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Originally posted by lmalave
And don't even get me started about the oldsters who scream bloody murder about Social security when they paid a less than 1% tax, and we're stuck footing their bill at almost 8%. And savings? Naaaawww. They're all, like: we didn't know we had to save - we thought Social Security would take care of us. Which all wouldn't be a problem if American kids took care of their elders like EVERY other culture does :mad:

Thing is, the current state of affairs is a very forseeable consequence of a policy I feel fairly certain you would have agreed to at the time.

During the depression, old people were screwed. Their kids could not afford to take care of them, they couldn't get work, and the pensions their ancestors had relied upon in old age vanished overnight as the companies supplying those pensions crumbled(*).

Social Security came about because the alternative was to let old people starve to death in huge numbers. Because preparations had not been made throughout the oldsters' lives, the money had to come from the current working generation. This wasn't a problem at the time. The retired population was much smaller compared to the working population.

But people started having fewer kids (which seems to be the general trend for developed nations), and medical technology advanced, and now the elderly are the fastest growing segment of our population. In the meantime, because we had Social Security, companies after the Depression generally stopped providing comprehensive pension plans for most workers. And working adults didn't have to switch over and take extraordinary measures to support their elderly relatives, because the government had stepped in and offered a reasonable solution (at the time).

Now we're stuck with it. You can't cut off the elderly, because they haven't made preparations. And besides, if you want to win elections, you don't piss off the elderly. Old people vote, in huge numbers. It's much easier to convince the working adults that the Social Security they pay today is being saved for their own retirement down the road. This is, of course, a bald-faced lie. Whenever you hear someone referring to the "Social Security Trust Fund" that person is lying to you. There is no reserve of money, even on paper, for future Social Security. Social Security depends directly on the ability to take enough from current working adults to pay out benefits to current retired adults. The former population is shrinking. The latter, growing. Thus the percentage which must be appropriated increases rapidly, and will increase more rapidly as time goes on.

The only thing that can possibly rescue us from this mess is the fact that hardly anybody under 35 or so expects they will ever see a dime of Social Security, so they're forced to actually prepare for their own retirements.

This should be a lesson for us in the future. We must be careful when our politicians come up with these brilliant solutions to emergency situations. Social Security should have been temporary, but the designers neglected to include an exit strategy.

(*) Sound familiar? Enron, perhaps? It's important to note that one of the major reforms of the Depression was a law that restricted the same company from providing both auditing and consulting services. That law was stricken during the Reagan administration, at which point Arthur Andersen went into the auditing+consulting business and the rest is history.
 
Originally posted by Gelfin
This should be a lesson for us in the future. We must be careful when our politicians come up with these brilliant solutions to emergency situations. Social Security should have been temporary, but the designers neglected to include an exit strategy.

Don't I know it, man! The most ridiculous thing we have here in New York is rent control, which was implemented as a World War II rationing measure :rolleyes:

Now it's just royally screwed the whole economy here in ways that the city is just starting to recover from. Urban decay in the Bronx and other areas? You can lay the blame squarely on rent control. Landlords that suddenly, by government decree, started losing money on buildings they owned refused to put another dime to maintain their buildings, so the buildings quickly fell into disrepair, and the fact is decrepit buildings very quickly lead to an atmosphere of lawlessness.

And the main beneficiaries? NOT poor folks - most rent controlled apartments are owned by middle class to upper middle class or even rich folks. Even more galling, wealthy Manhattanites that OWN their own condo will often sublet the rent-controlled apartment for a profit :mad: (which is of course blatantly illegal but still common)

And of course these folks screamed bloody murder when politicians suggested discontinuing a freakin' World War II rationing measure. How DARE they? :rolleyes:

It's that sense of entitlement, man - Americans have it like no other people on Earth.
 
Originally posted by lmalave
Ok - you got it:
"New Economy Giving - Is It Really So New?"
http://www.insidegiving.com/ig2001-08-22g.html

So actually, the amount is $22 Billion. This is a critical article that tries to put the giving of the "New Philanthropists" in historical perspective with Carnegie, Mellon, Ford, Rockefeller, etc., and it's a website about philanthropy, so I would tend to think they're credible.

He gave 20billion to a foundation that I'm sure he has total control over... I pray that this was a real donation though. I can only hope that Bill never finds a need to dismantle this foundation. If I setup a foundation worth 30,000 and donated the yearly interest off of that - I guess I would have still donated 30,000, though all anyone would ever see of it is ~$900 a year.
I'm not sure thats right... I'm not sure what his yearly salary is, but he should be donating 5% to charity (Just a number I like) but then again, so should everyone else.... Microsoft included. The Foundation should be self-sustaining.

That aside, you're right, I concede the point. His foundation is giving a lot of money away, much more than a lot of people... a 'great man' though, still not sure.
 
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