks I should be during a "bio break"..

 

[nickdalzell1]

I'm using a Gear S3 Classic with the most recent update (surprised they still support it!) and whatever issues it had it appears fixed, at least for me. I have an Active (didn't know they made a '2' version, our stores only show the Galaxy Watch and Galaxy Watch Active) but it's more a replacement for my Apple Watch and paired to a Moto phone, does my payments and messages, that's it.