What's New in macOS High Sierra: APFS, Metal 2, Photos Improvements, Safari Autoplay Blocking and More

[huperniketes]

Will I be able to read-write an external HD with APFS on a Snow Leopard machine?

This is an interesting question that might affect me too. I often boot into target disk mode to move files to an older Mac, sometimes even one that's PowerPC for updating purposes. So yes, I'm curious to know what Mac OS versions will balk at reading an APFS drive.

No, unless someone comes out with a FuseFS driver or a user-client driver for APFS. Especially for PowerPC machines.

Will APFS mess upp things for 3rd party applications in the way that files are handled?

Yes if the application requires that the volume be case-insensitive. HFS+ is case-insensitive by default, but AFPS is not. I know Photoshop has issues with case-sensitive volumes. But in general, this is rarely an issue. I know someone who used case-sensitive HFS+ with tons of third-party stuff and only had problems with Photoshop and Steam, nothing else. And it's not hard for devs to fix this.

UnrealEngine 4 also has this issue.

Not only is it an easy fix for developers, the question is why would a team insist on making case-insensitive volumes a requirement? Especially for cross-platform apps!

Besides this minor issue, I don't think there could be other problems, but someone can correct me if I'm wrong.

The filesystem should be transparent to most apps, unless they need special integration with file or volume metadata (such as forks, Finder-specific data, etc.).

 

[SkankHunt42]

You appear to be confused. There is no High Sierra Beta. As a long-standing member of the Apple beta problem I am sort of amazed that you are unaware of this. The beta is "coming soon."

Did you somehow get your hands on the developer preview DP1? It's not intended or expected to be stable or performant, as is the nature of first release developer previews. It's certainly not something Apple intended for you to install on your only computer.

I installed the developer beta (high Sierra) on my MacBook 12. Honestly, I have found it to be incredibly stable. Mainly because there is so little difference between High Sierra and Sierra. It is honestly difficult to even spot any notable changes when using the OS day-to-day. Obviously there are some under-the-hood changes that one would not readily see, but in my opinion these changes are all over-blown marketing PR BS hype.

Honestly, Apple updates the OS to AFRS and people start freaking out saying the Mac is great again. We deserve far more than a 'Snow Leopard type' toc update on the Mac after being neglected for so long. the pace of innovation at this company has slowed way, way down.

 

[appleofmyibook]

Can you expand upon this? And if it is clearly better, why do you think Apple didn't adopt it after all? They were working on support for a long time.

Personally, I'm disappointed they aren't going for Microsoft's jugular with better built-in productivity tools.

I completely agree with you on this. I don’t want to use Microsoft’s crappy apps anymore but Keynote and Numbers are just not up to scratch yet. Pages is great and I have no complaints there. I’m surprised that they haven’t improved the experience and functionality.

 

[Dj64Mk7]

Yep. Provide the infrastructure. The supporting logic. The APIs. Let developers and users figure out how to employ them to solve their wants and needs.

Hence, slots. AppleScript. Automator.

But Steve hated slots.

What is slots?

 

[flat five]

Yea I completely see your point and I am sure macOS works very well for a large number of people. I guess I just was hoping for something a little more substantial in my eyes. I guess it will remain as is for the foreseeable future until they make changes to how a desktop environment operates.

they did though
especially if you use a multi-computer workflow (i.e.- desktop & laptop )

tagging and syncing features from the last few versions are super sweet.

i no longer transfer files, no longer backup files, no longer have crapton of versions of same files.. i barely even save files anymore
(and also, i've lost zero work over the past few year.. zilch.. macOS autosaving is great.. if your devs aren't tying into yet, beg them to do so.)


it's all being done by the OS now.. i swear it feels like i have my own little personal secretary for organizing my computer work. : )

 

[mudflap]

And I thought it was relying on quantum entanglement....

I'd be careful with that quantum entanglement stuff. Wouldn't want to cause a resonance cascade.

 

[DNichter]

they did though
especially if you use a multi-computer workflow (i.e.- desktop & laptop )

tagging and syncing features from the last few versions are super sweet.

i no longer transfer files, no longer backup files, no longer have crapton of versions of same files.. i barely even save files anymore
(and also, i've lost zero work over the past few year.. zilch.. macOS autosaving is great.. if your devs aren't tying into yet, beg them to do so.)


it's all being done by the OS now.. i swear it feels like i have my own little personal secretary for organizing my computer work. : )

I’m glad there are people happy with the new features, but I just don’t see the advantages. Or maybe I am just naive to it? Wasn’t auto saving around Fromm Lion?

 

[Markoth]

I doubt Apple will support ZFS as non-core technology.

There are issues with CDDL licensing and unless they had an agreement with Oracle about dual licensing or some sort of agreement, I doubt Apple would support it. That ship sailed long ago.

I vaguely remember something about patent issues with Netapp? Don't remember what became of that.

Then of course out of the box ZFS does not support case-insensitive modes do they? APFS has support for both case sensitive and insensitivity.

Apple will continue adding features that Apple feels are important for the future, but since Apple is out of the server market (except for some niche things)... I don't see Apple officially supporting the openzfs stuff... that will remain the domain of the openzfs community.
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I did not realize how annoying "autoplay" was until I had to spend a few weeks being very careful on usage when I was working through tethering on my phone.... a few autoplay things just kept of blowing the data that I wanted to conserve for important work issues.... I used a lot of 4 letter words during that month.

ZFS has support for case-insensitivity, it's just not enabled by default. Really, besides encryption support, most features in modern filesystems are copies of ideas pioneered in ZFS. That one particular one isn't, but ZFS has always been the "fun-land" for filesystem people. You can bet they would have thought of it.

 

[Markoth]

Yes if the application requires that the volume be case-insensitive. HFS+ is case-insensitive by default, but AFPS is not. I know Photoshop has issues with case-sensitive volumes. But in general, this is rarely an issue. I know someone who used case-sensitive HFS+ with tons of third-party stuff and only had problems with Photoshop and Steam, nothing else. And it's not hard for devs to fix this.

Besides this minor issue, I don't think there could be other problems, but someone can correct me if I'm wrong.
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That's not really what the pros wanted. They wanted to be able to upgrade it, or at least repair it. A tower form factor is nicer for various reasons. Also, some don't care about GPUs and would rather have a dual-CPU-socket motherboard so it can pack more CPU power.

This is incorrect. A couple minor versions of macOS earlier ago, Apple added Case-insensitive APFS support. Think it may have been 10.12.4.

 

[flat five]

I’m glad there are people happy with the new features, but I just don’t see the advantages.

yeah, i don't see many people too excited about the desktop syncing nor tagging.. for people like me though, it's a game changer (people being those who find file mgmt to be completely boring and tedious -- i.e.- totally unorganized types )

Wasn’t auto saving around Fromm Lion?

yeah. 10.7 along with versions (another sweet thing that not many people seem to talk about).

autosaving is better now.. you don't feel it happening like you used to (though this could also be a result of something my software developers have done on their end)..

i also meant by that -- the OS just doesn't crash anymore. ever (at least, in my experience).. i don't think i've had a panic in the past couple of years.

---------
don't get me wrong. i'm not trying to say something like "ur wrong and i like such-and-such so you should too"..
just saying that at least some people see macOS as much better than OS X due to new features/ways of working..
(using those names for the time reference.. i completely get it that they're the same thing )

------

what kind of features are you interested in seeing?

my biggest one would be some sort of paradigm shift in the way we communicate with the OS/software.. mouse/keyboard/flat panel etc... these lead to the largest slowdown in productivity so i'd like to see improvements in these areas.. likely requiring new hardware types but also an OS designed to accommodate

 

[RichTeer]

I doubt Apple will support ZFS as non-core technology.

Perhaps, but there are precedents: FAT, (read-only?) NTFS support, for example.

There are issues with CDDL licensing and unless they had an agreement with Oracle about dual licensing or some sort of agreement, I doubt Apple would support it. That ship sailed long ago.

Red herring: CDDL is not incompatible with MacOS' license. For evidence, I point to Dtrace, which has been part of MacOS for years (and uses the same CDDL license).

I vaguely remember something about patent issues with Netapp? Don't remember what became of that.

I believe they've been settled.

Then of course out of the box ZFS does not support case-insensitive modes do they? APFS has support for both case sensitive and insensitivity.

As does ZFS. Franly, I think it's astonishing that people use non-casesensitive file systems or (much worse) write software that refuses to install on case-sensitive file systems.

Apple will continue adding features that Apple feels are important for the future, but since Apple is out of the server market (except for some niche things)... I don't see Apple officially supporting the openzfs stuff... that will remain the domain of the openzfs community.[/QUOTE]

Sadly, I think your latter point is true. But I will argue quite strongly that ZFS is NOT a server-only file system.It's data integrity features are just as, if not more, important on a desktop (hence why I'm pleased that the iMac Pro will finally ship with ECC RAM).

 

[MacKyle]

Apple named its next-generation version of the Mac operating system High Sierra because it's designed to improve macOS Sierra through several major under-the-hood updates. While most of what's in High Sierra isn't outwardly visible, there are some refinements to existing features and apps like Safari, Photos, Siri, FaceTime, and more.

We went hands-on with the High Sierra beta to give MacRumors readers a quick idea of what changes and improvements to expect when the software comes out this fall. Check out the video below to see what's new.

Subscribe to the MacRumors YouTube channel for more videos.​

Some of the biggest app changes are in Photos, which has a persistent side bar, editing tools for Curves and Selective Color, new filters, options for editing Live Photos, new Memories categories, improved third-party app integration, and improvements to facial recognition, with the People album now synced across all of your devices.

Safari is gaining a new autoplay blocking feature for videos, Intelligent Tracking Prevention to protect your privacy, and options for customizing your browsing experience site-by-site, while Mail improvements mean your messages take up 35 percent less storage space.

Siri has a more natural voice, just like on iOS 11, and can answer more music-related queries. iCloud Drive file sharing has been added, and in High Sierra and iOS 11, all of your iMessage conversations are saved in iCloud, saving more storage space.

When installing High Sierra, it will convert to a new, more modern file system called Apple File System or APFS. APFS is safe, secure, and optimized for modern storage systems like solid-state drives. Features like native encryption, crash protection, and safe document saves are built in, plus it is ultra responsive and will bring performance enhancements to Mac.

APFS is accompanied by High Efficiency Video Encoding (HEVC) which introduces much better video compression compared to H.264 without sacrificing quality. The other major under-the-hood update is Metal 2, which will bring smoother animations to macOS and will provide developers with tools to create incredible apps and games.

Metal 2 includes support for machine learning, external GPUs, and VR content creation, with Apple even providing an external GPU development kit for developers so they can get their apps ready for eGPU support that's coming to consumers this fall. Apple is also working with Valve, Unity, and Unreal to bring VR creation tools to the Mac.

macOS High Sierra will run on all Macs that are capable of running macOS Sierra. For a more detailed overview of what's included in the update, make sure to check out our macOS High Sierra roundup.

Article Link: What's New in macOS High Sierra: APFS, Metal 2, Photos Improvements, Safari Autoplay Blocking and More

Did Apple improve Mail at all? You know, more features for professional use, integration with Calendar, less crashing, etc.

 

[sudo1996]

This is incorrect. A couple minor versions of macOS earlier ago, Apple added Case-insensitive APFS support. Think it may have been 10.12.4.

Oh, got it. I was looking at an old report.

 

[flat five]

I think they are expecting a Windows 8 moment - lots of changes - lots of excitement.

Users often forget that the "under the hood" improvements might not be exciting on release because "they don't see them", but then when some developer takes advantage -- they heap the praise on the 3rd party -- not realize that the "under the hood" changes made it possible within a budget that allowed it to come to market.

The only thing I could see really as a "user" improvement is for the Apple devices to work as they are independently, but also work well together as some sort of mesh operating system allowing something like iPad Pro and Mac to work as they are one system..... when paired.

funnily enough, something along those lines which as impacted me the most in the past year or two... has been something microsoft did.. they open sourced .NET so we now have grasshopper (http://www.grasshopper3d.com) on mac..
granted, the 3rd party devs (McNeel / d.Rutton) do deserve praise for what they've created (on windows).. but it's mostly thanks to microsoft for it being portable to macOS.

 

[Feenician]

What is slots?

As far as I can tell it’s the fantasy that small, single/small purpose programs or systems that can be interconnected are suitable for general use - and general users - computing. The low level of Unices work that way but if UNIX has proven anything over the years it’s that its nearly infinitely flexible but almost equally as unusable by “normal”* people. The main current embodiment are REST/JSON APIs, the type that power much of the systems we connect to the web or use in our homes (think apps and home automation). The thing about APIs is that the clue is in the name; Application PROGRAMMER Interface.

TL;dr version is that it’s the complete inability for certain technical types to discern want from a computer and how they interact with it.

*normal here is not meant as an insult. Just as people who have no interest or affinity for systems of these kinds.

 

[sudo1996]

Will APFS mess upp things for 3rd party applications in the way that files are handled?

I replied earlier saying it could due to case sensitivity, but I was wrong. They removed the case sensitivity in one of the minor versions. Thanks to Markoth for pointing it out.

 

[huperniketes]

What is slots?

Sorry. That does look somewhat vague now. Especially since I meant hardware. And there's been a few types.

 

[SubaruWRC]

So, I started a new backup of 6GB this morning around 7AM. It is now 6PM and is still going. The status stayed on "2 hours remaining" for 4 hours, and has been on "Almost an hour remaining" for about 2 hours. This time estimate has always been squirrely, but it's ridiculous for this variability. If it would take only the 2 hours, that's one thing. But 11 and still going?

Sorry to say, but Time Machine is for crap. I could walk the bits the 8 feet between my Mac and NAS faster than this.

See if this thread helps your issue:
https://apple.stackexchange.com/que...ne-ridiculously-slow-after-el-capitan-upgrade

In addition, make sure you try disabling your anti-virus software temporarily during testing, if you have any installed, or at least exclude the TM backup drive.
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That has nothing to do with the filesystem, and everything to do with the filesystem driver. Any filesystem can be made to support TRIM, on any SSD. It's up to Apple whether or not they want to enable it by default.

Thank you both for letting me know about this! I've replaced multiple magnetic hard drives in our Mac's (desktop and laptops) with OWC SSD's and never knew I had to manually enable TRIM. The performance of these SSD's started out amazing but has been degrading over the years, now I know why!

 

[Markoth]

Thank you both for letting me know about this! I've replaced multiple magnetic hard drives in our Mac's (desktop and laptops) with OWC SSD's and never knew I had to manually enable TRIM. The performance of these SSD's started out amazing but has been degrading over the years, now I know why!

Be somewhat careful though. It's disabled by default because some SSDs are known to handle the TRIM command inappropriately, and damage their own data. The only manufacturer I recall having this issue was Samsung, but it's still something to research.

 

[SubaruWRC]

Be somewhat careful though. It's disabled by default because some SSDs are known to handle the TRIM command inappropriately, and damage their own data. The only manufacturer I recall having this issue was Samsung, but it's still something to research.

Understood, I researched this as well and also saw that only a handful of older SSD's were of concern. It turns out the Linux kernel actually contains a blacklist of SSD's known to not work properly with TRIM, so that's good to keep in the back pocket. I enabled TRIM this morning on my OWC SSD's and have been pounding on them pretty good all day, so we'll see, so far so good. Replacing all of my Mac magnetic disks with SSD's has been a godsend in performance and power consumption

 

[Weaselboy]

Understood, I researched this as well and also saw that only a handful of older SSD's were of concern. It turns out the Linux kernel actually contains a blacklist of SSD's known to not work properly with TRIM, so that's good to keep in the back pocket.

That was only because of a bug in Linux and never had anything to do with macOS, then or now. If you are on macOS, that list means nothing.

 

[SubaruWRC]

That was only because of a bug in Linux and never had anything to do with macOS, then or now. If you are on macOS, that list means nothing.

Good to know.

 

[lec0rsaire]

With this eGPU stuff, are we going to be able to connect eGPUs to drive displays? Because it just looks like they're only supporting them for computation purposes, e.g. machine learning.

Yes, from what I believe it will not be able to drive the internal display of a MacBook Pro for example, but it will be able to drive external displays. Pretty much whatever displays are supported by the GPU in the enclosure.

 

[sudo1996]

Yes, from what I believe it will not be able to drive the internal display of a MacBook Pro for example, but it will be able to drive external displays. Pretty much whatever displays are supported by the GPU in the enclosure.

Oh, then that's what I'm looking for. I want to dock my laptop and not have its integrated graphics driving the monitor. Cause otherwise, I have to crank up the fans to prevent overheating, and I sometimes get graphical glitches.

 

[eric_n_dfw]

I'm just spitballing here, but since Photos isn't cutting it: what if you created a new Google account that you both share, and use Google Photos on each of your phones, point it to that shared account, and sync your camera rolls. It should merge all your photos, I'd think.

I would also imagine that Dropbox could accomplish the same thing. I've heard that Google tends to recompress JPEGs (maybe someone can confirm this), whereas I don't believe Dropbox does. And of course there may be another cloud service I'm not thinking of that you could use the same way instead.

I keep my Lightroom catalog in a Dropbox (Pro) shared folder but had too many problems with 2 different machines accidentally opening that catalog simultaneously. Doing so is like Ghostbusters crossing the streams... bad things.

I've not looked at Google photos too much, is there a good desktop (even if it's browser based) app for doing edits, facial recognition, EXIF data manipulation, Geotagging, etc?

Photos + shared Apple ID seems to be the only thing that is going to work.