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pedromcm.pm

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Mar 23, 2014
483
0
Porto, Portugal
So, sales numbers are in. Despite very limited supply and China not being in the initial rollout, Apple sold more iPhones than last year's opening weekend (that didn't have pre-orders).

These new devices are shaping to be extremely successful, and it is safe to say that every single of those costumers was already a smartphone user. While millions after millions are upgrading from an older iPhone, we all know that millions and millions are leaving their Android flagships behind.

These new iPhones really stepped up, even on the hardware department. Here is an article from Anandtech:

Preliminary results

There's a lot of data to be found, here. First off, on tasks related with real world usage the S805 (found on the LTE-A version of the s5) is already smoked. If we take the k1 out of the equation (it isn't used on phones or mass produced tablets, just niche products, mostly), most benchmarks show that even hardware Vs hardware (ignoring iOS advantages in performance), the a8 is ahead.

It is very important to say that Android still (and always will) offers options that Apple ignores/isn't able to produce: If you want an AMOLED display (looks like the recent Note 4 finally put AMOLED's flaws to sleep, even if quality Vs quality there isn't much difference for the casual user) to take advantage of its characteristics (awesome blacks, infinite contrast, lower power consumption) you must settle with Android. Pen? Android.

Of course, as of today, it seems like sales numbers from High end Android devices will diminish dramatically. Since Samsung was the only OEM making money above the red line and they are declining in sales and profits, together with Apple's recent step up, what will happen with newer Android flagships? Will OEMs focus more on low to mid range devices (chinese OEMs, Moto)? We know there is no profit to be made on those segments.

Will Windows Phone be pushed as a viable option due to sheer necessity of differentiation on those markets? After all, with the Android One initiative and Google attacking skins, there's no differentiator (they all use the same components).

Interesting times, indeed. There's 80 % of the market up for grabs, despite Android having 85 % Market Share. Funny times, they (OEMs) just won't be abler to sustain this situation.
 

spinedoc77

macrumors G4
Jun 11, 2009
10,594
4,379
I think it's awesome that the iPhone 6 is so wildly successful. This will fuel the fires of innovation with android vendors, and also windows, and whoever else is left. Many of android and windows hardware and software features are ahead of the game, so that will only put them that much farther ahead and benefit the consumers who choose them. Competition is always a good thing. I'm very excited to see what the new crop of android and windows devices will bring to the table, but I'm also VERY excited at this generation of android/windows devices.
 

The Game 161

macrumors Penryn
Dec 15, 2010
28,278
17,392
UK
IPhone stepping up is great to see and needed. It's a fantasy product so the comp should only go from strength to strength
 

jamesrick80

macrumors 68030
Sep 12, 2014
2,659
2,216
So, sales numbers are in. Despite very limited supply and China not being in the initial rollout, Apple sold more iPhones than last year's opening weekend (that didn't have pre-orders).

These new devices are shaping to be extremely successful, and it is safe to say that every single of those costumers was already a smartphone user. While millions after millions are upgrading from an older iPhone, we all know that millions and millions are leaving their Android flagships behind.

These new iPhones really stepped up, even on the hardware department. Here is an article from Anandtech:

Preliminary results

There's a lot of data to be found, here. First off, on tasks related with real world usage the S805 (found on the LTE-A version of the s5) is already smoked. If we take the k1 out of the equation (it isn't used on phones or mass produced tablets, just niche products, mostly), most benchmarks show that even hardware Vs hardware (ignoring iOS advantages in performance), the a8 is ahead.

It is very important to say that Android still (and always will) offers options that Apple ignores/isn't able to produce: If you want an AMOLED display (looks like the recent Note 4 finally put AMOLED's flaws to sleep, even if quality Vs quality there isn't much difference for the casual user) to take advantage of its characteristics (awesome blacks, infinite contrast, lower power consumption) you must settle with Android. Pen? Android.

Of course, as of today, it seems like sales numbers from High end Android devices will diminish dramatically. Since Samsung was the only OEM making money above the red line and they are declining in sales and profits, together with Apple's recent step up, what will happen with newer Android flagships? Will OEMs focus more on low to mid range devices (chinese OEMs, Moto)? We know there is no profit to be made on those segments.

Will Windows Phone be pushed as a viable option due to sheer necessity of differentiation on those markets? After all, with the Android One initiative and Google attacking skins, there's no differentiator (they all use the same components).

Interesting times, indeed. There's 80 % of the market up for grabs, despite Android having 85 % Market Share. Funny times, they (OEMs) just won't be abler to sustain this situation.

Article seems heavily bias and why did you post this here. Samsung users especially note users use their devices in many more ways than the general Apple user. Every knows Apple sells well so that's no biggy either. What will Samsung do? They will continue to produce the best displays, keep their devices running smooth, and innovating us with fresh ideas and creative ways to use our phones. ;)

Also the S5 LTE A almost performed equally in benchmarks as the iPhone 6 plus although a tadbit lower........nice to see that with a 805 snapdragon processor and seems like the new iPhones suck when it comes to physics.....
 
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skratch77

macrumors 65816
Mar 20, 2013
1,241
5
The exynos 64bit version of the note 4 blows the doors off the a8 and matches the k1 GPU and its pushing 2k res vs 1080p in the bench I saw.that's also using 32 bit is as android l is not out yet to take advantage of the 64 bit registers.

Snapdragon 808 and 810 (64bit)will be out by year end so android has no worries about CPU power next year
 

pedromcm.pm

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Mar 23, 2014
483
0
Porto, Portugal
I was just reading about the Note's 4 display and looks like Samsung, alone against everyone, made AMOLED go from a promising future but crappy reality to the best displays on the market.
Besides Apple, I never saw anyone doing something at that scale. It deserves a thumbs up.
Bu the future doesn't look so bright for their new products.

Personally, since it will take a while for me to justify a high end device (an iPhone), I'm more interested on the mid to low end. This Apple step up will surely create a cutthroat situation for OEMs: Succeed on the mid end or perish.

I believe in Moto, but their new devices looked like step backs. LG is making the same mistakes Samsung die and I don't like/enjoy/trust Chinese OEMs like Oppo, Huwaei, etc.

I just hope HTC and even Microsoft step up.
 

Oohara

macrumors 68040
Jun 28, 2012
3,037
2,390
What will be really interesting to see is what those test results will look like when the Note 4 is included :) Which is the device that will offer the most interesting comparison, as the S5 is now nearly half a year old and we know at this point how quickly tech evolves.

Strange to see btw that the iPhones are only on par with the Nexus 5 for the "3DMark 1.2 Unlimited - Overall" test and that they get completely wrecked in the "Physics" test.

I think what is giving Samsung the most trouble right now is that other Android OEMs are beginning to come more into focus. Especially LG has had a recent hit with the G3, striking right at the heart of Samsung's former solitary domain (phablet). So, I general I think we will see more and more productive competition on the Android side, offering ever better alternatives to the iPhone.
 

pedromcm.pm

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Mar 23, 2014
483
0
Porto, Portugal
Article seems a tadbit bias and why did you post this here. Samsung users especially note users use their devices in many more ways than the general Apple user. Every knows Apple sells well so that's no biggy either. What will Samsung do? They will continue to produce the best displays, keep their devices running smooth, and innovating us with fresh ideas and creative ways to use our phones. ;)

Also the S5 LTE A almost kept up equally as well as the plus although a tadbit lower........nice to see that with a 805 snapdragon processor.

If we ignore that their devices are the less smooth of flagships, and there isn't any innovation coming from there... Would they keep doing the same thing and keep the current decline they are in until they perish (of course it would take years and years and years (look at Sony!), but the decline is real.)?

I don't think so.

----------

What will be really interesting to see is what those test results will look like when the Note 4 is included :) Which is the device that will offer the most interesting comparison, as the S5 is now nearly half a year old and we know at this point how quickly tech evolves.

Strange to see btw that the iPhones are only on par with the Nexus 5 for the "3DMark 1.2 Unlimited - Overall" test and that they get completely wrecked in the "Physics" test.

I think what is giving Samsung the most trouble right now is that other Android OEMs are beginning to come more into focus. Especially LG has had a recent hit with the G3, striking right at the heart of Samsung's former solitary domain (phablet). So, I general I think we will see more and more productive competition on the Android side, offering ever better alternatives to the iPhone.

Are you making fun of me? The LTE-Advanced variation of the S5 already uses the S805, same as the best version of the note 4.

Those 2 benchmarks are very weird on iOS, as Anand mentioned a few months ago. Every single Apple chip and some others fall flat on those 2 tests. No one knows why.
 

jamesrick80

macrumors 68030
Sep 12, 2014
2,659
2,216
If we ignore that their devices are the less smooth of flagships, and there isn't any innovation coming from there... Would they keep doing the same thing and keep the current decline they are in until they perish (of course it would take years and years and years (look at Sony!), but the decline is real.)?

I don't think so.

----------



Are you making fun of me? The LTE-Advanced variation of the S5 already uses the S805, same as the best version of the note 4.

Those 2 benchmarks are very weird on iOS, as Anand mentioned a few months ago. Every single Apple chip and some others fall flat on those 2 tests. No one knows why.


I don't think their devices are less smooth than other flagships, if anything we have more options on our devices than other flagships.....I have had a lg G3, tested a m8, and nexus 5 and would not say they are smoother than Samsung flagships

----------

If we ignore that their devices are the less smooth of flagships, and there isn't any innovation coming from there... Would they keep doing the same thing and keep the current decline they are in until they perish (of course it would take years and years and years (look at Sony!), but the decline is real.)?

I don't think so.

----------



Are you making fun of me? The LTE-Advanced variation of the S5 already uses the S805, same as the best version of the note 4.

Those 2 benchmarks are very weird on iOS, as Anand mentioned a few months ago. Every single Apple chip and some others fall flat on those 2 tests. No one knows why.
The note 4 is clocked at 2.7 ghz, it is faster than the S5 variant.....do your research and we have the necessary ram to run our devices properly.....
 

Wrathwitch

macrumors 65816
Dec 4, 2009
1,303
55
Apple will always do well. However, I do believe that other than the highest end flagships of Android (which match in cost) will not be much affected (or is that effected) anyhow, for example, all of the Android flagships were similarly or identically priced the same as the new iOS devices, then there may be some issues. I was briefly tempted by the new iPhone 6+, However, paying pretty near $1000.00 for a phone off contract (to maintain legacy phone plan) is INSANE!! ($969.00 for 64GB) BEFORE TAXES and Applecare!!! ($1094.00 with taxes, Before Applecare)

I can't speak for other users, but for myself, not having to deal with iTunes, easy access to ringtones, the S Pen and how it seems to have been improved, as well as the ability to drag and drop files, music etc easily onto the device are things not to be lightly overlooked.

I think price and functionality will be the defining factors. Apple does not care to offer rebates, or reasonable prices to the average user, they have enough of a fan base that they don't have to at this time. Look at the 5C, everyone was hoping that it would be a more entry level item for people but they clearly stated that Apple doesn't make entry level devices. Good for them, but bad for those who don't have the kind of money to shell out 800.00+ for a cell phone. I mean HOLY CRAP my subsidized price for iP6+ (64GB because the greedy buggers knew that 32GB would be a lot of people's sweet spots) comes in at: $485.00 on a two year share plus plan (which if I priced the same as my legacy plan would cost me 128.00 per month (before taxes). My plan is: 5GB, 500 anytime mins, 5pm calling, 10 faves, unlimited text, caller ID, voicemail 3. I currently pay $67.80 taxes in.

So: $3471.00 (2 year subsidized contract incl tx) + $485.00 cost of subsidy = $3956.00 WOW!! (minus apple care)

Cost no subsidy: $1627.00 (2yr legacy incl tx)+ 1094.00 (tx incl, minus apple care)= $2721.00

Difference of $1235.00

Anyhow, forgive my rambling, but I think that the status quo will pretty well be maintained for the average user, especially those that had to get screwed by their carriers with new plans (at least in Canada) to even smell a subsidized phone with solid offerings in it.
 

Oohara

macrumors 68040
Jun 28, 2012
3,037
2,390
Are you making fun of me? The LTE-Advanced variation of the S5 already uses the S805, same as the best version of the note 4.

Right, my bad - I didn't see that they had also the LTE-A version in there. In any case though, surely the fairest comparison will be between the Note 4 and the iPhone 6, as those are the devices which have been in production the same length of time since the previous models were released?

What's more, the real decider for what happens with the overall competition on the market is what happens in the continued evolution of Android and iOS, where of course Android L and the first iOS 8 patch will be the really interesting things to follow. The spec battle is secondary and these flagships will always be on a very similar level in that area anyway.
 

pedromcm.pm

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Mar 23, 2014
483
0
Porto, Portugal
Rumour has it s5 and note 4 will have Android L on it by November/December too

Most OEMs are getting better at supporting their devices. I still can't digest that:

a) The exynos version of the s3 (international) never saw kitkat while the snapdragon s3 mini did;
b) My device (international s3 mini) never saw an update. Never. Still 4.1.2.

I won't ever buy another samsung device.
 

The Game 161

macrumors Penryn
Dec 15, 2010
28,278
17,392
UK
Most OEMs are getting better at supporting their devices. I still can't digest that:

a) The exynos version of the s3 (international) never saw kitkat while the snapdragon s3 mini did;
b) My device (international s3 mini) never saw an update. Never. Still 4.1.2.

I won't ever buy another samsung device.
That's fair enough.

My dad's note 8.0 just got the latest kitkat update recently. While been I've has for months.
 

skratch77

macrumors 65816
Mar 20, 2013
1,241
5
So, sales numbers are in. Despite very limited supply and China not being in the initial rollout, Apple sold more iPhones than last year's opening weekend (that didn't have pre-orders).

These new devices are shaping to be extremely successful, and it is safe to say that every single of those costumers was already a smartphone user. While millions after millions are upgrading from an older iPhone, we all know that millions and millions are leaving their Android flagships behind.

These new iPhones really stepped up, even on the hardware department. Here is an article from Anandtech:

Preliminary results

There's a lot of data to be found, here. First off, on tasks related with real world usage the S805 (found on the LTE-A version of the s5) is already smoked. If we take the k1 out of the equation (it isn't used on phones or mass produced tablets, just niche products, mostly), most benchmarks show that even hardware Vs hardware (ignoring iOS advantages in performance), the a8 is ahead.

It is very important to say that Android still (and always will) offers options that Apple ignores/isn't able to produce: If you want an AMOLED display (looks like the recent Note 4 finally put AMOLED's flaws to sleep, even if quality Vs quality there isn't much difference for the casual user) to take advantage of its characteristics (awesome blacks, infinite contrast, lower power consumption) you must settle with Android. Pen? Android.

Of course, as of today, it seems like sales numbers from High end Android devices will diminish dramatically. Since Samsung was the only OEM making money above the red line and they are declining in sales and profits, together with Apple's recent step up, what will happen with newer Android flagships? Will OEMs focus more on low to mid range devices (chinese OEMs, Moto)? We know there is no profit to be made on those segments.

Will Windows Phone be pushed as a viable option due to sheer necessity of differentiation on those markets? After all, with the Android One initiative and Google attacking skins, there's no differentiator (they all use the same components).

Interesting times, indeed. There's 80 % of the market up for grabs, despite Android having 85 % Market Share. Funny times, they (OEMs) just won't be abler to sustain this situation.

Here is the note 4 using the 64bit version exynos soc and running qhd keeping up with k1 running 1080p

Also the GPU and CPU in the 805 note 4 are clocked a lot faster then the LTE A gs5
 

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pedromcm.pm

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Mar 23, 2014
483
0
Porto, Portugal
Here is the note 4 using the 64bit version exynos soc and running qhd keeping up with k1 running 1080p

Also the GPU and CPU in the 805 note 4 are clocked a lot faster then the LTE A gs5

Antutu? Are you seriously throwing antutu at me? GTFO. And you can over clock those SoC as much as you want, it won't come even close to the a7 and a8 on CPU tasks.
 

skratch77

macrumors 65816
Mar 20, 2013
1,241
5
Antutu? Are you seriously throwing antutu at me? GTFO. And you can over clock those SoC as much as you want, it won't come even close to the a7 and a8 on CPU tasks.

The new 64 bit octo core is the highest performing soc out. I think it hit 5000 in geekbench also.

Go do some research before trying to bring up iPhone specs in here.

The octo core runs at 1.3 GHz and is using the new 64 bit instruction set like the a8 is

Its actually clocked slower then the new iphones lol

PS I used the bench above because you even admitted the k1 being the best GPU and the new exynos is matching it running double the resolution in the bench above.
 
Last edited:

pedromcm.pm

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Mar 23, 2014
483
0
Porto, Portugal
The new 64 bit octo core is the highest performing soc out. I think it hit 5000 in geekbench also.

Go do some research before trying to bring up iPhone specs in here.

The octo core runs at 1.3 GHz and is using the new 64 bit instruction set like the a8 is

Its actually clocked slower then the new iphones lol

What do any of those 4 sentences have anything to do with the others? I don't care about vaporware and what you think.

The one thing we know is that the note will use a s805. All reviewed devices with s805 don't stand a chance, and that's ignoring the iOS Vs Android factor and all it means (iOS has better apps, better devs, better tools, Android has Dalvik or Art, etc.).
 

skratch77

macrumors 65816
Mar 20, 2013
1,241
5
What do any of those 4 sentences have anything to do with the others? I don't care about vaporware and what you think.

The one thing we know is that the note will use a s805. All reviewed devices with s805 don't stand a chance, and that's ignoring the iOS Vs Android factor and all it means (iOS has better apps, better devs, better tools, Android has Dalvik or Art, etc.).

The international note 4 is using that soc and is not vaporware.the galaxy alpha is also using it also and the s805s are the last of the 32bit instruction set socs and s808 along with s810 will use the same big little as the exynos socs and are coming out by year end.you are the one that says android socs are done now with the a8 and the s805 in the us spec note 4 still beats it in most bench's... Going off memory it hit a 4000 geekbench run and that is still better then the a8.

The galaxy alpha will blow the doors off the a8 as its running the massive 8 core beast and only pushing a 720p display

Show me the reviewed devices that lost to the a8? The note 4 is not even out yet and on beta firmware and even the few leaked benches shows it doing just fine keeping up with the a8
 
Last edited:

Oohara

macrumors 68040
Jun 28, 2012
3,037
2,390
What do any of those 4 sentences have anything to do with the others? I don't care about vaporware and what you think.

The one thing we know is that the note will use a s805. All reviewed devices with s805 don't stand a chance, and that's ignoring the iOS Vs Android factor and all it means (iOS has better apps, better devs, better tools, Android has Dalvik or Art, etc.).

I bet deep down you realise that the Note 4 will beat the new iPhones in any benchmarks you can come up with, just like its screen proved superior in the Displaymate test.

But anyway that really doesn't matter. The bottom line is that the new iPhones will always be better for those who prefer iOS, and the Note 4 will be better for those who prefer Android. It doesn't matter which phone ends up on top in these technical tests, the margin is so small anyway.

So maybe it would be better for you to just drop this desperate campaign to prove that the iPhones are better in every single respect, despite what the facts tell us. All you will achieve by continuing is that people will stop taking you seriously altogether, and you might even put a few people off from buying iPhones in the process.

Android vs. iOS, that is the real battle here, as long as these 'flagship' specs remain so close. And there can never be a true, objective winner between those two. In the end, that choice is subjective and based on what we happen to like or dislike.
 

jamezr

macrumors G5
Aug 7, 2011
14,898
15,377
US
I bet deep down you realise that the Note 4 will beat the new iPhones in any benchmarks you can come up with, just like its screen proved superior in the Displaymate test.

But anyway that really doesn't matter. The bottom line is that the new iPhones will always be better for those who prefer iOS, and the Note 4 will be better for those who prefer Android. It doesn't matter which phone ends up on top in these technical tests, the margin is so small anyway.

So maybe it would be better for you to just drop this desperate campaign to prove that the iPhones are better in every single respect, despite what the facts tell us. All you will achieve by continuing is that people will stop taking you seriously altogether, and you might even put a few people off from buying iPhones in the process.

Android vs. iOS, that is the real battle here, as long as these 'flagship' specs remain so close. And there can never be a true, objective winner between those two. In the end, that choice is subjective and based on what we happen to like or dislike
.

^^^ very nicely said....^^^^
 

Cnasty

macrumors 68040
Jul 2, 2008
3,299
2,065
The bottom line is that the new iPhones will always be better for those who prefer iOS, and the Note 4 will be better for those who prefer Android. It doesn't matter which phone ends up on top in these technical tests, the margin is so small anyway.

Perfectly said.

I have been with Android for the last 4 years or so but every other device I own is Apple but have disliked their phones (size).

When they released the new bigger one I had to go for it as it is so easy in that ecosystem and enjoy iOS myself.

BUT the Note 4 is dead sexy but TW kills it for me.
 

Dragonmount

macrumors demi-god
Oct 20, 2011
12,485
10,211
Austin, TX
I think this generation of iPhones is the one that will get Android Silver going. I'm an Apple guy, admittedly, but i'm looking to Android Silver with great anticipation.
 

pedromcm.pm

macrumors 6502
Original poster
Mar 23, 2014
483
0
Porto, Portugal
Android vs. iOS, that is the real battle here, as long as these 'flagship' specs remain so close. And there can never be a true, objective winner between those two. In the end, that choice is subjective and based on what we happen to like or dislike.

Despite disagreeing with everything else, I agree with this.
 

The Game 161

macrumors Penryn
Dec 15, 2010
28,278
17,392
UK
I bet deep down you realise that the Note 4 will beat the new iPhones in any benchmarks you can come up with, just like its screen proved superior in the Displaymate test.

But anyway that really doesn't matter. The bottom line is that the new iPhones will always be better for those who prefer iOS, and the Note 4 will be better for those who prefer Android. It doesn't matter which phone ends up on top in these technical tests, the margin is so small anyway.

So maybe it would be better for you to just drop this desperate campaign to prove that the iPhones are better in every single respect, despite what the facts tell us. All you will achieve by continuing is that people will stop taking you seriously altogether, and you might even put a few people off from buying iPhones in the process.

Android vs. iOS, that is the real battle here, as long as these 'flagship' specs remain so close. And there can never be a true, objective winner between those two. In the end, that choice is subjective and based on what we happen to like or dislike.
Great post

Apple and Android fans

*group hug*
 
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