We make too many excuses for Apple

[jimkingwood]

'Twas always thus - but they've always had the traditional hardcore Macolytes who long ago drank the Kool-Aid - back when they thought themselves cool to be basement-dwelling computer hobbyists, who chose to be one of the few who had a Macintosh or PowerBook; and who continue to blame the users for posted issues on Apple's Support Forums, rather than admit there's a problem. And Apple has always used that wall of defence, until an issue becomes so big that it hits the popular Media and they are forced to fix it.

As for this thread on the Air Forum, let's not forget that it was the 2018 model that Apple actually made less-useful - removing MagSafe and a majority of the ports in favour of two new previously unused ones that required users to go the additional (expensive) dongle route in order to maintain any sort of 'legacy' connectivity (and that, hardly the first time) - negating the value of the original device as seen slipped into a Manilla envelope. Oh sure, you might not need every port , or every day - but they were there. Built-in. And when some complained of this lapse, the rabid Macolytes came to Apple's defence once again -
"Yeah, but ya got a Retina screen!"
Like that justified making the Air less capable. And, as ever, anyone who disagreed were Losers who didn't deserve to have an Apple product.

The breathless reviews by some of the online and print magazines and newspapers regarding each next OS feature show that there are still those (fanfolk or paid to) who ignore the lapses rather than challenge Apple to be better. And that does no one (even Apple) any favours.

Lihp8270 Really said it, above. No one wants all the crap ports to reappear at the expense of size and cost, and for which most users don't use most of. Like he/she, I have a dock at my station with a single C plugin to my MBP. I only really use the dock for an HDMI video plugin and the occasional but infrequent USB.

I remember all the Apple jealousers - including the box box store team members - sneering when I bought a couple of the first Macs not to have diskette drives. I experienced open sneering "Why would you buy something you can't even load software from??" And of course the diskettes disappeared within a few months for CD's and online downloading.​

 

[jimkingwood]

Apple has lost its way

I've heard this incessantly since I bought the first 64K Mac all those years ago.

 

[ascender]

I can't believe "dongle life" is still being talked about 5 years after usb-c came to the MBP. Apple will never be able to please everyone, but I quite like the fact you have four thunderbolt 3 ports on the MBP and you can use any of them for anything. So many more peripherals are coming with usb-c cables as standard now and its great when traveling as you can just take one power price for your laptop, phone, iPad, Apple Watch. Or just charge them all off your laptop itself.

But I also get some people want a laptop with built-in SD card reader slot and HDMI port. If only Apple could expand its lineup and have two options on the MBP - one loaded with all the extra ports and one with just TB3.

 

[doolar]

I can't believe "dongle life" is still being talked about 5 years after usb-c came to the MBP. Apple will never be able to please everyone, but I quite like the fact you have four thunderbolt 3 ports on the MBP and you can use any of them for anything. So many more peripherals are coming with usb-c cables as standard now and its great when traveling as you can just take one power price for your laptop, phone, iPad, Apple Watch. Or just charge them all off your laptop itself.

But I also get some people want a laptop with built-in SD card reader slot and HDMI port. If only Apple could expand its lineup and have two options on the MBP - one loaded with all the extra ports and one with just TB3.

This is my reasoning too, for myself. I don't really connect much to my computer these days. Sure, I do need to connect somethings sometimes, but it's not a daily thing, at least not on the go. At home and at the office I have TB3 docks that are permanently connected to monitor, keyboard, mouse and peripherals. I connect one cable to my Macbook, and off I go.

For me, the USB-C/TB thing has been a bit of a blessing. I travel a lot for work, these days I only need one power adapter to charge everything from my computer to Iphone, Ipad, headphones. I only need two cable types, USB-C and Lightning usually. When traveling with my motorcycle I also need a micro-USB cable. My powerbank can charge everything, including my laptop.

Go back to the Magsafe-Mac times and I had to have a separate charger that could ONLY charge my computer. Also it was nigh on impossible to charge a Mac from any powerbank, a wall socket was always needed. When I docked my 2015 MBP I had to use two cables, one for the dock and one for power.

For me - this "new" port arrangement ment less cables, less charging bricks. My bag with peripherals is smaller and lighter. And since I don't use SD-cards that often (have one in my motorcycle navi and one in my Nintendo Switch) I don't miss the SD-slot (but I wouldn't mind it of course, as long as it doesn't steal space).

HDMI? Extremely rare that I use on the move - but I have a cheap USB-C dongle with HDMI on it.

Would it be more convenient with a USB-A port on the Macbook? Yes, absolutely. But that connector needs to die, and if any company can get the ball rolling, it's Apple. I'll take it for the greater good.

And lastly - Magsafe. I do not miss Magsafe one bit. Annoying proprietary connector that frayed in the end which made me have to buy a whole new brick. Sure, it can be solved with a removable USB-C type cable with Magsafe on the other end. But I don't want it - at least not at the expense of USB-C PD charging.

I do realize that others have other needs and wants, but for me, I'm good with the current port selection - even on my new M1 Mac that only have two ports vs my old machine that had four.

 

[subjonas]

Hey guys just thinking that Apple is truly something else and it is because the Apple community allows them to get away with all kinds of things. From chargers left out from iphones and to lack of ports. Why would Apple even think it would be a good idea to promote dongle life? Dongles take away from the beauty of the macbooks. All the macbooks should have a micro sd card slot using a tray slot similar to the iphone that can allow for the insertion of the micro sd card itself (no adapter). Heck that same slot should double for a sim card too given the increased need for meetings and data. The Thinkpad X1 line has a slot with this combo. If Apple had taken this approach heck it would have reduced use of dongles and the early bricking of the M1s would have likely been avoided too.

So annoyed with Apple right now and the fanboys that applaud their every move.

Apple has always annoyed people compared to other companies. That’s because Apple has always had very specific viewpoints and very strong resolve about what makes a good product and user experience, so of course they will clash with those who disagree with their views. Most other companies, however, rely more on catering to customer demands, so there is less reason for clash. But the more a company caters to customer demands, the more their products invariably lose focus. Designing “by committee” rarely ever produces anything great, only passable. But Apple doesn’t just want passable, so this is why Apple will probably always be at odds with certain would-be customers. But Apple’s resolve/stubbornness is half the reason for their success, the other key half being that their viewpoints are usually ultimately right as far as the masses are concerned. They can’t please everyone, and they can’t please everyone completely, but they can try to make the best products possible for the most number of people. Sometimes they‘re wrong, but their long running financial and cultural success suggests they’re usually right. People write off their success, saying it’s because people are sheep, brainwashed by Apple’s marketing. And that’s possible, and almost certainly the case for some. But if they state that factually as the main reason, without acknowledging that it could alternatively be that for most of Apple’s customer base, Apple delivers products that better fulfill their wants/needs over competitors, then it’s a pretty blatantly biased hand wave.

Also your annoyance with fanboys is misplaced. They are not the reason Apple “gets away” with anything. The outspoken techies with emotional attachment to Apple that you see on the internet are a tiny fraction of Apple’s customer base. If you want to blame the customers responsible for Apple’s success, then you’d have to go out into the world and admonish all the regular people living their lives using their Apple devices who don’t bother to think or talk much about their Apple devices.

I have to say, what actually perplexes me in the first place is that people can get annoyed at a company for simply not selling what they want to buy. When I want to buy something and it doesn’t exist exactly how I want it, I can only get annoyed at the situation. I don’t understand blaming companies in a free market for not being what I want them to be. What obligation do they have to me?

 

[ascender]

Apple has always annoyed people compared to other companies. That’s because Apple has always had very specific viewpoints and very strong resolve about what makes a good product and user experience, so of course they will clash with those who disagree with their views.

I suspect they'd annoy customers less by just making more products which would give consumers more options, but they don't work like that.

So you could have a 13" and 15" MacBook Air - immediately you have a larger screen option for people who don't need the extra power (and cost) of a MBP 16".

A 12/13" ultrabook with a couple of ports for people who want ultimate portability without having to use an iPad.

MBPs you could even have two models in each screen size. A "lightweight" one with fewer ports and a thinner chassis and then larger ones with every port under the sun.

 

[subjonas]

I suspect they'd annoy customers less by just making more products which would give consumers more options, but they don't work like that.

So you could have a 13" and 15" MacBook Air - immediately you have a larger screen option for people who don't need the extra power (and cost) of a MBP 16".

A 12/13" ultrabook with a couple of ports for people who want ultimate portability without having to use an iPad.

MBPs you could even have two models in each screen size. A "lightweight" one with fewer ports and a thinner chassis and then larger ones with every port under the sun.

Sure, more options would be great for us consumers! One of my ideal devices would be a 13” MBA with some kind of 360 hinge and Pencil support. There are a ton of things I wish Apple made or made differently. But whatever their reasons may be, Apple chooses to only make what they make. And so far their decisions have been largely successful. So the OP is partially right in saying that we are allowing Apple to do what they’re doing, just as we do for any company by giving them money and keeping them in existence. Where the OP is wrong is putting the blame on Apple and Apple fanboys. It’s the consumer masses, not the company and not any one group of consumers, that decides whether a company’s decisions succeed or fail.
It’s of course fine to express wishes and air frustration at a situation, but it’s the actually blaming specific parties that I find nonsensical.

 

[R.T.J.]

Hey guys just thinking that Apple is truly something else and it is because the Apple community allows them to get away with all kinds of things. From chargers left out from iphones and to lack of ports. Why would Apple even think it would be a good idea to promote dongle life? Dongles take away from the beauty of the macbooks. All the macbooks should have a micro sd card slot using a tray slot similar to the iphone that can allow for the insertion of the micro sd card itself (no adapter). Heck that same slot should double for a sim card too given the increased need for meetings and data. The Thinkpad X1 line has a slot with this combo. If Apple had taken this approach heck it would have reduced use of dongles and the early bricking of the M1s would have likely been avoided too.

So annoyed with Apple right now and the fanboys that applaud their every move.

The sad truth is that there are a lot of people with poor existences and no personality and the only thing that give them the identity they wish to have the brand they buy. It is called fanatism and is the solution for the weak-minded to go through the world. They create alter egos and they think "this is me" and when you go over the problems with that brand they attack you. That is why you find discussions that end up in confrontations because you are dealing with dysfunctional individuals who lack social skills.

 

[subjonas]

The sad truth is that there are a lot of people with poor existences and no personality and the only thing that give them the identity they wish to have the brand they buy. It is called fanatism and is the solution for the weak-minded to go through the world. They create alter egos and they think "this is me" and when you go over the problems with that brand they attack you. That is why you find discussions that end up in confrontations because you are dealing with dysfunctional individuals who lack social skills.

Yes, those people exist, but they aren’t the ones allowing Apple to do as they wish. That was the erroneous premise in the OP’s post. The chatter in online forums have no effect on Apple. The ONLY thing that allows Apple to do as they wish is the money of the mass consumer. Unless OP is saying that the majority or significant percentage of Apple’s consumer base is fanatical.

 

[millerj123]

The sad truth is that there are a lot of people with poor existences and no personality and the only thing that give them the identity they wish to have the brand they buy. It is called fanatism and is the solution for the weak-minded to go through the world. They create alter egos and they think "this is me" and when you go over the problems with that brand they attack you. That is why you find discussions that end up in confrontations because you are dealing with dysfunctional individuals who lack social skills.

It seems that could apply to just about anyone, anywhere.

I buy Apple when both the costs and the benefits outweigh all other options. When they don't, I buy what does.

 

[Pakaku]

I can't believe "dongle life" is still being talked about 5 years after usb-c came to the MBP. Apple will never be able to please everyone, but I quite like the fact you have four thunderbolt 3 ports on the MBP and you can use any of them for anything. So many more peripherals are coming with usb-c cables as standard now and its great when traveling as you can just take one power price for your laptop, phone, iPad, Apple Watch. Or just charge them all off your laptop itself.

But I also get some people want a laptop with built-in SD card reader slot and HDMI port. If only Apple could expand its lineup and have two options on the MBP - one loaded with all the extra ports and one with just TB3.

Why not include both "legacy ports" and a bunch of TB3 ports? Macbooks aren't exactly low on space for port slots, and I doubt it would cost Apple much to include something for everyone.

I think the only reason we had TB3-only Macbooks was to force the industry to adapt to the new port. We're beyond that point now, so it should be no problem to bring back some "legacy" ports now.

 

[ghanwani]

I buy Apple when both the costs and the benefits outweigh all other options. When they don't, I buy what does.

I think this is mostly subjective. How much of a premium are you willing to pay to have all your devices play nicely? How much of a premium are you willing to pay for familiarity with Apple devices? If you care about such things, there is no alternative.

 

[ian87w]

Hey guys just thinking that Apple is truly something else and it is because the Apple community allows them to get away with all kinds of things. From chargers left out from iphones and to lack of ports. Why would Apple even think it would be a good idea to promote dongle life? Dongles take away from the beauty of the macbooks. All the macbooks should have a micro sd card slot using a tray slot similar to the iphone that can allow for the insertion of the micro sd card itself (no adapter). Heck that same slot should double for a sim card too given the increased need for meetings and data. The Thinkpad X1 line has a slot with this combo. If Apple had taken this approach heck it would have reduced use of dongles and the early bricking of the M1s would have likely been avoided too.

So annoyed with Apple right now and the fanboys that applaud their every move.

About dongles. I don't know where have you been, but pretty much most ultrabooks Windows laptops use dongles as well. Dongles are a necessity if you want thin and light. At least with Apple, they went with versatile ports like USB-C instead of one trick pony ports like HDMI. I have an old Lenovo laptop, and it has one USB3, one USB2, and micro-HDMI. That's worse, as the only versatile port is that single USB3. Besides, how often do you actually use any dongles? With OneDrive, I don't even use USB flash drives anymore.

And microSD? Most pro digital cameras use regular SD card anyway, so micro is less useful imo.

And if you like the Thinkpad X1 so much, go get it. It's a decent laptop (although another user seems to be having huge quality control problem that he/she decided to get a Dell instead... ) Kinda pointless ranting about MacBook Air if you wanted the Thinkpad X1...

 

[ian87w]

Why not include both "legacy ports" and a bunch of TB3 ports? Macbooks aren't exactly low on space for port slots, and I doubt it would cost Apple much to include something for everyone.

I think the only reason we had TB3-only Macbooks was to force the industry to adapt to the new port. We're beyond that point now, so it should be no problem to bring back some "legacy" ports now.

I'd rather have more USB-C ports than single-utility "legacy" ports. USB-C is much more versatile.

the only annoying thing with current Apple silicon MacBooks is that Apple put both USB-C port on one side. They should've put one on each side.

 

[ascender]

Why not include both "legacy ports" and a bunch of TB3 ports? Macbooks aren't exactly low on space for port slots, and I doubt it would cost Apple much to include something for everyone.

I think the only reason we had TB3-only Macbooks was to force the industry to adapt to the new port. We're beyond that point now, so it should be no problem to bring back some "legacy" ports now.

Because any additional ports have an impact on the physical design and available space on the inside.

Apple know the habits of their users better than anyone, so its difficult on a forum like this to debate things objectively because we don't what everybody else's workflow looks like and what their port needs are.